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Ten manliest firearms

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  • #16
    I think the point was manly, meaning big & bad. I think that's why they were excluded. Not saying that a .25 or a .22 isn't deadly or great for concealment.

    It's kind of like saying list the '70s muscle cars. Now no one can say a Datsun 240Z wasn't fast. Hell, it could beat some muscle cars. But it wasn't a muscle car. (BTW, for you young pups out there: Datsun was the original name of Nissan. Not bought or merged, just a name change )
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    • #17
      Hell, this article was designed to do one thing. Get page hits from forums and social networking sites.
      Some Kind of Commando Leader

      "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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      • #18
        Notes

        A couple of notes;

        1) first to CHUCKY, thank you for noticing my 100th post, I thought it was way cool when I hit that mark.

        2) SecTrainer, if you were in jest, or not, I will say that while not the manliest caliber, the venerable .22 long rifle cartridge is my all time favorite bullet. It was a rifle of that caliber that was my first gun. It is a small, but potent round, that indeed has killed many animals, including the two legged kind.

        But I think of it as a great training round, a mild report when fired, barely any felt recoil, and yet produces true results. I think it is the ultimate caliber to start someone shooting with, as I will do with my son.

        So, as the ultimate fun, training, small game hunting round, I nominate the .22 long rifle cartridge as the best out there.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by bpdblue View Post
          A couple of notes;

          1) first to CHUCKY, thank you for noticing my 100th post, I thought it was way cool when I hit that mark.

          2) SecTrainer, if you were in jest, or not, I will say that while not the manliest caliber, the venerable .22 long rifle cartridge is my all time favorite bullet. It was a rifle of that caliber that was my first gun. It is a small, but potent round, that indeed has killed many animals, including the two legged kind.

          But I think of it as a great training round, a mild report when fired, barely any felt recoil, and yet produces true results. I think it is the ultimate caliber to start someone shooting with, as I will do with my son.

          So, as the ultimate fun, training, small game hunting round, I nominate the .22 long rifle cartridge as the best out there.
          Half in jest. Agree with .22 LR as ideal training round, but perhaps not the way you mean it. I mean it's ideal as a training round IF you're going to carry smaller calibers and IF you are trained by someone skilled in teaching you how to use them to reliably kill a human adversary. People who are properly trained in this skill will feel quite comfortable carrying nothing bigger than a .25 or .32 for CCW under almost any circumstances. I'd have no qualms riding a NY subway anywhere in that city with mine. If I pull my weapon to shoot someone, I will do so in order to kill them and you don't need a big bullet to do that if you put bullets where they should go. Threaten me "up close and personal" (7 yards in), and I'm going to ventilate your neck and/or your head for you immediately. Anyone who can't do that rapidly and reliably at close range, and has not been rigorously trained in making the instant decision to do so (which is more important than anything else) has no business carrying a weapon of any caliber.

          I have no intention of "knocking people down" with a bullet in what I call "CCW situations". The key here is that there's a huge difference between thinking of firearms as "kinetic energy dispensers" and thinking of them as devices that are designed to put bullets where you intend for them to go. That is how I was taught to think about guns when I was trained by a former intelligence operative. So, I don't give a rat's tukus about kinetic energy. If I have to pick a buddy in a fight, I'll pick the one who can put the pills where they should go, not the one with the biggest <whatever>.

          However, if you are going to carry larger calibers, then the smaller caliber is NOT ideal as a "cheap" training round, in my opinion, because you will learn a lot of wrong things from shooting them, the techniques are quite different from those used with larger calibers and you'll still need to put a lot of your "carry" rounds through the tube anyway if you hope to be any good with the gun.

          My advice is to train with what you carry, even if it costs more and kicks harder. And, whatever you carry, constantly practice the mental willingness to use it. This takes reflex conditioning, vivid mental imagery and, ideally, lots and lots of simulated situations in training. Practice thinking: "If this guy coming toward me pulled a gun I would...<WHAT?>", "What if the guy selling popcorn in the theater suddenly went berzerk...." or "If the guy in the car next to me started shooting...", etc.

          Incidentally, one of the nice things about my li'l Bobcat and my Tomcat (sweet babies) is that you can't even see them in my hand until it's too late (or if you do see something you might think it's my wallet that I'm handing you, but never a gun). This is very nice because I never did plan to show you my gun like some little kid showing his willy to the girl next door. Nor did I plan to scare you with it, or use it to enforce verbal "orders" like "YOU'D BETTER GET OUTA HERE!", or "DROP YOUR GUN!", "FREEZE!" and all that crap. And, I won't get into a "Mexican standoff" with you either. I'm not Mexican.

          What I plan to do with the gun I carry concealed, if I pull it (like my wallet) or even if I fire it right through my coat, is to SHOOT you with it and repeat that process as often as necessary, because that's the only way I stay inside your decision cycle. I've already identified you as someone intending serious harm to me or mine. That's all the information I need. I'm not going to "gather more information". By the time I find out that a gun doesn't scare you because you're wigged out, that you won't obey my "orders" because you don't even speak English, or whatever the "additional facts" might be, I've lost any advantage I ever had....and you've shot me, which was not the scenario I had in mind. I'm not going to give you the first shot if I can help it. (Lots of guys think they need to cross this threshold so that they have "permission" to "fire back"...the ultimate in stinkin' thinkin'.) Split seconds lost can get the wrong guy killed.
          Last edited by SecTrainer; 11-11-2007, 02:35 AM.
          "Every betrayal begins with trust." - Brian Jacques

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          • #20
            SecTrainer that was a marvelous post. Two would-be thugs were shot and killed by Deputy US Marshals when they tried to hold up the deputies. No talk, just action as you recommended. They reached for their wallets and came out with S&W 66s. Two shots each and two "things" dispatched.
            Yours words were wise counsel we should all strive to emulate.
            We should all have a plan just as two Deputies did when two thugs tried to take a drug king-pin from them after a hospital run in Roanoke a few years back. The female Deputy distracted the thugs by screaming at the top of her lungs. They looked at her and her male partner drew his 66 and killed them both instantly.
            Enjoy the day,
            Bill

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            • #21
              Geez...

              Sec...by 'manly' they mean intimidating or, as stated, big and bad. For example, Shaft or Harry Callahan or John Wayne woul dnot be caught dead carrying a .22 or some other seemingly anemic caliber. .44 MAgs, .454 Cassull, etc. These are considered manly guns. I too appreciate the smaller guns. When I do bodyguard work, where concealed is allowed, my partner carries his duty pistol in a shoulder rig and a .25 raven in his jacket pocket...

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              • #22
                Maybe I was miss understood?

                SecTrainer, when I mentioned the .22 as a good training round, I was talking about an introduction round into (target) shooting for a 10 year old.

                As for a carry round for me, I usually carry either .38+p (in my 2 1/2" S&W mod 66), .357, or .45 acp rounds (in weapons suited to those rounds) when I am not working.

                The rounds I used in police work started with a .357 (in my police reserve days, and the beginning regular police career), which at the time I was able to carry my 6" S&W mod 28, then we went to H&K p7's (with my choosing the m13, one of which I bought), and then we went to the H&K usp .40, which I carried on duty until my retirement.

                So I understand the difference of the use of the rimfire round vs. a man stopper round quite well.

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