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  • rekaepa
    replied
    Originally posted by Sentinel27 View Post

    As far as I'm concerned, ANY job with no use of force tools is observe and report only, no matter what job description says. If they want you to do actual enforcement, then a vest + UoF option are a MUST. People will fight/stab/shoot you over absolutely nothing these days. And as always, look for something better in the meantime.
    I absolutely agree. We were dealing with drug dealers, mentally ill persons who may or not be on meds..or off them, a robbery, fights. I know the deal with dispatch only sending guys out unless a man is dead dying or injured. The observing was easy but the reporting not so much. I used to laugh when id see a patrol guard with an mdt or a phone with something like silvertrac but now i can see how naive i was. 3 forms just cause i asked a loitere to leave..

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  • rekaepa
    replied
    Hey everyone i apologize for being M.I.A..
    things have changed since my post.

    i quit the company after my former manager laughed at all of my safety concerns which was the last straw. A fellow guard was hit in the jaw with a glass bottle and he still insisted on keeping oc spray conceled on our person. Although i have the license for it B.s.i.s would flip if i had a use of force incident when the post clearly saus it is an unarmed gig. He mentioned that he had the same situation go down in san diego for a different post and that it will die down. It did not and 6 people were fired or had quit in the month i was there. I returned to my previous company in the same city but with far better management and my pay only took a 25 cent hit so im at 13.75.
    I think im better suited as an leo and will work towards that goal.
    at least leos have powers to act (with sound judgement of course)
    Anyway i appreciate all of the insight and i wish you all a quiet shift.

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  • Consolewatcher
    replied
    Originally posted by Sentinel27 View Post

    Agree 100%. I don't understand companies/sites that are "hands-off" yet they still want you to confront trespassers and the like. They don't seem to understand that even if you have no intention of arresting someone or putting your hands on them, they might still try to put hands on YOU. That's where DEFENSIVE tools come into play. I actually don't think that security should be arresting people or carrying all the same tools as the police, but you have to be able to protect yourself. Hell, you can be the target of violence even while just "observing and reporting". Another thing that irks me is when sites don't issue tools because they want "friendly" looking security staff. Might as well issue them with smiley face t-shirts and baskets of lollipops then.
    Yup, even pure "observe and report" can put a guard at risk of physical harm. Many of the security assaults I've seen were either because the guard accidentally came across someone committing a crime. Clients don't understand that even if the guard intends to simply walk/run away from the scene and call the police, there is a decent change the suspect might assault him to delay (or prevent) him doing that. Also, some of the environments put the guard at the same risk of anyone else working alone in the same environment. For example, working alone at 2am in the bad part of town is a dangerous situation, regardless of whether you're a security guard or pizza delivery person. For that reason, I think that any employee (security of otherwise) working in a dangerous environment should be able to carry defensive tools.

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  • Sentinel27
    replied
    Originally posted by Consolewatcher View Post

    I agree. Part of the problem is that in some places guards aren't provided certain equipment because "they're not the police", yet the guards are expected to do things that are usually handled by the police, and not by "civilians". Companies need to stop trying to straddle the line; either adapt a "hands-off, no confrontation" policy or properly equip their guards.

    Also, I think that if you are not armed with a firearm that you should always give a person an option to "avoid" being arrested/detained For example, "leave or I'll arrest you..", "stop committing that illegal act or I'll arrest you.." "give me back that property and don't ever come back or I'll arrest you..". That way the person who is wanted by the police, already has two "strikes", etc. will feel it's a better idea to leave instead of doing something crazy or stupid to avoid arrest and have the police take them into custody.
    Agree 100%. I don't understand companies/sites that are "hands-off" yet they still want you to confront trespassers and the like. They don't seem to understand that even if you have no intention of arresting someone or putting your hands on them, they might still try to put hands on YOU. That's where DEFENSIVE tools come into play. I actually don't think that security should be arresting people or carrying all the same tools as the police, but you have to be able to protect yourself. Hell, you can be the target of violence even while just "observing and reporting". Another thing that irks me is when sites don't issue tools because they want "friendly" looking security staff. Might as well issue them with smiley face t-shirts and baskets of lollipops then.
    Last edited by Sentinel27; 12-23-2017, 08:28 PM.

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  • Consolewatcher
    replied
    Originally posted by Sentinel27 View Post

    As far as I'm concerned, ANY job with no use of force tools is observe and report only, no matter what job description says. If they want you to do actual enforcement, then a vest + UoF option are a MUST. People will fight/stab/shoot you over absolutely nothing these days. And as always, look for something better in the meantime.
    I agree. Part of the problem is that in some places guards aren't provided certain equipment because "they're not the police", yet the guards are expected to do things that are usually handled by the police, and not by "civilians". Companies need to stop trying to straddle the line; either adapt a "hands-off, no confrontation" policy or properly equip their guards.

    Also, I think that if you are not armed with a firearm that you should always give a person an option to "avoid" being arrested/detained For example, "leave or I'll arrest you..", "stop committing that illegal act or I'll arrest you.." "give me back that property and don't ever come back or I'll arrest you..". That way the person who is wanted by the police, already has two "strikes", etc. will feel it's a better idea to leave instead of doing something crazy or stupid to avoid arrest and have the police take them into custody.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sentinel27
    replied
    Originally posted by rekaepa View Post
    Greetings! New to the site. I've been doing security for 11 months and recently changed employer. it's a patrol job, unarmed, solo, no gear, in the city of pomona for all of the "quikemarts".
    i don't know if maybe im in the minority here but i feel like this is too dangerous. pays 14 an hour. hostile homeless people and gangbangers and all i got is a pen and note pad and phone
    would you walk from this?
    I need answers.
    thanks in advance.
    I hope this is in the right section
    As far as I'm concerned, ANY job with no use of force tools is observe and report only, no matter what job description says. If they want you to do actual enforcement, then a vest + UoF option are a MUST. People will fight/stab/shoot you over absolutely nothing these days. And as always, look for something better in the meantime.
    Last edited by Sentinel27; 12-23-2017, 03:42 PM.

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  • ColePhelps1247
    replied
    No way, no how. Had a guy come work at the post office who came from a similar post. Low pay, dangerous area. I had worked for that company, so I know how much they don't care

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  • TOII
    replied
    One thing to keep in mind is that you may be liable for your actions...or inactions in a given circumstance.

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  • TOII
    replied
    Originally posted by Ingio Montoya View Post
    I know this has already been quoted but autocorrect butchered what I was trying to say and I need to fix it.

    No. A brawl in the parking lot shouldn't be a judgment call it should be an automatic call to the police.

    I've worked for companies who won't let you call the cops before and what ends up happening is you end backed up against a fence with nowhere to run and one hand on your gun with some homeless crackhead telling you he is going to kill you with an axe and you're answering b******* questions from dispatch like "The police want to know if any weapons were involved or mentioned".

    Where I'm at now there are certain crimes I don't have to ask anybody before I call the police. If I ask a trespasser to leave one time and he doesn't I call the cops. Anytime I find an open door when doing a building check I call the police. Believe me it works much better then going through a dispatcher who doesn't give a damn because HE'S not in danger and you interrupted his lunch.
    If you didn't mention the axe to the dispatcher, you should have. 911 will need that info, and honestly you want them to have it. It would change the priority of the call. And I know Pomona. It is a gang infested area. I would not work that post.

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  • PhantomX0990
    replied
    Everything considered.

    Learn to duck.

    Leave a comment:


  • Squid
    replied
    sounds bad to me. LA county is gangbanger central, period.

    I'm guessing the "loiterers" aren't just harmless smelly bums or bored uppermiddle class teenie boppers.

    Sounds like a typical "set up to fail" gig. Even that Verbal Judo guru would fail once the gangbangers quickly figure out he has no real power.

    Leave a comment:


  • PhantomX0990
    replied
    To add on to what the others said, you're just a pair of eyes in a flashy car at this point.

    It's not dangerous unless you make it so, by getting into situations you shouldn't be.

    Leave a comment:


  • Condo Guard
    replied
    That's why you have to know your company's policies. Another example would be retail security - a lot of places the security for the facility is not responsible for loss prevention - that's up to each shop. If there is a disturbance in the common area or clear threat to patron's safety, then the facility security officers would act.

    Calling PD is such a complicated thing anymore that I'm on the fence. On the one hand, I've worked for companies that drill in you to call the police for every little thing; you learn really quick what PD will actually respond to in a decent amount of time. In the case of the brawl, I can tell you that one of my supervisors would have done nothing except observe and report if he thought it was "mutual combat" and no bystanders were in danger.

    As Console noted, I can see the point that if the merchant knows of an active situation and doesn't call PD, he shouldn't expect you (the underpaid, unarmed S/O) to make that call unless he can't for some reason.
    Last edited by Condo Guard; 05-08-2017, 02:44 PM.

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  • Consolewatcher
    replied
    Originally posted by Ingio Montoya View Post
    No. A brawl in the parking lot shouldn't be a judgment call it should be an automatic cal tol the police.

    I'very worked for companies who won't let you call the cops either and what ends up happening is you end backed up against a fence with nowhere to run and one hand on your gun whith some homeless crackhead telling you he is going to kill you with an axe and you're answering b******* questions from dispatch like "The police want to know if any weapons were involved or mentioned".

    Where I'm at now there are certain crimes I don't have to ask anybody call the boys ask a trespasser to leave one time if he doesn't I call the cops. Anytime I find an open door when doing a building I call the police. Believe me it works much better then going through a dispatcher who doesn't give a damn because he's not in danger and you interrupted his lunch.
    It's not your property, it belongs to the client and it's up to them and your company's supervisors if the police are called or not. There are various reasons why they might choose not to call the police and if they are willing to accept the consequences of not having them called that's their choice to make. Of course, as I mentioned earlier, there are exceptions such as when your safety is in danger.

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  • Ingio Montoya
    replied
    I know this has already been quoted but autocorrect butchered what I was trying to say and I need to fix it.

    No. A brawl in the parking lot shouldn't be a judgment call it should be an automatic call to the police.

    I've worked for companies who won't let you call the cops before and what ends up happening is you end backed up against a fence with nowhere to run and one hand on your gun with some homeless crackhead telling you he is going to kill you with an axe and you're answering b******* questions from dispatch like "The police want to know if any weapons were involved or mentioned".

    Where I'm at now there are certain crimes I don't have to ask anybody before I call the police. If I ask a trespasser to leave one time and he doesn't I call the cops. Anytime I find an open door when doing a building check I call the police. Believe me it works much better then going through a dispatcher who doesn't give a damn because HE'S not in danger and you interrupted his lunch.
    Last edited by Ingio Montoya; 05-08-2017, 02:21 PM. Reason: Damn autocorrect

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