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  • Bill Warnock
    replied
    Originally posted by scops8273
    I have experienced that as well. I can see that happening to a security officer. I see allot more companies working with security more and more. As long as we can put forth that professionalism then I think we should be fine. We have to keep reporting things like that. Just keep putting things like that in the DAR and it should be fine. Well at least you are in a better place from the sound of it. Here at my client site they work with us on OSHA, safety, environmental, and health issues. I have been pretty lucky. Have a wonderful day!

    Jeff
    [email protected]
    3. Remember the principles of “misprision,” “facilitation” (which means having knowledge of or encouraging), accessory after the fact and “the reasonably prudent man theory,” when obvious criminal conduct or actions are observed. You have a legal obligation to report what you have seen or heard to competent law enforcement if the client fails to do so “after having been put on official notice.” The client cannot simply be allowed, as a course of action, to flood the moat and raise the drawbridge. (18USC, Sections (§) 3 and 4 Accessory After the Fact and Misprision of a Felony, Pgs 173 and 174 respectively.) As John M. Ruth, MA bluntly puts it: "If you don't want to see the genie, don't rub the ([email protected]#$%©&) lamp." [email protected]m The client should not have security and safety if that client is unable or unwilling to accept its findings!
    Remember my fellow professional you might wind up in court because you kept your mouth shut.
    Enjoy the day,
    Bill

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  • scops8273
    replied
    I can see that.

    I have experienced that as well. I can see that happening to a security officer. I see allot more companies working with security more and more. As long as we can put forth that professionalism then I think we should be fine. We have to keep reporting things like that. Just keep putting things like that in the DAR and it should be fine. Well at least you are in a better place from the sound of it. Here at my client site they work with us on OSHA, safety, environmental, and health issues. I have been pretty lucky. Have a wonderful day!

    Jeff
    [email protected]


    Originally posted by IB107
    it was simple things like noting a light fixture that had wires exposed, or electrical sockets missing covers... that were reported over and over, and the engineers had more say as to "if" and when the problems where fixed even if they were never fixed. it was something according to our post orders that we were supposed to report, but the chief engineer tom, and his crew never really liked security much after 9/11 because we "tightened down" on a lot of rules and they hated it, even though it wasnt "our" choice but rather the companies/property owners choice, the attitude they have is rather disappointing the building managers figure all well they cant get a long with engineering we can have the company find another replacement. that was when i was working out in san francicso, security out there is like a game of checkers, where i work now things are taken in a different light, building owners in utah actually work with the security officers and not against them, they usually back you out here with thier decisions...

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  • IB107
    replied
    it was simple things like noting a light fixture that had wires exposed, or electrical sockets missing covers... that were reported over and over, and the engineers had more say as to "if" and when the problems where fixed even if they were never fixed. it was something according to our post orders that we were supposed to report, but the chief engineer tom, and his crew never really liked security much after 9/11 because we "tightened down" on a lot of rules and they hated it, even though it wasnt "our" choice but rather the companies/property owners choice, the attitude they have is rather disappointing the building managers figure all well they cant get a long with engineering we can have the company find another replacement. that was when i was working out in san francicso, security out there is like a game of checkers, where i work now things are taken in a different light, building owners in utah actually work with the security officers and not against them, they usually back you, out here with thier decisions...
    Last edited by IB107; 05-28-2006, 10:23 AM.

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  • scops8273
    replied
    Wow!

    Can there be that much bad blood out there. I worked most my security career as an officer working in the field and I know also its all in the delivery of the information. I also see allot of "gung ho" security officers who have to throw there weight around and that gets the clients blood boiling and the officer usually gets removed. We are an "Observe and Report" industry. You may have seen that you were dismissed for some report of safety violations or other issues, but what were the circumstances surrounding the incident. Was it put on a report or was it a vocal response to the client. I have found that I give the information to our management and let them go to the client. Officers should never go directly to the client unless asked to do by the client contact or never talk to the employees of the client. No one should be injured for just ignoring safety issues. Any one that ignores them should be written up. Anyway thanks guys.

    Jeff
    [email protected]

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  • darrell
    replied
    I am the site OHSA inspector. I don't care who you are, who you work for or what rank you are or if you run the place I work at if you violate OHSA guidelines then I write you up. I won't have people getting hurt because of being laxed.

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  • IB107
    replied
    Originally posted by Mr. Security
    That's great, in theory. However, the reality is that a security company like Securitas has an ethical and legal obligation to stand firm on OSHA regulations when the client chooses to disregard the law. Your former company will not do that at the cost of an account. We all know it's about the money. Why do you think Arthur Anderson signed off on Enron's books?? Money, money, money. They couldn't stand losing the account.

    By the way, how much experience do you have working just as a security officer? Do you know what it's like to be terminated for reporting safety and security problems? I do!! Corporate security management needs a reality check regarding the difference between what they promise and what they actually deliver.

    same boat here, the building engineers dont take it lightly when you report problems because it may make them look bad, and when they look bad it looks like they dont care aobut thier job, and those since security is lower on the totem pole, you get the "guard is lying that problem was fixed a week ago although the problem is still there" or you get "the guard broke that to make us look bad, because the guard thinks they are better than us"

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  • Mr. Security
    replied
    Originally posted by scops8273
    As true as that maybe keeping such information with in the security service itself will be a great benefit among the officers serving that particular post. Nothing on a grand scale should the client not want to hear of such things. I have been fortunate that may clients want to know about safety and environmental considering the risk liabilities these days. I think knowing OSHA standards for the sake of better preparation of the security officer and the ease it will cause in investigating accidents will be a great value.

    On another point I also believe it is up to the security service officers and managers to begin to partner with the client in matters of security and seek every opportunity to make that happen. Implement things with in the confines of the security operation in order to run the program more efficiently and talk it up as a value added service should the subject come up with the client. Being professional from the start really helps get off to a good start. Set up those post orders, create those forms, and use tools in your everyday job. When the client starts to take notice things will be better. Then if the client still objects, then just do the job and collect the check. It doesn't affect you in any way in the long run.

    That's great, in theory. However, the reality is that a security company like Securitas has an ethical and legal obligation to stand firm on OSHA regulations when the client chooses to disregard the law. Your former company will not do that at the cost of an account. We all know it's about the money. Why do you think Arthur Anderson signed off on Enron's books?? Money, money, money. They couldn't stand losing the account.

    By the way, how much experience do you have working just as a security officer? Do you know what it's like to be terminated for reporting safety and security problems? I do!! Corporate security management needs a reality check regarding the difference between what they promise and what they actually deliver.

    Leave a comment:


  • scops8273
    replied
    As true as that maybe keeping such information with in the security service itself will be a great benefit among the officers serving that particular post. Nothing on a grand scale should the client not want to hear of such things. I have been fortunate that may clients want to know about safety and environmental considering the risk liabilities these days. I think knowing OSHA standards for the sake of better preparation of the security officer and the ease it will cause in investigating accidents will be a great value.

    On another point I also believe it is up to the security service officers and managers to begin to partner with the client in matters of security and seek every opportunity to make that happen. Implement things with in the confines of the security operation in order to run the program more efficiently and talk it up as a value added service should the subject come up with the client. Being professional from the start really helps get off to a good start. Set up those post orders, create those forms, and use tools in your everyday job. When the client starts to take notice things will be better. Then if the client still objects, then just do the job and collect the check. It doesn't affect you in any way in the long run.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mr. Security
    replied
    Originally posted by scops8273
    We as Security Officers providing services to our clients and for our on safety must become familiar with OSHA Standards. This has been brought to light over some issues with Officer injuries and my investigation of those injuries. I would like to discuss those issues.

    Jeff
    [email protected]
    I agree that we should be familiar with OSHA regulations. However, as I have noted in prior posts, many clients are not interested in being notified about safety and security problems. Proactive s/o's who make it a point to report them often find themselves reassigned to another account. Large security companies like Securitas have a conflict of interest when it comes to backing up their officers in the field on such issues because their priority is keeping the account. I've seen it myself too many times to believe that they really care about safety. They love to talk about it and market the concept, but that's about it.

    Leave a comment:


  • scops8273
    started a topic OSHA Standards

    OSHA Standards

    We as Security Officers providing services to our clients and for our on safety must become familiar with OSHA Standards. This has been brought to light over some issues with Officer injuries and my investigation of those injuries. I would like to discuss those issues.

    Jeff
    [email protected]

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