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  • Lawson
    replied
    Just because they are your personal feelings, doesnt mean they can't be misguided. There are plenty of jobs in Security that are MUCH more well to do than most law enforcement jobs.

    Obviously if you have a CJ Degree, you wouldn't want to waste it on a 5.25/hr observe and report job at some empty warehouse where your relief is some 86 year old who uses a walker, but that's not what all security is. With a CJ degree there are a lot of security positions that open with a LOT of money to be made.

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  • Hospital Security Dude
    replied
    If I had the time to acquire a CJ degree there would be no way in hell I would waste it in Security, rant on but just my personal feelings on this!

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  • Curtis Baillie
    replied
    Originally posted by hrdickinson View Post
    Good point, Curtis and there are certainly more of those positions than the ones to which I referred. For the record, by the way, by LE I meant public law enforcement. I didn't even consider LP. I guess I spent too many years on the contract side!
    I made much more money in retail loss prevention than I ever did in public law enforcement, but then when I entered LE it was not for the money.

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  • hrdickinson
    replied
    Originally posted by Security Consultant View Post
    Many of the large retailers pay their Regional LP people and above salaries in the six figures. Salaries in LP have advanced in the past 8 or so years.
    Good point, Curtis and there are certainly more of those positions than the ones to which I referred. For the record, by the way, by LE I meant public law enforcement. I didn't even consider LP. I guess I spent too many years on the contract side!

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  • SecTrainer
    replied
    Originally posted by Security Consultant View Post
    Many of the large retailers pay their Regional people and above salaries in the six figures. Specialty retailers pay even higher. Salaries in LP have advanced in the past 8 or so years.
    Pharmaceutical companies pay well into the six figures to people who specialize in track down the massive diversion schemes involving their products. Certified fraud examiners can make into six figures. Health insurance companies pay into the six figures for specialized investigators who work on high-level HC fraud schemes. Security agency, investigative agency, alarm/CCTV agency and EP agency owners can and do build up their businesses to reach the six-figure (take-home) mark. Consultants - especially those specializing in niche industries - ditto. Higher-level management for national/global security companies - ditto. Specialists like computer forensic examiners sometimes charge up to $250 per hour, with annual income depending on their reputations and how hard they want to work (which is really the key for most of the above anyway...which is why I said to do "Whatever It Takes").

    I have a very good friend who specializes in some of the more complex integrated alarm-access-CCTV-wireless-IT-whooboy-what-the-hell-is-that systems and he's now building his third (ever-larger) home in eight years...this one over 5000 sq ft with a few dozen jaccuzzis, a media room, a pool, a wine cellar and probably a bowling alley. Of course, it's a "smart home", wired for everything-under-the-sun. He'll be able to call up his refrigerator on the way home and ask how much beer is on hand. I could swear he was burning $100 bills in his grill the last time he had us over for barbecue. Of course, he's in his 50s now, and he worked his way up over 20 years from alarm installer while taking computer courses at night. He's a CISSP, CPP, MCSE (Microsoft something-or-other), and I don't know what-all. He started his own company...took the risks...got the knowledge...and worked the 70-hour weeks.

    He was not, in other words, like the man who stands in front of the cold stove and says "Well, if you'll just give me some heat, I'll get warmed up and go find you some wood." He went and chopped the wood, cut up the kindling...and how he's enjoying the heat. Ya gotta chop the wood first. If some of us in this industry (or any other) are not enjoying very much heat, it's usually because we haven't chopped very much wood. If you just go to your low-level, low-paying job every day, do enough to get by and don't do anything else to advance yourself, you're not "chopping wood" so don't blame the industry for "low wages". Sure, there are lots of low-level, low-paying jobs, and we might argue that many don't even pay what they should. However, there are also plenty of better opportunities available if you want them enough to chop the wood and heat up the stove.

    This domain does reward those who have specialized knowledge and have the initiative to seize their opportunities. In government jobs, by contrast, the income ladder is "fixed" and only the (relatively) few slots close to the top have ceilings that are in the six figures. In my opinion, competition for six-figure jobs is much fiercer in government than in the private domain, where the main determinant of income is the operation of market forces for highly qualified people, not a fixed governmental schedule of salaries.
    Last edited by SecTrainer; 06-17-2007, 08:29 AM.

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  • Curtis Baillie
    replied
    Originally posted by hrdickinson View Post
    That was certainly a rant worth reading, S.T. and absolutely true, in my opinion.

    Also, further to your point #3, there are senior management people at some of the larger security companies that started in the rank and file. Only a few may progress that far, but at least the opportunity is there.

    I would imagine that six figure LE jobs are rare outside of the top ten US cities.
    Many of the large retailers pay their Regional LP people and above salaries in the six figures. Salaries in LP have advanced in the past 8 or so years.

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  • hrdickinson
    replied
    That was certainly a rant worth reading, S.T. and absolutely true, in my opinion.

    Also, further to your point #3, there are senior management people at some of the larger security companies that started in the rank and file. Only a few may progress that far, but at least the opportunity is there.

    I would imagine that six figure LE jobs are rare outside of the top ten US cities.

    Leave a comment:


  • Lawson
    replied
    Just to add, when I was with Wackenhut and I went to Louisiana, I was making approx $4,000/mo (before OT) and $10,000/mo (after OT)

    Before OT the local sheriff's office Sergeant was making approx 3,000/mo. And the deputies less than that... so you cant tell me Security is less paid.

    Leave a comment:


  • Andy Taylor
    replied
    Beautifully put, SecTrainer.

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  • SecTrainer
    replied
    Originally posted by Hospital Security Dude View Post
    If you got a degree please don't waste your time working secuirty, get into Law Enforcement, pays better.
    What an ill-informed, disappointing post - especially for this particular forum, where members should know better - and one with which I disagree strongly.

    <begin rant>

    1. The security domain is very broad, very deep, and very interesting. It has something for everyone, from executive protection...to management...to investigation...to agency ownership....to intelligence/counterintelligence...to high technology designing and installing complex systems involving computers, networks, sensors, etc.

    2. Security positions can be found in virtually every type of venue - entertainment, healthcare, retail industry, hospitality, defense industries, nuclear energy, you-name-it...up to and including the federal government.

    3. For those who move up, there are many security positions that pay far more than many LE positions. Public agencies sometimes have trouble keeping people from moving over to the security domain, in fact.

    4. There are many LE positions in this country that pay less than or equal to security, even at the officer level. I have posted about this elsewhere.

    5. There are many security positions that see more "action" than many LE positions. I have also posted about this.

    6. If you like real high-stakes, high-security, high-risk action, it can certainly be found (for instance, the private security companies working in Iraq).

    7. There are many "hybrid" positions - sometimes called "special police" - where officers perform a "police" mission (for instance, railroad police).

    8. With globalized companies, you can easily work your way into a job that takes you around the world.

    9. Security work is very important...without it, our economy would collapse very quickly, and this country would be a much less safe place to live in.

    10. LE isn't usually what you see on "Cops"...a television program that edits out the long, boring hours and crap duties that are often very much a part of LE work and films for a week in order to get a half-hour of "action" (well, 22 minutes of "action", subtracting commercials). Trust me...your 100th traffic stop where you have a pathetic loser with a few ounces of weed or a crack pipe won't be very interesting or "exciting" as you listen to the same old excuses, nor as you fill out all the paperwork and book him in. It isn't "exciting" to cool your heels outside a courtroom on your day off because someone wants a hearing on their speeding ticket. It isn't "interesting" to go listen to someone complain that his neighbor erected a fence that's 3" higher than the code allows.

    Of course, we have our boring, dull jobs as well. You could go sit in a guard shack somewhere and never accomplish anything else, if that's what you want. However, if you want a challenging, high-paying, rewarding and interesting career, we've got them in spades.

    Consider obtaining some further qualifications to open up more of these opportunities - for instance, the CPP or other certification from ASIS. There's also the CFE fraud certification, and others. You could also complete a graduate certification or degree in a field such as Emergency Management, Security Management, etc. Most of all, though, go to work for a company with a solid reputation, and be willing to take on whatever they throw at you. Let them know you're interested in advancement and do what it takes to move up. If it's a national company, this might well mean transferring to another part of the country at some point. If you make "Whatever It Takes" your motto, you'll do well.

    I hope never to see another post like the one above on this forum again.

    <end rant>
    Last edited by SecTrainer; 06-16-2007, 11:10 AM.

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  • GCMC Security
    replied
    Originally posted by Hospital Security Dude View Post
    If you got a degree please don't waste your time working secuirty, get into Law Enforcement, pays better.
    That's subjective. That's also not very true everywhere. Until this year the City PD started out at right around 22K a year.

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  • Hospital Security Dude
    replied
    If you got a degree please don't waste your time working secuirty, get into Law Enforcement, pays better.

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Rarely did I see companies in St. Petersburg sign your G before 90 days. If they did, all you'd have to do is get it signed, send it in, quit, and go work for a better company.

    Remember, your G license application must be signed by an M licensee.

    Leave a comment:


  • mh892
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier View Post
    My bet is Florida. He took the D course, and the G course. Too bad that he needs an agency to sponsor his G (Gun) license, the application requires a signature from a Class B (Agency) owner or manager.


    The school you went to should of told you about the companies in your area, equally. Other than that, open the phone book and look under "security guard," and start calling.

    I would not mention you took the D and G together, because most companies will not arm anyone they meet without their working for 90 days. Unless their desperate to replace an armed officer, in which case, be wary: Why did the guy leave.
    Is this something new? I've never heard of a Florida company that has you work 90 days prior to assigning an armed position. Like in Wackenhut, US Protect, SCG, InfoPro, FEMA contractors, etc.

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  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    My bet is Florida. He took the D course, and the G course. Too bad that he needs an agency to sponsor his G (Gun) license, the application requires a signature from a Class B (Agency) owner or manager.

    The school you went to should of told you about the companies in your area, equally. Other than that, open the phone book and look under "security guard," and start calling.

    I would not mention you took the D and G together, because most companies will not arm anyone they meet without their working for 90 days. Unless their desperate to replace an armed officer, in which case, be wary: Why did the guy leave.

    Leave a comment:

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