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Should S/O's Have More Training/Authority etc ?

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  • #31
    Originally posted by bigdog
    what scares me is with 8 hrs of training in SC you get the same powers of arrest as a deputy sheriff.
    I did a ride along with a company in SC a couple years ago. They can arrest but they can't transport but they run blue lights.

    The S/O writes out a citation and the responding Police Officer takes that and the prisoner.

    I kinda like that concept because then the S/O doesnt have to be gone for hours on end.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by bigdog
      I completely agree IN florida change493.org ahs and great idea its called intermediate officer in essence you are a special leo on your property withpowers to arrest and cite.

      Thats a Great idea, I hope it comes through. We live in a completely different world today than when most Security Guard statutes were written.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by talon
        I did a ride along with a company in SC a couple years ago. They can arrest but they can't transport but they run blue lights.

        The S/O writes out a citation and the responding Police Officer takes that and the prisoner.

        I kinda like that concept because then the S/O doesnt have to be gone for hours on end.
        But the police are tied up with the security officer's prisoner. Just the other day, I transported a prisoner for another officer. I was at the jail for an hour and a half and it wasn't even my arrest. That stinks.
        I believe I speak for everyone here sir, when I say, to Hell with our orders.
        -Lieutenant Commander Data
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        • #34
          Originally posted by Tennsix
          But the police are tied up with the security officer's prisoner. Just the other day, I transported a prisoner for another officer. I was at the jail for an hour and a half and it wasn't even my arrest. That stinks.
          True, but the company only employs special deputies.

          Ther are agencies that do "proactive enforcement," which means they're offering security services. The police officer playing security guard CANNOT leave the site, even if they have a prisoner. They must call an on-duty officer to transport their prisoner and book them in.

          So, it seems to go both ways.
          Some Kind of Commando Leader

          "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Tennsix
            But the police are tied up with the security officer's prisoner. Just the other day, I transported a prisoner for another officer. I was at the jail for an hour and a half and it wasn't even my arrest. That stinks.

            I agree...almost. If the S/O's can transport I say they should, but also the local LEO's are paid to respond to the property or business 24/7 so it shouldn't matter if they made the arrest or not.

            Look at it this way...the Police are always saying that Security is taking their jobs...well, this way everybody wins.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by talon
              I agree...almost. If the S/O's can transport I say they should, but also the local LEO's are paid to respond to the property or business 24/7 so it shouldn't matter if they made the arrest or not.

              Look at it this way...the Police are always saying that Security is taking their jobs...well, this way everybody wins.
              But if you make the arrest, you are getting paid to do that. Like you, I have a other duties and responsiblities. If a security officer wants more authority then (s)he should be responsible for consequences of their added authority (arrests). I can't do my job if i am busy doing yours.

              Having said that, I do understand what you are saying. I am just making a point for some of others reading this. I realize you understand both sides of the debate.
              Last edited by Tennsix; 04-19-2006, 12:17 AM.
              I believe I speak for everyone here sir, when I say, to Hell with our orders.
              -Lieutenant Commander Data
              sigpic

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Tennsix
                But if you make the arrest, you are getting paid to do that. Like you, I have a other duties and responsiblities. If a security officer wants more authority then (s)he should be responsible for consequences of their added authority (arrests). I can't do my job if i am busy doing yours.

                Having said that, I do understand what you are saying. I am just making a point for some of others reading this. I realize you understand both sides of the debate.

                Understood.

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                • #38
                  I agree with both of you. The Public Authority has a responsiblity to enforce the law, and the Private Police has a responsibility to enforce laws related to the protection of their property.

                  The only thing I demand of any expanded authorities is that the protection level not be lowered because of transporting prisoners. Because if it is, its a sure fire way to lose the account to either the off-duty police accounts, or the warm-body companies that do not arrest.
                  Some Kind of Commando Leader

                  "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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                  • #39
                    Nah i dont really care much for respect. Your not going to get it. I mean some people do and some never will. I think thats how the job is. I just mean as far as powers being able to do our job a little bit better is all. I dont care for having powers to arrest and all that stuff really. If we can help catch them thats fine enough. What difference does it make if i or a leo arrests them ? They got caught didnt they. If someone coems into this job or leo or military anything such as that and wants all respect i think they are going to be sad. A lot of people dont respect any of the uniforms. Some do and some dont

                    Stay Safe All


                    Originally posted by jimmyhat
                    I say this all the time. You can have as much training as you want, but you have to be willing to go out and get it yourself. Do the training, keep the records, and then make a case to your boss that you're serious about this stuff, and maybe the company will be willing to pay for additional training.


                    One way to make this so, across the board, is for everyone to start refusing to work for companies that don't provide defensive weapons. There's a million reasons for this. Not the least of which is the fact that a company that is willing to send you out on the street, defenseless, obviously cares nothing about your safety. Why work for a company like that?



                    You already have the powers of a private citizen, the most powerful authority in the land. Am I right in assuming what you really want is more respect? That which may be derived from more power? That sets off all kinds of alarms in my head.

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                    • #40
                      I agree about pepper spray training. But not a special license to carry it. I think you should have a training certificate given by your compnay that shows you have the training. As far as background checks we already have them. When i applied with my current company they had to do a check through the state then my security officer licensed was issued by ohio dept of public safety/division of homeland security. The reason i dont think we shoiuld need a special license for OC is because the avg ciitzen dosent need one. At least in ohio.




                      Originally posted by histfan71
                      I am all for guards getting more training. Even more important is getting CONTINUING training. How many of us know guards who went and got, let's say baton training, but then never drew his baton again. How effective do you think he is going to be when he needs to use his baton. Skills, and especially defensive skills, diminish over time if you do not constantly practice and keep up with changes in tactics, technology, laws, etc. Something that always scared me was a cop, or even a security guard, who carried an out-of-date penal code. A lawsuit waiting to happen.



                      California just enacted a 40-hour basic training requirement for security guards that went into effect in July 2005. The new law also requires 8-hours of "in-service" training every year. Training in defensive tactics, OC, baton, and firearms are optional and do not count toward the 40-hour basic training requirement but do count toward 8-hour "in-service" training.



                      I agree, but only if the the security guard has the proper training, licenses, and background checks. Many of the states, including California, already have these requirements in place but it is frightening how many states do not. Any joe-blow off the street can buy himself a security guard badge and uniform and go to work as a security guard without any screening or training whatsoever. Scary thought.



                      Again, I might be in favor of getting expanded powers if the industry tightens up it's professionalism. At present, however, I am solidly aganist that idea. More laws to protect us is a good idea, and Florida has already taken some positive steps in that regard.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by S/O245
                        I agree about pepper spray training. But not a special license to carry it. I think you should have a training certificate given by your compnay that shows you have the training. As far as background checks we already have them. When i applied with my current company they had to do a check through the state then my security officer licensed was issued by ohio dept of public safety/division of homeland security. The reason i dont think we shoiuld need a special license for OC is because the avg ciitzen dosent need one. At least in ohio.
                        I believe I speak for everyone here sir, when I say, to Hell with our orders.
                        -Lieutenant Commander Data
                        sigpic

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          I agree that if you are arresting people added responsibility will come. I know of a loss prevention dept in a sotre which has guys that can detain and i think the detectives can arrest. I think they can even fill out the criminal citiation and can either have them sent to jail or released.

                          But like i said before im really not worried about arresting people. I think think laws should give us more protections for one. Also since alot of us can only make citizen type arrests i think that laws should be made that if in some cases a person dosent comply with orders we give then they could be arrested for certain violations.

                          As i understand it security officers who cant arrest do have citizen arrest powers. Couldnt citizen arrest powers probably be used say during a state of emergency ? Like hurricane katrina police and military cant be everyplace at once. So say a S/O was working and some felony occured couldnt they make a citzen arrest since the police cant get to them ?

                          Originally posted by Tennsix
                          With added authority comes added responsibility. In my opinion, you catch it you clean it.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by S/O245
                            I agree that if you are arresting people added responsibility will come. I know of a loss prevention dept in a sotre which has guys that can detain and i think the detectives can arrest. I think they can even fill out the criminal citiation and can either have them sent to jail or released.

                            But like i said before im really not worried about arresting people. I think think laws should give us more protections for one. Also since alot of us can only make citizen type arrests i think that laws should be made that if in some cases a person dosent comply with orders we give then they could be arrested for certain violations.

                            As i understand it security officers who cant arrest do have citizen arrest powers. Couldnt citizen arrest powers probably be used say during a state of emergency ? Like hurricane katrina police and military cant be everyplace at once. So say a S/O was working and some felony occured couldnt they make a citzen arrest since the police cant get to them ?
                            In a situation such as that, you have to prioritize your enforcement efforts. For example, stealing a moped is a felony but there are more atrocious acts to worry about.

                            I am not opposed to private arrests but if were to become common practice, I see a lot problems associated with it. For every one citizen that conducts a responsible arrest, there would be 20 that screw it up.
                            I believe I speak for everyone here sir, when I say, to Hell with our orders.
                            -Lieutenant Commander Data
                            sigpic

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              i agree on that. I dont think it should be done all the time. But like for big emergencies like 9/11 and others when the police and military cant get to people. I mean i heard about new oreleans where people called 9/11 and 1 to 5 days later police units, mil units went to check on them. In those types of emergencies i think citizen arrests should be used if they have to be.

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