Hotel evictions

[HotelSecurity]

I've written about this on other forums but want to see what you guys think about it!

My dowtown Montreal hotel attracts young people under 21 years of age from nearby places where the drinking age is 19 or 21. It is 18 in Quebec. Every weekend & during spring & college breaks we get these kids that come here mainly to drink! Our bars close at 3a.m.. This means that from about 3:30 to 5:00 we receive MAINY noise complaints as they return to the hotel & gather in each other's rooms.

For about 25 years we applied the "3 strikes & you're out" rule. We'd warn you once, twice & throw you out if we got a third complaint. We'd call the police if necessary.

About 2 years ago the lawyers at the police department decided that an hotel room is a temporary home. The Charter of Rights does not allow them to throw someone out of their home. So now they are not allowed to help us evict these people making noise. We are supposed to call & they can give tickets for breaking the noise bylaw. On a busy weekend I have waited 45 minutes for the police to come for a serious incident. I can imagine the wait time to come to give a noise complaint ticket. In the meantime the guests being disturbed become madder & madder & almost always seek compensation, something they don't if the situation is handled like in the old days.

I can live with the police not helping us. Throwing the kids out before their "lease" (room rental) is up is against civil law but we have lawyers that could fight this if in fact the kids wanted to come back to take us to court. My main problem is that I have been told by the police that if I open a door & enter a room to throw someone out, I CAN BE ARRESTED FOR BREAK & ENTER!

Most states & provinces have laws that allow an hotel to throw out people causing a disturbance because unlike a landlord, we can not check references of people we accept as guests & legally can not refuse someone willing to pay for a room. We don't have a law like this.

Your thoughts?

[Mr. Security]

An Idea.

Can you ask for a refundable deposit that you can tap into and then issue tickets for excessive noise and deduct the ticket from the deposit? Money has a way of getting people's attention.

Also, what about designating a certain area of the hotel for these 'guests' so that they are all in the same area and away from your preferred guests? The rooms could even be cheaper so that the kids would go for it w/o too much thought.

[N. A. Corbier]

That's... weird. I've never heard of anything like that, mainly because Florida gives the hotel operator specific rights - which is posted in the hotel room per Florida Law.

An innkeeper has the right to evict without process, and a law enforcement officer "of the state" is specifically required to assist the innkeeper in restoring order on his premesis.

The innkeeper must pro-rata return money to the evictee, not at the time of the eviction.

Agents of the innkeeper may enter the room at any time, for any lawful purpose, as well. One way we could get into rooms when the police could not was to perform a health and safety inspection. The police officer was an invitee, and it would then give him probable cause to make any arrests as needed. Considering when I worked hotels, I had a master fire key card, no door was locked to me.

[Warren]

I actually do some occasional security work for a Best Western here in town, they have a policy NOT to rent to local renters, that curbs the drinking from that crowd.

I personally would recommend that the hotel you are talking about, get their lawyer to verify the information, and perhaps initiate a new contract/rental agreement that clearly indicates what will be done in the case of excessive noice complaints.

A clearly written clause in the contract may in fact be enough.

[N. A. Corbier]

I actually do some occasional security work for a Best Western here in town, they have a policy NOT to rent to local renters, that curbs the drinking from that crowd.

I personally would recommend that the hotel you are talking about, get their lawyer to verify the information, and perhaps initiate a new contract/rental agreement that clearly indicates what will be done in the case of excessive noice complaints.

A clearly written clause in the contract may in fact be enough.

Amazing what people will agree with, isn't it?

[HotelSecurity]

The deposit idea doesn't work. if we charge $200 per room that's about $180 US. Divide that by the 4 or 5 people they cram into the room &...it's peanuts.

As for the putting them on their own floor. There is a main air vent that when they are really noisy on the 2nd floor means they can be heard on the 17th floor. Also most of the hotel has king sized beds. These kids take rooms with 2 double beds. Some elderly guests & foreigners like to sleep in separate beds even when married. We have no choice but to put them together, especially when they make their reservations we don't know that they are coming to party.

I carry the emergency key card, but like I said the police have told me I could be arrested for break & enter if I use it!

Local renters are not a problem except at graduation time. The trouble causers usually come from Toronto & Boston.

We've thought about adding something to the registration card sayng that the lease will expire if they cause a disturbance. The problem is that to throw someone out of their "home" you need a judgement from the Rental Board, which obviously you can't get in the middle of the night. Marking something like 'I agree to voluntarily leave if I cause a disturbance' sounds good but how do you enforce it if it is illegal to open a door if they refuse to open it?

We do have a few plans. One is to shut off the power to the room. According to the Rental Board this is illegal but it's a civil matter. Again we have lawyers & anyway it is unlikely they would come back to attend court proceeding that we all know can be posponed many times .

Our other plan is to call the police every time another guest calls. Last weekend we received 20 complaints of noise in less than 2 hours. Hopefully if we & other hotels did the same something could be changed.

What do the police suggest? Hire one of them off duty at $66.00/hour. Sounds good except they still can't throw out the person from his "home"

[N. A. Corbier]

That sounds about right. "We're obviously superior to the guards you hire, even though we can't do anything more than the guards can."

What prevents someone from simply staying in the room indefinately, since you can't evict them? Getting a formal eviction order?

[HotelSecurity]

What prevents someone from simply staying in the room indefinately, since you can't evict them? Getting a formal eviction order?

The room rental is for a set period of time. If they have not checked out by checkout time on the day they were supposed to have checked out, then we can take reposession of the room.

By the way, if after receiving a ticket & they continue to disturb the peace, then they can be arrested for mischief, but the warnings, ticket must be given first. By that time any damage to the other guests will have taken place. They also can be thrown out for other criminal offenses like making threats. (Not that I would ever think of provoking them into making a theft in order to get rid of them )

[Lawson]

In WA, it is something like that. When you rent either an apartment or Hotel/Motel room it technically becomes you "Abode" so the hotel is not allowed to just come busting in if you dont want them in. In the lease/rental form you sign off to allowing Maids inside when you are not available for contact, unless you somehow make a note of you not wanting them in... typically the "no maid service" sign the hotel provides. In most of these contract forms, I think it says something along the lines of "I agree to cancel my lease should I be found to cause any form of disturbance." So this way, they in fact are throwing themselves out in a way.

[Warren]

I would quit speculating, AND not always listen to law enforcement all the time. Many officers are just arm chair lawyers, and occasionally the advice that they give is to benefit them, and NOT the public.

Have your management call their company lawyer to get PROPER legal advice in regards to this. If you act upon, or DON"T act upon certain pieces of advice, that is not written, you may very well find yourself in a court of law defending your position.

[HotelSecurity]

I would quit speculating, AND not always listen to law enforcement all the time. Many officers are just arm chair lawyers, and occasionally the advice that they give is to benefit them, and NOT the public.

Have your management call their company lawyer to get PROPER legal advice in regards to this. If you act upon, or DON"T act upon certain pieces of advice, that is not written, you may very well find yourself in a court of law defending your position.

The problem is that I have the order to the police not to help in hotel evictions in writting from the police lawyers, not just verbally from the constables. The Montreal police publish a monthly newsletter bringing their staff up to date on department decisions. It's published on-line. I'd post a link except it is written in French only & is not translated

Neil

[Mr. Security]

The deposit idea doesn't work. if we charge $200 per room that's about $180 US. Divide that by the 4 or 5 people they cram into the room &...it's peanuts.

As for the putting them on their own floor. There is a main air vent that when they are really noisy on the 2nd floor means they can be heard on the 17th floor. Also most of the hotel has king sized beds. These kids take rooms with 2 double beds. Some elderly guests & foreigners like to sleep in separate beds even when married. We have no choice but to put them together, especially when they make their reservations we don't know that they are coming to party......

Oh well, have fun

[james2go30]

Yea

That's... weird. I've never heard of anything like that, mainly because Florida gives the hotel operator specific rights - which is posted in the hotel room per Florida Law.

An innkeeper has the right to evict without process, and a law enforcement officer "of the state" is specifically required to assist the innkeeper in restoring order on his premesis.

The innkeeper must pro-rata return money to the evictee, not at the time of the eviction.

Agents of the innkeeper may enter the room at any time, for any lawful purpose, as well. One way we could get into rooms when the police could not was to perform a health and safety inspection. The police officer was an invitee, and it would then give him probable cause to make any arrests as needed. Considering when I worked hotels, I had a master fire key card, no door was locked to me.

Here we issue 2 warnings then call the Director of security...If he feels the situation deserves another warning before an eviction then we wait till they mess up again before we don an eviction...if not and the situation is serious second warning and we call the county police and they assist with the eviction...now if it is real serious we...like someone just threw a pice of furniture off the balcony or something equally as dangerous it is an instant eviction. However although I have a master to every room and office here on property I can only enter a unit if it is a medical emergency or if a guest or owner has a unit that has been burgled..or if someone renting unit has damagwed it we have to take pictures of the damage. We can't evict owners, however, just put warnings on their files and if it is a serious problem we call the police on them and then issue a warning on their file.

[james2go30]

oh yea

If someone here is under 25 they can be evicted...cause you have to be 25 or older to stay here...If the person of age rents and leaves it for someone underage to stay those underage folks can be evicted...but only time we actually evict those underage folks is they break some kind of rule or noise ordinance to where we have to check for I.D.

[HotelSecurity]

There is a case we have to keep an eye on. A guest was evicted from an hotel. He was drunk & causing problems. He was injured in an accident. The hotel is being sued. I will post any further develpments if/when I find them. (I can find where I read this right now but it happened in the States & is recent).