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  • Advanced Firearms Training

    All-

    I am curious about the amount of advanced firearms and tactics training attended by members of the forum. Interests in the type of gear, pay, and policies appear to be a priority. Just curious........

  • #2
    Originally posted by Sierra 1
    All-

    I am curious about the amount of advanced firearms and tactics training attended by members of the forum. Interests in the type of gear, pay, and policies appear to be a priority. Just curious........
    Find places that will give reputable training to private citizens for advanced firearms and tactics training.

    So far, only places I know of are Gunsite, any NRA Security Pistol Instructor, NRA Sponsored Courses. Most courses I have seen have strict disclaimers noting that you must be a sworn LEO of a PUBLIC agency to attend such courses.

    This may be a "we only want us at the course" mentality, which the industry caters to, however. The us vs. them mentality pervades any tactical instruction series.
    Some Kind of Commando Leader

    "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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    • #3
      N.A. Corbier,

      I am curious about the type of training attended by members (excluding state mandated/required training). I am a Gunsite student (began in the late 80's while in the service) and aware of reputable schools to attend. I would like to know opinions of training attended, where the training was conducted (school), and if it is a priority.

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      • #4
        I've done basic SWAT, DDM, and Patrol Rifle. I was supposed to go to Patrol Rifle instructor, but left that agency prior to the class. I've also done the MEB Instructor class (basically useless), and Taser, but I draw the line at OCAT instructor. I HATE THAT STUFF.

        In the private side of the house, all I've done was the basic state and federal firearms certs (using the ICE-QT targets), and re-certs in OCAT and MEB (again, useless).

        I'd like to see some more counter-terror stuff offered, both public and private. As it stands, all I really have for that is WMD courses that lacked any hands-on training.

        Of course, I'd also like to do advanced DDM and SWAT, but we'll see...

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        • #5
          wilrobnson,

          I also completed the MEB instructor and OCAT. The ASP instructor was much more informative and useful in my days of LE. Thanks for the info-

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          • #6
            Wilrbnson,

            Can you advise what DHS contractor you now work for?

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Sierra 1
              Wilrobnson,

              Can you advise what DHS contractor you now work for?
              I'd really rather not, since you never know who's on here, and apparently we're going to be changing companies soon (you stay with the contract, no matter who the company providing the service is, unless one of these days they go in-house).

              Check your PM.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Sierra 1
                N.A. Corbier,

                I am curious about the type of training attended by members (excluding state mandated/required training). I am a Gunsite student (began in the late 80's while in the service) and aware of reputable schools to attend. I would like to know opinions of training attended, where the training was conducted (school), and if it is a priority.
                See, that's what I'm referring to. Most security practitioners don't have the ability to take tactical courses. They're usually denied access due to not being part of a public law enforcement agency.

                I think I was asking, "where the hell are people getting their training," if they are getting advanced training, and who's paying the tab. I notice that wilrobinson got his training through an LE agency, and then through a DHS contractor (Which they can pull out the DOD/DHS cert and DOD/DHS will go, "We're sending them.")

                I'm interested to know this, too. Especially in light of "advanced training" being incompatible with the "big three" company's concepts of protection.
                Some Kind of Commando Leader

                "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
                  I notice that wilrobinson got his training through an LE agency, and then through a DHS contractor (Which they can pull out the DOD/DHS cert and DOD/DHS will go, "We're sending them.")
                  There's only one 'i' in there

                  I got the all that high-speed stuff as a deputy and a cop, when I went private the company's attitude was "Hey, that's nice...We don't care".

                  The contract here specifies what training you do, down to the hours and locations and even the types of ammo at the range.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by wilrobnson
                    I've also done the MEB Instructor class (basically useless)
                    Why do you think that the MEB Instructor class was useless. I got a lot out of it.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by wilrobnson
                      There's only one 'i' in there

                      I got the all that high-speed stuff as a deputy and a cop, when I went private the company's attitude was "Hey, that's nice...We don't care".

                      The contract here specifies what training you do, down to the hours and locations and even the types of ammo at the range.
                      There's a local outfit that refused to hire me because I have 28 hours of firearms training from Florida in REVOLVER. Having that on your resume, damn, your lucky. No warm body outfit would ever touch you, man.

                      JimmyHat: See, that's the crazy part about it. Few, and I mean few, states are providing training for this stuff. You know we can do that up here, in Wisconsin, so long as we can pass a basic .223 course, we can carry them? Its just firearms certification, no tactical training required!
                      Some Kind of Commando Leader

                      "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by jimmyhat
                        I could go on for hours about the Military CQB training I was fortunate enough to receive as a Troop, but those courses are exclusive and hard to sometimes project into private sector S.O.P's.

                        As far as "we" are concerned, Virginia has a great course for Private-types, and we carry the training as an actual "certification" on our Security Registration I.D's. The Advanced Firearms Course provided by several different certified training schools. Course includes:

                        Classroom and Range safety
                        Handgun Marksmanship Fundamentals
                        Practical Handgun Handling Techniques
                        Cover and Concealment
                        Law Enforcement Shotgun
                        Shotgun Marksmanship Fundamentals
                        Practical Shotgun Handling Techniques
                        Practical Shotgun Handling
                        Low Light Training
                        Liability in Training / Lack of Training
                        Live Fire Exercises / Safety / Malfunctions / Shoot, Don't Shoot
                        Proper Care and Maintenance of the Weapon
                        Civil Liability of the Use of Firearms
                        Criminal Liability of the Use of Firearms
                        Weapon Retention
                        Deadly Force
                        Justifiable Deadly Force
                        Range Safety
                        Decision-Making for the Personal Protection Specialist

                        40 hours not including range time. Well worth it, but it's beneficial to research the school and it's instructors first.

                        Completion of this course is mandatory prior to obtaining a Personal Protection Specialist certification.

                        "Security Rifle" is the new buzzword in Virginia. Although the basic operator course is far from advanced, it's in the early stages and I've heard that an advanced course is being considered for the near future.
                        __________________________________________________ _______________

                        It would be nice if we had some state mandated standards here in Michigan. That way S/Os could consistantly have standards to be armed and carry their weapons while incuring less risk of misuse.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by EH126
                          __________________________________________________ _______________

                          It would be nice if we had some state mandated standards here in Michigan. That way S/Os could consistantly have standards to be armed and carry their weapons while incuring less risk of misuse.
                          Isn't it "I have a concealed weapons permit, therefore I can carry a gun while performing security job?" up there?

                          Ie: Absolutely no security-specific training, just the citizen CCW course. I knew a few states are like that.
                          Some Kind of Commando Leader

                          "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            [QUOTE=I got the all that high-speed stuff as a deputy and a cop, when I went private the company's attitude was "Hey, that's nice...We don't care.[/QUOTE]

                            Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
                            There's a local outfit that refused to hire me because I have 28 hours of firearms training from Florida in REVOLVER. Having that on your resume, damn, your lucky. No warm body outfit would ever touch you, man.
                            I have been looking into some part time stuff again. And perhaps maybe by the end of this year some of us may have to find full time. And yea, most of the WBC will not even talk to me because of my training both from past LEO days and some extra training as an SEO. I stopped putting that stuff down in applications. It's amazing that they call you if you just state your an average experienced guard looking for an unarmed post job. Hell, I stopped submitting my resume to some of them. They do indeed have that attitude as WR said. "Oh, yea. Nice resume. We don't care about that stuff".
                            My views, opinions and statements are my own. They are not of my company, affiliates or coworkers.

                            -Being bagger at Publix has more respect these days

                            -It's just a job kid deal with it

                            -The industry needs to do one of two things; stop fiddling with the thin line and go forward or go back to that way it was. A flashlight in one hand and your set of keys in the other

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                            • #15
                              It's interesting to see so many private security professionals wanting to get the advanced training while their employers could care less. Interesting and sad at the same time. I provide a class known as Close Quarters Confrontation Responses that is geared towards immediate threats against unarmed or armed agents. The majority of the students foot the bill themselves. I'm encouraged by the fact that the agents/officers themselves want the advanced training. There are actually quite a few training outfits offering security and private citizen training classes lately. Like anything else, there are good and bad and I would caution you to check the reputation and references of the providers before plunking down your hard earned dough.
                              Jerry
                              http://personalprotectionconcepts.info

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