Are "video games" contributing factors to all these school shootings?

[Black Caesar]

I don't think video games are to "blame", but I also think people dismiss the potential effects of ANY forms of stimulus (such as video games) on people, especially (but not only) on weak minded people.

Video games make you think, they "train" you so well that the United States Army uses America's Army as a tool. It works so well that one player with no prior medical training took what he learned playing the game and Saved a real person's life.

I like what Lt Col Dave Grossman says about video games. From the Wikipedia article about him:

Controversially, Col. Grossman argues that that the techniques used by armies to train soldiers to kill are mirrored in certain types of video game. The conclusion he draws is that playing violent video games, particularly first-person shooters, train children in the use of weapons and, more importantly, harden them emotionally to the task of murder by simulating the killing of hundreds or thousands of opponents in a single typical video game.

Hell, I'm a big time MMO player (I play EvE and WoW now) and have played loads of online FPS games like Quake. IMO video games can be almost as good as training aides as playing real life paint ball.

[darkenna]

There is just as much violence in schools today as there ever has been. The level of violence hasn't changed; only the level of damage. One reason for that is a change in what is taught to children as they are being raised.

(Keep in mind, these are generalizations & stereotypes, and not, I repeat, not, aimed at anyone in particular. If you were not one of these "later" kids, and your parents and teachers actually taught you these "earlier" things, good for you!)

Let us think back through the years. In the 50's (and going on back through time immemorial), fistfights amongst schoolchildren were normal. Occasionally, someone used a baseball bat or similar object. Rarely, someone would use a knife. Fights were very rarely lethal, usually ending with someone have a black eye or a broken bone. Kids were taught the meanings of respect and honor, on the importance of life, and the seriousness of taking life. Kids were also taught how to handle knives and guns, how to correctly use them for their proper purposes, and why to respect them.

Later, as time marched onwards, the fists got brass knuckles, the bats became chains and steel pipes, the knives became larger and more common. Occasionally, some kid would use a gun. Fights ended more frequently with serious injuries. Kids were taught what respect was, and that honor was a chivalrous thing but not necessarily modern, and that people died. Kids were taught that knives were for cooking or shanking, and that guns were for adults.

Time moved forward. The brass knuckles became chains and steel pipes, the knives became guns, and the guns became more common. Kids were taught that you should respect strength, that honor is for the Marines, and that life can hurt you so you should wear helmets & kneepads. They weren't allowed to play in the dirt or go hunting, they weren't allowed to catch & gut their own fish. They had to wear helmets when on their bikes and couldn't have pocketknives. The babysitter was replaced by the TV and the video game. Respect for each other was replaced by taunting. Kids became very verbally, and sometimes physically, vicious towards anyone different or physically inferior. Fights usually ended with serious injuries, deaths became more commonplace and a sensational news item.

Now this last group of kids are parents. The "debaucherous" generation of the 70's and 80's have teenagers. We need to ask ourselves, "What are they being taught? Are they being taught respect and honor, or that might makes right? Are they being taught the realities of knives and guns as tools, or that they are cool ways to hurt people? Are they being taught that great power brings great responsibility, or that strength should be used to tame and control those around you?



Besides, the downfall of modern society is clearly the fault of monks. All that chanting and shaving of the head. Living in peace and harmony, faugh!!! It's a front. Like Microsoft Windows, which was simply a giant globe-wide conspiracy to get everyone addicted to Spider-Solitaire and Freecell. (It worked, too.)

[Guest]

Well....

Following the Columbine school shootings in April 1999, investigators had learned that the shooters were heavily into video games, and had played a lot of "Doom."

This is actually not true. Along with most of the rumors about school shooters being 'loners' etc.

Its my theory that from a psychological perspective, I believe that violent video games can influence people to act out, and make fantasy into reality.

What the games actually do is cause desensitization. The games with realistic bullet wounds, etc train the player from an early age to be able to kill to get a high score or what have you. Also, alot of first-person shooter-type games were initially developed by the military to aid in training. [paraphrase from LT. Col David Grossman "On Killing."

but I've heard that store managers will discretely sell a violent video game, so long as there are no witnesses to the transaction.

And I've heard of Bigfoot and Nessie, too.

Do you ever wonder how many of these young shooters were into playing violent video games?

My brother and I played for the mental challenge. We both were 2 and 3 sports letter earners in high school on the honor roll and in nat'l honor Society, etc. The video games gave us a chance to do something challenging that was different from our everyday. Many kids view them the same way. Unfortunately, there is a great number of people who allow tv's and such to babysit their children. It is these children, statistically, that are more likely to be killers if they play violent video games (if, of course, you agree with B.F. Skinner and the "tabula rasa.")

And that their video games had been contributing factors to their actions?

Unfortunately there will never be a definite answer to this. Outside of the fact that they do allow for desensitization which can possibly lead to violent behavior. IIRC, Dahmer had cats. His torture of these animals made his sick behavior easier for him to stomach.

I took intro-psychology a few years back, and the textbook had a section on the topic of "identity crisis," which is very common among teenagers and young adults. The author had suggested that the lack of guidance, brought by parents too busy working long hours, had produced a society where more kids are undergoing "identity crisis;" and are susceptible to outside influence of drugs, alcohol, gangs, and other negative influences.

See, I cannot really buy into this. My parents were gone alot and when the old man was around, he made life hell. My brother and I turned out fine. I don't believe the kids or anyone else should blame somebody other than themselves for their being a f*ck up. Yea, we can say that a bad childhood made them act out, but that's not true. At everyone's core, they understand the difference between right and wrong. Some call it conscience, others see it as something religious, but it is all the same. A little voice inside that you must purposely ignore before doing the unthinkable.

[Guest]

One thing to remember

Alot of us kids (I'm only 24) are lucky enough to have been raised with respect, etc. I have learned that the disrespectful punk kids are actually the exception to the rule.

[Guest]

Bc...

You a fan of LTC Grossman, too? I borrowed his books from my brother when he got deployed to Iraq 1/12 Marines. He has a lot of great insight.

[NRM_Oz]

Fortunately, we have yet to experience any of these horrific events but it will only be a matter of time before a copy cat or bright spark will follow the same format in order to be in the news. I recently watched a Documentary of the Columbine shootings and how they were planned and executed by sick individuals and found that 9 years later we still have improved ourselves globally with the incident responses but we still have people who are staring into space saying "it won't happen to me" or "oh we need to keep this quiet or we will lose enrolments".

Do some video games contribute to violence ? Yes they do (but I never threw a barrel after playing Donkey Kong as a kid). But again parents are so far behind their kids in technology these days or would be surprised how much information is listed on sites like face book.

If you wanted to know about anything you found out in the playground or through the sports field - now you just google how to make drugs or a bomb or wipe out the school canteen (now that could be worth a medal for stopping that food being served to unsuspecting victims).

[Black Caesar]

Fortunately, we have yet to experience any of these horrific events but it will only be a matter of time before a copy cat or bright spark will follow the same format in order to be in the news.

???

Didn't Australia have one in 2002? The Monash University Shooting where a guy shot 7 or 8 people?

[NRM_Oz]

Yeah that was just before exams at the end of the year. I had to look it up to see the details again as he killed 2 and shot 8 in total, hitting 1 classroom only and firing without any sense at victims. Excuse my ignorance but I had forgotten that incident and it was students and faculty who disarmed him I know that much. It was in the Victorian Campus (same state as Maelstrom lives in).

I do know we had a scare last year at one of our university campuses (actually an old one of mine now used for Art) where a gunman was reported on campus (small campus) but precautions were taken and that was the end of the matter.

[Black Caesar]

The only reason I remembered it is because my 1st wife's last name was "Monash" LOL. Talk about bad memories....

[NRM_Oz]

BC thanks for reminding me of this incident because I just went and looked for it and found some stats done about shooting and the support of having armed citizens on campus, etc including school and college incidents. Hey I am all for it but I know the security is all privately run and whilst there should be LEO status (like a ranger) it costs too much money to follow through with the training but they are more interesting in chasing parking infractions because it brings an income in.

I am so glad your 1st wife name is not named after my college as her name would be `OPEN` University as all classes are through e-learning with 4 semesters /year (I will finish my degree in 2 1/2 years rather than the usual 3 years f/t using the campuses of various colleges for lectures).

[Aussie-SO]

Fortunately, we have yet to experience any of these horrific events

It may not be a school shooting spree but let's not forget the massacre at Port Aurthur in Tasmania April 28 1996.

Martin Bryant killed thirty-five men, women and children and wounded another thirty-seven making him the most notorious spree killer of all time.

This event led to gun laws in Australia being changed drastically $500 million was spent in a buyback of more than 600,000 guns.

[darkenna]

Alot of us kids (I'm only 24) are lucky enough to have been raised with respect, etc. I have learned that the disrespectful punk kids are actually the exception to the rule.

I'm not that much older than you... and I recall it being the other way around. The sheer amount of disrespect and bullying I grew up with scares me when I look back on it, and I can see myself traveling the path which would have lead me to being one of the crazy school shooters. I got lucky, and discovered a method for dealing with building rage.

Now I am a well-developed and productive member of adult society. (Which is a bit scary by itself!)

[Don of the Dead]

THE gunman behind the deadly Valentine's Day US university campus shooting rampage sported a freshly inked tattooed of a gruesome image from an Aussie horror movie franchise.

Steven Kazmierczak committed suicide after shooting dead five students and injuring several more at Northern Illinois University this week.

Disturbing tattoos etched onto Kazmierczak's arms, including the trademark doll from the Saw horror movies, were one of the few clues of the fresh-faced and well-liked 27-year-old student's troubled mindset, newsagency AP reports.

The Saw franchise is the blood-soaked brainchild of Australians Leigh Whannell and James Wan.

The franchise, which last year released its fourth instalment, features a sadistic serial killer named Jigsaw and has been a huge box office earner in the US and internationally.

Last month Kazmierczak visited Jason Dunavan who, along with other disturbing images, adorned Kazmierczak's arm with the image of the Saw doll, AP reported.

The horror icon is shown riding a tricycle through a pool of blood with images of bleeding cuts in the background.

Mr Dunavan told AP he was so proud of the Saw tattoo he enlarged a photo of it and placed it on a wall in his shop - a move he has since regretted.

"I don't know if I still want that picture on my wall," said Mr Dunavan.

The tattooist described Kazmierczak as timid and apologetic.

"He was really, really mousy," Mr Dunavan told AP.

Details are also slowly emerging of what is described as Kazmierczak's turbulent relationship with his on-again, off-again girlfriend and of time he spent in a mental health care facility, AP reports.

"Disturbing tattoos etched onto Kazmierczak's arms, including the trademark doll from the Saw horror movies, were one of the few clues of the fresh-faced and well-liked 27-year-old student's troubled mindset"

So being a Horror fan I have a troubled mindset? Its sad that some people simply look at what I take pleasure with in life and label people like me a nut.

(I'm about to vent, with pictures, so feel free to skip this post if ya want)

Horror is my escape. You all work in the same field as me, after a long day of dealing with assholes you'd LOVE to choke the life out of but don't because you are a professional and a decent human being, I like to go home, hang out in my "Basement of Dread" and watch people get chopped up. It helps me unwind and makes me feel better.
Here is my "Happy Place"


So according to these folks I should probably be watched, even thought I don't own a gun and am the type of guy who gets teared up at the end of the movie "The Iron Giant" (and by teared up I mean bawl like a baby)

Everyone stay away from the scary man!

[N. A. Corbier]

Your happy place is creepy, but isn't disturbing to me.

[Curtis Baillie]

Don Of The Dead - Here's a link that should make you even happier.

http://www.halloweenadventure.com/