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The Dark Side of Illegal Immigration

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  • integrator97
    replied
    Originally posted by sgtnewby View Post
    Did you read the links?

    "the "common machine-readable technology" required by the REAL ID Act would convert state-issued driver licenses and identification cards into tracking devices, allowing computers to note and record people's whereabouts each time they are identified"

    "the requirement that states maintain databases of information about their citizens and residents and then share this personal information with all other states will expose every state to the information security weaknesses of every other state and threaten the privacy of every American"
    Yes, though I don't put 100% stock in wickpedia. It's not an accurate source, especially for controversial things.

    I haven't seen anything from a reliable source to confirm they will track you. There aren't going to be tracking chips. And lets see, you will have to use it to get on a plane or enter a courthouse. I kinda think they already have access to that information, assuming you're not travelling under a false id. How often do you use your DL now, where it is swiped? How often do your use a debit or credit card? A pike pass? If they wanted to track you, they could.

    And common machine readable technology? Like the magnetic stripe on the back of my DL for the past 10 years or more?

    What kind of information do you think they're going to have? Your picture, to make sure you are that person. This will make it harder to travel under a false identity, or to use false id to gain a job, a loan, etc. I don't think they're going to have a whole database like a credit report, etc. Besides, they already have all that, through the credit bureaus.

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  • sgtnewby
    replied
    Originally posted by integrator97 View Post
    Right. Like making sure you are who you say you are, when you get or renew your license. For instance, they would have to check birth certificates. Well, my brother was just ordering his, because he renews next month in Missouri, and they now require it and it can't be just a hospital one, has to be from the county. And Missouri is opposing real id.

    So again I ask, what super secret info are they requiring that the government doesn't already have? I've seen none.
    Did you read the links?

    "the "common machine-readable technology" required by the REAL ID Act would convert state-issued driver licenses and identification cards into tracking devices, allowing computers to note and record people's whereabouts each time they are identified"

    "the requirement that states maintain databases of information about their citizens and residents and then share this personal information with all other states will expose every state to the information security weaknesses of every other state and threaten the privacy of every American"
    Last edited by sgtnewby; 01-13-2008, 10:40 PM.

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  • integrator97
    replied
    Originally posted by sgtnewby View Post
    Chertoff stated that there was a "menu" of security verifications pertaining to info that states can choose from to be in compliance.

    http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080111/D8U3VK8O0.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/REAL_ID_Act
    Right. Like making sure you are who you say you are, when you get or renew your license. For instance, they would have to check birth certificates. Well, my brother was just ordering his, because he renews next month in Missouri, and they now require it and it can't be just a hospital one, has to be from the county. And Missouri is opposing real id.

    So again I ask, what super secret info are they requiring that the government doesn't already have? I've seen none.

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  • sgtnewby
    replied
    Originally posted by integrator97 View Post

    What private information will you be giving that you don't give now? Your picture? No, they already do that. Oh your social. They got that now too. Fingerprint? Nope. But some states already do.
    Chertoff stated that there was a "menu" of security verifications pertaining to info that states can choose from to be in compliance.

    http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080111/D8U3VK8O0.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/REAL_ID_Act

    Leave a comment:


  • integrator97
    replied
    At least one of our cities, with the highest hispanic population, can and does enforce immigration laws.

    Although being born here makes them a citizen, it does not necessarily keep the parents here. I do know of at least 2 incidents last year, 1 in OK with one parent, the other in San Diego with both, where the parents were deported. BTW sgtnewby, in SD they owned a nice home in a nice neighborhood, had good jobs, and I imagine a drivers license. People made a big stink about seperating the kids. I say take em with you. Otherwise, too bad. They made the decision to break the law.

    What private information will you be giving that you don't give now? Your picture? No, they already do that. Oh your social. They got that now too. Fingerprint? Nope. But some states already do.

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  • Chucky
    replied
    Please bring back the Brazilian Donut girls

    In Ma. the feds had almost all the Brazilians removed from Dunkin Donuts depending on their work status. You may think that is a good thing but I don't. I start early in the morning and became spoiled with the friendly smile of the pretty girls from Ipanema. They were anxious to help you. The other day I stopped by for my morning Joe and was confronted by a behemoth leaning over the counter. I felt like I should have apologized to her for waking her fat butt up and having to actually make me a cup of coffee. No good morning, no smile. Please bring back the Brazilian Donut girls.

    Leave a comment:


  • NRM_Oz
    replied
    I was in California in 1994 on holidays when I heard of (excuse my knowledge) proclamation ____ dealing with illegals who had kids born in the USA and their rights to use public services, like schools, etc. Might have been Proclamation 187 ?

    I recall it was a major talking point amongst the hotel staff and people we oveheard them talking about it around the place. Again excuse my limited knowledge, but I do recall that children who were BORN in the USA were recognised as US citizens even though their parents were illegal immigrants / aliens. Whilst no1 wants to see a child suffer, it is another back door into obtaining entry illegally.

    At the same time that weirdo Susan Smith (who killed her 4 kids by drowning them in her car) was on the news. Week 1 we had all the do gooders all holding handings singing Kum-ba-yah and praying for her suffering (day 1 of the news I spotted her eyes - SHE DID IT). Week 2 she was charged with murder ............ how people felt so gullible.

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  • sgtnewby
    replied
    There is only 1 presidential candidate that wants to end "birthright" citizenship and actually secure the borders before taking on any kind of immigration reform. Please read the statement from the link;

    http://www.ronpaul2008.com/issues/bo...ration-reform/

    Then there's McCain, who is for amnesty;

    http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/...0dd8416efa.htm

    Rudy, who supports the REAL ID Act;

    http://www.joinrudy2008.com/issues/

    Romney wants to reform immigration policy before he secures the border;

    http://www.mittromney.com/Issues/immigration

    I think Ron Paul has the best idea...

    Leave a comment:


  • flashlightcop509
    replied
    WARNING.. SLIGHT RANT
    I remember talking to my Father a few years ago who lives in Connecticut, that he read or heard someplace that in Danbury, CT alone there are an estimated 20,000 illegal immigrants; that was a major factor in me relocating to Vermont over 10 years ago... Not placing blame entirely on that, but after living most of my life in a place where people spoke english and (for the most part) respected the laws, the inundation of statistically wise, non - caucasian, illegal US citizens who found a safe haven of sorts just turned me off... Going from being a small child walking down Main St. with your parents at 6 years old, meeting/greeting and understanding a passerby in your native tongue, to 30 years later, walking or driving along the same street and being completely freaking lost to 90% of the population's conversation...

    Apparently, the illegals who were caught were found with ersatz smuggling route maps specifically naming Danbury as a final destination... I was born and raised in Bethel/Danbury area, and obviously during my formative years ('68 - '76 or so), immigration, the so called "language barrier", and ethnic isolation didn't really exsist. For the most part, the the population from 1964 until 1974 was likely upwards of 80% ethnic caucasians, and anyone not falling into either category that lived there had still done so by legal means...

    IMHO? Illegal? don't give one inch... Call ICE or whoever, send the illegals back ASAP; And, charge those frequent and local companies who hire "day workers" with not conforming to US employment laws... Illegals are NOT registered with the US Gov't in any way and as such pretty much don't exsist on record here, nevermind the thought "anchor babies" born in the US to illegals who automatically exempt the child and parents to deportation...

    Leave a comment:


  • sgtnewby
    replied
    Originally posted by integrator97 View Post
    And most illegal immigrants, over the long haul, get real jobs, usually using false documents. This will, hopefully, eliminate some of that. Especially if they're tied to INS and other databases.

    Then they need to enact laws for fast deportation. I am a strong opponent of illegal immigration.
    Illegal immigrants are not tied to the INS, that's why they are referred to as "undocumented workers." And, Arizona is the only state that currently has a law that states "any business that employs 'undocumented workers' will have a 10 day suspension of their business lisence, a second offense, the business will lose their lisence completely." I was speaking to a Minneapolis cop last night about this very subject, and their department policy states that they can not ask someone about their immigration status. There is no federal law against it, but this sort of policy is reflected throughout the country. So, if people are not serious enough about enforcing immigration laws, why should my rights be infringed upon by being required to have a REAL ID? The government has no right to my personal information, which is a requirement of the REAL ID act.

    I'm not implying that you don't oppose illegal immigration, but I think support for the REAL ID Act is insane. And, a lot of states think that way also. Unfortunately, I don't live in one of the states that has passed a law to not participate in the REAL ID Act, yet....
    Last edited by sgtnewby; 01-13-2008, 04:11 PM.

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  • integrator97
    replied
    Originally posted by sgtnewby View Post
    When have you ever heard of a criminal obeying the law in order to break laws????? As far as illegal immigrants are concerned, they didn't wait in line like my sister-in-law did to come here. By comming here illegally to begin with, what is it that makes you think for one second that they will comply with the REAL ID laws? Chertoff said in a statement yesterday that the REAL ID will be required to board domestic flights and enter federal buildings. How many illegals do you think are taking domestic flights or entering federal buildings? I would think that illegals would do everything they could to avoid them. So who is it then that the REAL ID affects? THE LAW ABIDING, CITIZEN TAX PAYERS.

    It's a lot like states or countries that ban citizens from legally carrying handguns. All you accomplish is disarming your law abiding public. The kids at Columbine didn't have carry permits, but they still killed a lot of people. Virginia Tech? No carry permit. The church shooter in Colorado? Again, no carry permit. My point is that criminals don't pay attention to the law, so why create laws that infringe on law abiding citizens lifes? Constitution, anyone?
    Actually my point was in regards to visitors overstaying their visas. Sooner or later, they have to use id, whether they are stopped, or apply for a job. Currently they get a drivers license or whatever, for the length they are issued, say 4 years. But they're on a 2 years student visa. Then they walk in 4 years later, and get a new one. Hmmm, good system.

    And most illegal immigrants, over the long haul, get real jobs, usually using false documents. This will, hopefully, eliminate some of that. Especially if they're tied to INS and other databases.

    Then they need to enact laws for fast deportation. I am a strong opponent of illegal immigration.

    Are one of those I referred to, waiting for the perfect system?

    Leave a comment:


  • sgtnewby
    replied
    Originally posted by integrator97 View Post
    The new "Real ID" card here in the states is supposed to help prevent that problem. It's going to take years to implement, but it's going to help. A lot of detractors, with mainly lousy arguments against though. The type of people who want nothing unless it's perfect, so therefore never want anything.
    When have you ever heard of a criminal obeying the law in order to break laws????? As far as illegal immigrants are concerned, they didn't wait in line like my sister-in-law did to come here. By comming here illegally to begin with, what is it that makes you think for one second that they will comply with the REAL ID laws? Chertoff said in a statement yesterday that the REAL ID will be required to board domestic flights and enter federal buildings. How many illegals do you think are taking domestic flights or entering federal buildings? I would think that illegals would do everything they could to avoid them. So who is it then that the REAL ID affects? THE LAW ABIDING, CITIZEN TAX PAYERS.

    It's a lot like states or countries that ban citizens from legally carrying handguns. All you accomplish is disarming your law abiding public. The kids at Columbine didn't have carry permits, but they still killed a lot of people. Virginia Tech? No carry permit. The church shooter in Colorado? Again, no carry permit. My point is that criminals don't pay attention to the law, so why create laws that infringe on law abiding citizens lifes? Constitution, anyone?
    Last edited by sgtnewby; 01-13-2008, 05:28 AM.

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  • NRM_Oz
    replied
    I was reading an online article about the new drivers licences to assist with new flying restrictions for ID in the near future. Ironically, my last business trip for work had me walk into the airport, show NO ID, and walk onto a flight with just my work bag - it was a day trip up and back and the same coming home. So much for security risks in Australia huh ?

    I know the do-gooders are going to call it big brother overkill and with the likes of the new smart-chip passports coming into issue in the USA, it is what we have to live by thanks to a changing world.

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  • integrator97
    replied
    Originally posted by NRM_Oz View Post
    The number of people who overstay their visa's is incredible and I am sure the USA has a never-ending battle to locate and deport these people.
    The new "Real ID" card here in the states is supposed to help prevent that problem. It's going to take years to implement, but it's going to help. A lot of detractors, with mainly lousy arguments against though. The type of people who want nothing unless it's perfect, so therefore never want anything.

    Leave a comment:


  • NRM_Oz
    replied
    I agree with you blokes in your posts - we have the problem here with boat people coming into our waters fishing and dropping off refugees to make the trip worthwhile. Yes those who come into the country illegally could be god knows who hiding behind an alias or something else and bringing their crimes to another country. Our security laws have been changed making it harder for non-residents to work here for more than 20 hours a week but of course if you are willing to work for cash then no-one needs to know right ?

    WRONG - whilst you might work for $15.00 / hr, the bloke who does the right thing is missing out on earning $38.00 / hr as per the award rates. People from other countries who become involved in crimes are rarely prosecuted here as well, as the do gooders will come in and say - oh poor little people may not want to go back home now. The number of people who overstay their visa's is incredible and I am sure the USA has a never-ending battle to locate and deport these people.

    Leave a comment:

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