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  • Armed customer thwarts grocery robbery

    Here is another reason we all need to carry even off duty (unless you work in Illinois where the state hates guns). My question is where was store security?

    A 51-year-old man stopped a masked man from robbing a Southside grocery store and held him at gunpoint until police arrived.

    Charlie Merrell was in checkout line at Bucks IGA Supermarket, 3015 S. Meridian St., when a masked man jumped a nearby counter and held a gun on a store employee at 5:17 p.m. Monday, according to a police report made public today.

    While the suspect was demanding cash from the workers, the police report states that Merrell pulled his own handgun, pointed it at the robber and ordered him to put down his weapon.

    When the suspect hesitated, Merrell racked the slide on his gun to load a round in the chamber, Officer Jason Bockting wrote in the report.
    The suspect placed his gun and a bag of cash on the counter, dropping some of the money, police said. The suspect removed his mask and lay on the floor. Merrell held the suspect at gunpoint until officers arrived and took him away in handcuffs.

    Merrell had a valid permit to carry the handgun, police said. Police recovered an unloaded .380-caliber handgun from the suspect and $779 in cash, according to the report.

    Dwain Smith, 19, was arrested on initial charges of robbery, criminal confinement, pointing a firearm, battery and carrying a handgun without a license. Smith remained held this morning in the Marion County Jail with bond set at $30,000, records show.
    http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dl...=2008801020457
    Support bacteria. They're the only culture some people have.

  • #2
    While the suspect was demanding cash from the workers, the police report states that Merrell pulled his own handgun, pointed it at the robber and ordered him to put down his weapon.

    When the suspect hesitated, Merrell racked the slide on his gun to load a round in the chamber, Officer Jason Bockting wrote in the report.
    ****ing dumb****. Pull your weapon, and point it at someone holding a gun, and not have a round in the chamber? What would've happened had the suspect turned and shot upon seeing the customer's gun? One dead wannabee hero, and one bad guy with two guns.

    Merrell had a valid permit to carry the handgun, police said. Police recovered an unloaded .380-caliber handgun from the suspect and $779 in cash, according to the report.
    On second thought, since both of them had unloaded guns (yes, I'd consider the customer's unloaded). maybe they should've had a contest who could get into battery first. Rob a store with an unloaded gun...

    If you're going to carry a concealed weapon (or open carry), for God's sake, do it right.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by buck View Post
      My question is where was store security?
      An (armed) robber versus what was probably a WBS guard or two? They were probably 'observing and reporting' while running as fast as possible in the opposite direction.

      And crying.

      Comment


      • #4
        People of the security world, read this and learn a little here, things were not handled well by anybody involved in this incident, especially the apparent GOOD GUY.

        He's lucky to be alive.

        Comment


        • #5
          Amen - every gun MUST be treated as loaded and ready to fire. I have NEVER had a firearm for duty and not had it cocked and locked or racked and ready (whatever term you use) as this is a perfectly legal carry provided you are licenced and can justify your CCW or use on duty. A bloke with a .38 revolver pointed at your head has the jump on someone with ANY firearm holstered. Some of our LE contributors will know how a nervours person with ANY weapon can sometimes be unpredictable. Amen again that the victim was not shot in the process.
          "Keep your friends close and your enemies even closer" Sun Tzu

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          • #6
            Agreed. Awful move by the 'hero'.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by OccamsRazor View Post
              An (armed) robber versus what was probably a WBS guard or two? They were probably 'observing and reporting' while running as fast as possible in the opposite direction.

              And crying.
              Beat me to it, e:fb;

              See also: Company policy to not antagonize an armed robber, but to fall back and call 911 and allow the police to do their job. Sally the cashier, who is about to get her brains blown out, is not why you are out there. You are out there to protect the client's property, not the people.
              Some Kind of Commando Leader

              "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally Posted by buck
                My question is where was store security?

                I didn't see anywhere in the article that the store had a security guard. If the store had their own LP staff, I highly doubt it they would of been armed.
                Retail Security Consultant / Expert Witness
                Co-Author - Effective Security Management 6th Edition

                Contributor to Retail Crime, Security and Loss Prevention: An Encyclopedic Reference

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by N. A. Corbier View Post
                  Beat me to it, e:fb;

                  See also: Company policy to not antagonize an armed robber, but to fall back and call 911 and allow the police to do their job. Sally the cashier, who is about to get her brains blown out, is not why you are out there. You are out there to protect the client's property, not the people.
                  Many S.O.'s are expected, and are contracted, to protect life as well as property.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by OccamsRazor View Post
                    ****ing dumb****. Pull your weapon, and point it at someone holding a gun, and not have a round in the chamber? What would've happened had the suspect turned and shot upon seeing the customer's gun? One dead wannabee hero, and one bad guy with two guns.
                    He could have been carrying a single-action auto. Some people who carry single-action autos just don't feel safe carrying them cocked and locked. Maybe he is one of those people.

                    Personally, if I wasn't providing security for the store, I wouldn't have pulled my personal weapon at all, unless the bad guy was going to shoot ME. Minnesota has weird laws protecting criminals, and there is no law protecting us from lawsuits if we shoot someone, even in clear-cut cases of self-defense.
                    Last edited by Badge714; 01-07-2008, 08:23 AM.
                    "Striking terrific terror in the hearts of criminals everywhere" Since 1977.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Badge714 View Post
                      He could have been carrying a single-action auto. Some people who carry single-action autos just don't feel safe carrying them cocked and locked. Maybe he is one of those people.
                      No offense, but anyone who doesn't feel safe with the gun they're carrying shouldn't be carrying that gun. Period. Expecially if they plan on the possibility of someday using that gun to defend themselves or others.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        This post is a positive enforcement of my preferance for revolvers. The guy would not have had to chamber a round ! I also think that his use of aweapon was questionable, given the fact that the perp already was pointing his weapon. To me, that was extremely poor judgment and could have ended very badly. In cases such as this, better to get good discription and direction of travel.
                        Murphy was an optomist.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Badge714 View Post
                          Minnesota has weird laws protecting criminals, and there is no law protecting us from lawsuits if we shoot someone, even in clear-cut cases of self-defense.
                          In fact there is a law in minnesota that protects you in case of civil prosecution. It specifically points out that the defender is not liable for any injury to the criminal if what the defender did was legal and justified (read just becasue you can doen't mean you should). It also states that even if the criminal (or should we say alledged criminal to stay PC) dies the famliy or representatives for the alledge criminal can not recover monitary damages on behalf of the criminal or their family.

                          Here it is:

                          611A.08 BARRING PERPETRATORS OF CRIMES FROM RECOVERING FOR
                          INJURIES SUSTAINED DURING CRIMINAL CONDUCT.
                          Subdivision 1. Definitions. As used in this section:
                          (1) "perpetrator" means a person who has engaged in criminal conduct and includes a person
                          convicted of a crime;
                          (2) "victim" means a person who was the object of another's criminal conduct and includes a
                          person at the scene of an emergency who gives reasonable assistance to another person who is
                          exposed to or has suffered grave physical harm;
                          (3) "course of criminal conduct" includes the acts or omissions of a victim in resisting
                          criminal conduct; and
                          (4) "convicted" includes a finding of guilt, whether or not the adjudication of guilt is stayed
                          or executed, an unwithdrawn judicial admission of guilt or guilty plea, a no contest plea, a
                          judgment of conviction, an adjudication as a delinquent child, an admission to a juvenile
                          delinquency petition, or a disposition as an extended jurisdiction juvenile.
                          Subd. 2. Perpetrator's assumption of the risk. A perpetrator assumes the risk of loss,
                          injury, or death resulting from or arising out of a course of criminal conduct involving a violent
                          crime, as defined in this section, engaged in by the perpetrator or an accomplice, as defined in
                          section 609.05, and the crime victim is immune from and not liable for any civil damages as a
                          result of acts or omissions of the victim if the victim used reasonable force as authorized in
                          section 609.06 or 609.065.
                          Subd. 3. Evidence. Notwithstanding other evidence which the victim may adduce relating
                          to the perpetrator's conviction of the violent crime involving the parties to the civil action, a
                          certified copy of: a guilty plea; a court judgment of guilt; a court record of conviction as specified
                          in section 599.24, 599.25, or 609.041; an adjudication as a delinquent child; or a disposition
                          as an extended jurisdiction juvenile pursuant to section 260B.130 is conclusive proof of the
                          perpetrator's assumption of the risk.
                          Subd. 4. Attorney's fees to victim. If the perpetrator does not prevail in a civil action that
                          is subject to this section, the court may award reasonable expenses, including attorney's fees
                          and disbursements, to the victim.
                          Subd. 5. Stay of civil action. Except to the extent needed to preserve evidence, any civil
                          action in which the defense set forth in subdivision 1 or 2 is raised shall be stayed by the court
                          on the motion of the defendant during the pendency of any criminal action against the plaintiff
                          based on the alleged violent crime.
                          Subd. 6. Violent crime; definition. For purposes of this section, "violent crime" means
                          an offense named in sections 609.185; 609.19; 609.195; 609.20; 609.205; 609.221; 609.222;
                          609.223; 609.2231; 609.24; 609.245; 609.25; 609.255; 609.342; 609.343; 609.344; 609.345;
                          609.561; 609.562; 609.563; and 609.582, or an attempt to commit any of these offenses. "Violent
                          crime" includes crimes in other states or jurisdictions which would have been within the definition
                          set forth in this subdivision if they had been committed in this state.
                          Last edited by LiveNlearn; 01-07-2008, 12:13 PM.
                          Wisdom - Having a lot to say, but knowing when to keep it to yourself.

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                          • #14
                            Glad the miscreant was stopped in his tracks!

                            Which begs a question... actualy more of a statement...

                            This past week, I had to attend a Supervisor's meeting at the company's office; yadayadayada, same old O&R bs, appearance in uniform, response times and the like... at sometime during the presentation, I mentioned how I was waiting for my Wife to order my level IIIA body armor...

                            Well, didn't the chiding begin...

                            "You don't need body armor"
                            "You're in charge of a mall, whaddaya need that stuff for?"
                            "The mall management is gonna laugh their ass off at you"

                            And....

                            Exactly how may people were killed or injured about 2 months ago in a central US mall when some wingnut decided to go on a shooting spree?

                            See, my thing is here in Vermont, there are no rules saying you CAN'T carry a firearm, concealed or otherwise, unless in a bank or post office...

                            I'm just picturing the day that some guy wigs out, throws a .45 or .357 on his side, comes into MY mall, and decides to have a meltdown...

                            I wonder after that, how many of the other Officers in the aforementioned meeting are going to be like, "Er, Um, well... maybe the bullet proof vest wasn't such a bad idea after all..."

                            If I can't carry anything on duty that throws bullets, then by God, I'm gonna be wearing something that STOPS bullets...
                            “Two wrongs don't make a right, but three rights make a left”
                            "I swear to God, I'm going to pistol whip the next guy that says 'Shenanigans' "... Capt. O'Hagan, "Super Troopers"

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by OccamsRazor View Post
                              No offense, but anyone who doesn't feel safe with the gun they're carrying shouldn't be carrying that gun. Period. Expecially if they plan on the possibility of someday using that gun to defend themselves or others.
                              I couldn't agree with you more!!!
                              Last year I bought a Beretta 92f, and found it difficult to operate the safety/decocker with my short fat thumbs. I didn't feel comfortable carrying it on duty, so I went back to my .357 revolver until I sold the 92f and bought a S&W M&P 9mm. No safety or decocker to mess with.. Problem solved!
                              "Striking terrific terror in the hearts of criminals everywhere" Since 1977.

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