Undercover Ops...

[UtahProtectionForce]

I know many companies offer these as part of their packages, but i am wondering if anyone actually, has worked an undercover assignement as a security officer ?

[SecTrainer]

I know many companies offer these as part of their packages, but i am wondering if anyone actually, has worked an undercover assignement as a security officer ?

Yo.

[UtahProtectionForce]

okay, i see that you have SC, anyone else ? btw did you ever get badged will working uncle charlie ?

[flashlightcop509]

Only if you consider surveillance from your personal vehicle UC...

After hours, I'll routinely park my marked patrol car and switch to my P.O.V., and set up a watch point at various locations at my sites; If anyone's going to do something they shouldn't be doing, better to be inconspicuous and catch them in the process than to have them see "Security" in big reflective letters on the side of my vehicle... Granted, that in itself would be a deterrent, but I'm more concerned with actually nabbing them red handed and NOT'ing them (depending on the circumstance), or calling PD to arrest them...

[CorpSec]

Only if you consider surveillance from your personal vehicle UC...

After hours, I'll routinely park my marked patrol car and switch to my P.O.V., and set up a watch point at various locations at my sites; If anyone's going to do something they shouldn't be doing, better to be inconspicuous and catch them in the process than to have them see "Security" in big reflective letters on the side of my vehicle... Granted, that in itself would be a deterrent, but I'm more concerned with actually nabbing them red handed and NOT'ing them (depending on the circumstance), or calling PD to arrest them...

I understand where you are coming from with that point of view, but I would be real careful since that is treading in some murky waters. What if you get in an accident while on duty in your own vehicle? Your insurance company might not pay up since you were using the vehicle in the course of your employment. You company's insurance company might also have some issues with that as long as the contract stipulated a site provided patrol vehicle.

I know I sometimes lean towards your way of thinking that it is best to catch them in the act and "bring them to justice". Although our job in security is most often to be proactive and stop things from happening in the first place.

A large reason your site spent the money to purchase, decal, and equip a patrol vehicle is most likely to deter issues from happening in the first place. By switching to your P.O.V. you may very well be undermining your client's security plan.

Has your management and the client signed off on your approach?

[HotelSecurity]

My first 15 or so years were undercover. It was the last days of the Hotel Detective. Hotels felt having visable security would scare their guests, The problem was all the bad guys knew who we wore, we were not fooling anyone. To this day I still don't wear a real uniform but now I am idenfied with a badge on a chain around my neck or clipped to my pocket.

[N. A. Corbier]

Your firm also has to ensure that you're still performing security services, and not private investigator services. Fines and badness ensue if you're no longer protecting, and begin investigating.

[SecTrainer]

okay, i see that you have SC, anyone else ? btw did you ever get badged will working uncle charlie ?

Nope. Why would anyone badge a shrub?

[flashlightcop509]

When I use my car, I'm always stationary in a parking lot, where I can see entry being make into an area; I'm particularly concerned with the villages that have outdoor pools and hot tubs, with nothing more than a 4 ft. fence around them... I've a couple people in mind who I'd looove to catch again in in the hot tub, as they had been caught and warned once this past May (at 0315 no less, the area closed at 2200), and issue them an NOT for 2 years. I'm also 99.5% sure these are the same people in my post about site authority. And if found again, I know they aren't going to give me their ID, and we have an excellent working relationship with the town Constables and VSP... Bet they wouldn't say no to a PD request for ID...

Most times I'm set up well after 2400, when other vehicle traffic is negligible at best, (this is small town VT, BTW) so I'm not concerned with accidents since where I park (along a treeline on the edge of a not so well lit area of a parking lot, and my Jeep is dark green )

My Supervisor is well aware that I occasionally use my POV for such watch points; There has been no backlash or disapproval from either Him or the Client regarding this...

I know I sometimes lean towards your way of thinking that it is best to catch them in the act and "bring them to justice". Although our job in security is most often to be proactive and stop things from happening in the first place.

True enough, but at my site, the exciting stuff usually happens after the local bars close at 0230, and by then my shift is down to 2 Officers, and the 2nd Officer is usually in the officer by 0310 to type his report and be off duty at 0400; And I'm extremely unforgiving of folks who circumvent policies designed for their safety at the resort, especially in light of the drowning incident at my site I posted about last year... I'd much rather catch someone trying to gain access to the pool/spa area and educate them against further attempts or outright NOT them if they aren't guests, then to conduct a property check after the fact and find a non responsive floater in the pool... Remember, that time of morning all trespass incidents are 99% of the time alcohol related, and last thing I want is someone who has been drinking beer for 6 hours with a BAC of maybe .175, to get into a 105 degree hot tub at 3 o'clock in the morning, pass out/fall asleep, and not be found until someone from Property Mgmt. shows up 4 hours later to find a dead person in their hot tub....

[SecTrainer]

Your firm also has to ensure that you're still performing security services, and not private investigator services. Fines and badness ensue if you're no longer protecting, and begin investigating.

This isn't my understanding.

1. Any company (in any industry) has a right to conduct its own internal investigations related to its own business operations and assets (for instance, applicant backgrounds, workplace violence, harassment, internal theft, policy violations, fraud, etc.) without any special licensing when the investigators are company employees. For instance, the SIU (special investigations unit) of an insurance or credit card company does not require PI licensing.

2. If you're talking about a security service contractor doing investigations for a client, it depends on the type of investigation. I believe that most states recognize that certain types of investigations (e.g., internal theft) are a necessary part of the security function, and for such investigations PI licensing is not required so long as it's necessary to fulfill the terms of a security contract.

What you may not do as a security service contractor without separate PI licensing is to contract specifically to provide clients with investigative services apart from security services.

All of that being said, I'm sure that some states probably do want that PI licensing revenue and will take a dim view of "security investigations" without the license.

[Ron Jessee]

depending on the state of course- is there any sidearms involved in UC for security? And if so does it involve a CHL while on duty?