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  • Fell into some hot water...

    So apparently Im in a tad bit of hot water at the BHR for a recent contact where I patted someone down for my safety. We had a couple guys camping behind our property (a locked mental evaluation and treatment center). Well we (my partner and I) ended up making contact with one of the men camping down there who wandered onto our property. Apparently BHR doesnt appreciate me patting this guy down.

    As this incident blows over a little more I'll release more info about what's happening.

    I will say this guy was just recently in the paper after he apparently got into a knife fight with his son not more than 24hrs after I contacted him.
    "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
    "The Curve" 1998

  • #2
    Originally posted by BHR Lawson View Post
    So apparently Im in a tad bit of hot water at the BHR for a recent contact where I patted someone down for my safety. We had a couple guys camping behind our property (a locked mental evaluation and treatment center). Well we (my partner and I) ended up making contact with one of the men camping down there who wandered onto our property. Apparently BHR doesnt appreciate me patting this guy down.

    As this incident blows over a little more I'll release more info about what's happening.

    I will say this guy was just recently in the paper after he apparently got into a knife fight with his son not more than 24hrs after I contacted him.


    I know company policy may be more restrictive, but don't we have the Supreme Court on our side when it comes to pat downs for weapons?
    ATTN. SPECOPS AND GECKO45 my secret username is CIDDECEP and I am your S2. My authorization code is Six Wun Quebec Oscar Fife. Your presence here is tactically dangerous and compromises our overall mission parameter. Cease and desist all activity on this board. Our “enemies” are deft at computer hacking and may trace you back to our primary locale. You have forced me to compromise my situation to protect your vulnerable flank. This issue will be addressed later.

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    • #3
      Did the subject consent to a patdown search?

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by BHR Lawson View Post
        So apparently Im in a tad bit of hot water at the BHR for a recent contact where I patted someone down for my safety. We had a couple guys camping behind our property (a locked mental evaluation and treatment center). Well we (my partner and I) ended up making contact with one of the men camping down there who wandered onto our property. Apparently BHR doesnt appreciate me patting this guy down.

        As this incident blows over a little more I'll release more info about what's happening.

        I will say this guy was just recently in the paper after he apparently got into a knife fight with his son not more than 24hrs after I contacted him.
        Did you SEARCH (go into his pockets, wallet, etc.) him, or did you conduct a TERRY search (staying outside of all pockets)?
        "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

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        • #5
          Better question: Was this person under custodial arrest (search incident to arrest), or does your state authorize you to make terry searches?

          Remember, most states do not allow private citizens to commit battery/assault by conducting non-consensual searches of others. Ohio vs. Terry applies to government agents, not private citizens.

          Search incident to Arrest is usually authorized if you are placing someone under citizen's arrest.
          Some Kind of Commando Leader

          "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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          • #6
            You would need to have some type of reasonable, articulable suspicion that the subject was armed and posed a threat, but even then you are in a gray area depending on state law and what your status is under the law not to mention what your duties and responsabilities are under company policy.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by BHR Lawson View Post
              So apparently Im in a tad bit of hot water at the BHR for a recent contact where I patted someone down for my safety. We had a couple guys camping behind our property (a locked mental evaluation and treatment center). Well we (my partner and I) ended up making contact with one of the men camping down there who wandered onto our property. Apparently BHR doesnt appreciate me patting this guy down.

              As this incident blows over a little more I'll release more info about what's happening.

              I will say this guy was just recently in the paper after he apparently got into a knife fight with his son not more than 24hrs after I contacted him.


              How did your employer know you did the pat down, just curious?
              ATTN. SPECOPS AND GECKO45 my secret username is CIDDECEP and I am your S2. My authorization code is Six Wun Quebec Oscar Fife. Your presence here is tactically dangerous and compromises our overall mission parameter. Cease and desist all activity on this board. Our “enemies” are deft at computer hacking and may trace you back to our primary locale. You have forced me to compromise my situation to protect your vulnerable flank. This issue will be addressed later.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Minneapolis Security View Post
                How did your employer know you did the pat down, just curious?
                From what he told me he detained him for trespassing and got consent to do a pat down for his safety.
                "Get yourself a shovel cause your in deep Sh*t"

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by bigdog View Post
                  From what he told me he detained him for trespassing and got consent to do a pat down for his safety.
                  Then the company may be flipping out about him "touching" someone else.
                  Some Kind of Commando Leader

                  "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by talon View Post
                    You would need to have some type of reasonable, articulable suspicion that the subject was armed and posed a threat, but even then you are in a gray area depending on state law and what your status is under the law not to mention what your duties and responsabilities are under company policy.
                    Maryland is nothing, but a gray area state. It's ridiculous!
                    "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

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                    • #11
                      He actually consented. I asked him, "Do you mind if I pat you down real quick just make sure you dont have any weapons?" and he agreed to let me pat him down so I have good consent.

                      My employer found out because I added the fact I did a pat-down in my report.

                      It was not a search, it was a pat down, I quickly ran my hands over his pockets and clothing real quick to make sure he didnt have anything in there. I didnt reach into his pockets, just over them.

                      I never actually had him "detained" until the police dispatcher said the police want us to hold him.

                      My boss seems mad because the police have said, "That is our role, not yours"
                      "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
                      "The Curve" 1998

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        *sigh* How DARE you protect yourself and those around you from potential harm by curtailing the rights of tresspassers and squatters.
                        sigpicMy ideal security vehicle and uniforms:

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                        • #13
                          I sent a tad bit of a "snap-back" email to my boss with a link to this news article. http://www.theolympian.com/news/story/202467.html

                          That was the guy who I contacted. His son said he pulled a knife on him.

                          I used a "less-than-nice" tone, but was still cordial.

                          I will check my email tonight to see what is going on and update here.
                          "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
                          "The Curve" 1998

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Well hopefully you dont become "The Poster Formerly Known as BHR Lawson"
                            SecurityProfessional is Back up and running!

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Ron Jessee View Post
                              *sigh* How DARE you protect yourself and those around you from potential harm by curtailing the rights of tresspassers and squatters.
                              Yeah!! What Ron Jessee said!!

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