Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Private Security and Terrorism

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • junkyarddog
    replied
    Originally posted by SecTrainer View Post
    I understand the "business" arguments but I think they're flawed. Security actually could be much more expensive than it is now and, assuming it were also better because of more professionalism, still add to the bottom line, not detract from it. In fact, cheap security that does not achieve its mission is what's really expensive.
    To be honest and straightforward, to know whether cheap security is really more expensive would require looking at the actual profit/loss sheets for companies that use security.

    My opinion is that, like most other issues regarding business, especially big business, short term profitability is likely high while long term profitability suffers. In other words, the quarterly reports to share holders look good because insurance premiums and liability are low, but a serious critical study of the books would show a serious profit loss accumulating over the long term. But that is a "corporate culture" issue that affects everything, not just security.

    To get anything done NOW- at least within a few years time- the gvt has to get involved.

    On a side note, one of my patrols takes me directly through the down town area of the city I work in. The place is crawling with security officers. If these were scaled according to level of security, and readily identifiable to LE, emergency services etc. they could be a major asset in the case of any major natural or man made event.

    Leave a comment:


  • junkyarddog
    replied
    Originally posted by sgtnewby View Post
    Well said.
    Thank you!

    Leave a comment:


  • Chadly
    replied
    Well, it appears there are some steps being made to enhance a Mall Security Officer's abilities in regards to terrorism, and a possible attack. Albeit from the Shopping Center Industry itself, but its better than nothing.

    I am currently completing the training listed here:

    (the one at the bottom)

    From what Ive seen so far, its pretty decent training, including basic NIMS, the NAERG and various types of attacks a Shopping Center may incur. The training generally talks about signs and symptoms of various attacks (CBRNE), and the realization, that a Mall Security Officer may be the "first responder" for a terrorism Incident, thus pressing the acronym RAIN.

    Recognize
    Assess
    Isolate
    Notify

    Leave a comment:


  • talon
    replied
    Originally posted by Mr. Security View Post
    You don't have to be an FBI agent to detect suspicious activity such as individuals photographing the site, parked along the perimeter, and so forth.
    This is very true statement and remember that FBI is basically a 'wait till it happens then figure out how it happened, then tell everyone what they should have done and what they would have done if they knew it was gonna happen' type of Agency.

    Though they say that they are trying to be more proactive...a leopard doesn't change it's spots overnight and these LE agencies will take decades to change to meet the threat of today and by then we will have a new threat so they will need to change yet again always being a step behind where they should be.

    Don't buy into the hype LEA's will actually build up the threat if not actually stage an event just to make themselves look good and never mind 'bending the truth'.

    Where do most of us work? I have worked in the past ten years at the following...Schools, Large sporting events, Hospitals, Chemical plant, Concerts, Malls, Hotels/Motels and thats what I can remember off the top of my head...This is the hole that the private sector could and should be filling exept that no one is on the same page.


    I'm sure most people here can say the same thing and have worked at even more sensitive public and private places that are all "Critical Infrastructure" where you can actually have a mass casualty situation at a moments notice.

    These targets are all mostly protected by Private Security and we are the actual "first responders" for these places not the locals be they EMS or PD...we are there at these critical spots while the locals set up their 1000th speed trap and while these checkpoints are important would you think that maybe we could use some of the free training and equipment that the local have but won't need as soon as we will.

    Do you think that some of this equipment that is meant for "critical infrastructre" could actually be staged near the target areas?

    I know I will be attacked on this but I'm just keeping it real. I just get frustrated that all of the public agencies are so scared that they are not getting what the other guys have but we, us the Private guys don't have a shot at any new training or equipment most of the time while some little landlocked podunk town in the middle of nowhere will have a speedboat.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mr. Security
    replied
    Originally posted by john_harrington View Post
    Nathan,

    The SOs can be further trained in counter-terrorism. Each terrorist attack goes through a planning phase which includes surveillance. It is at that time- when the potential terrorists are surveilling your site that effective counter-surveillance can thwart an attack. Proper training includes count-surveillance techniques, security awareness, and safety.

    SOs need also to note that surveillance of their facility will likely start well outside of your actual perimeter.
    This is the key. It's also why simple O&R security can still be effective in thwarting attacks. You don't have to be an FBI agent to detect suspicious activity such as individuals photographing the site, parked along the perimeter, and so forth. The quicker you let them know they are under surveillance, the more likely they are to be discouraged from proceeding.

    Leave a comment:


  • john_harrington
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier View Post
    Ok, having a conversation over IM with someone with Valor Security about this.

    From what I understand, most of these anti-terrorism courses are the same thing that you learn in your security guard school: Observe, report, do not intervene.

    Florida's new four hour anti-terrorism course is instructor discretion. That means you can talk about anything related to "terrorism," which is to say... Another 4 hours of rehashing, "Observe, report, do not intervene."

    What is private security actually supposed to do against terrorists? This is not asked facetiously, I'd like to know what people's thoughts are on this.
    Nathan,

    The SOs can be further trained in counter-terrorism. Each terrorist attack goes through a planning phase which includes surveillance. It is at that time- when the potential terrorists are surveilling your site that effective counter-surveillance can thwart an attack. Proper training includes count-surveillance techniques, security awareness, and safety.

    SOs need also to note that surveillance of their facility will likely start well outside of your actual perimeter.

    Leave a comment:


  • wjohnc
    replied
    Originally posted by DarkMetalWolf View Post
    And there it is..........it is always about how much money it would take out of the CEOs pocket!
    Oh yeah! I once worked for a guy that paid close to minimum wage, no insurance of any kind (makes me laugh to even think of that happening!), no training, strictly low-dollar gear (which consisted of, really, a flashlight for vehicle patrol done in the employee's private car!).

    But he would come into the office every other day, big smile on his face, bragging about the thousands of dollars (the largest amount I remember was just over $4000) he'd won in last night's poker game, as he showed off the huge wad of bills.

    wjohnc

    Leave a comment:


  • FederalSecurity
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier View Post
    What is private security actually supposed to do against terrorists? This is not asked facetiously, I'd like to know what people's thoughts are on this.
    Ah, so this question's been on your mind as well! Often the most hated

    response is "Don't worry about it! It'll never happen here!" It's moments like these when I think "Wow, I'm surrounded by

    masses of perfect freaking victims!"
    Last edited by FederalSecurity; 06-01-2007, 09:46 AM. Reason: More complaining.

    Leave a comment:


  • EMTGuard
    replied
    Originally posted by SecTrainer View Post
    Not intending to pry, but why not look for something better?
    I have. I've looked, left and come back twice. I'm looking to leave again. Couple prospects in the wind right now.

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Ok, having a conversation over IM with someone with Valor Security about this.

    From what I understand, most of these anti-terrorism courses are the same thing that you learn in your security guard school: Observe, report, do not intervene.

    Florida's new four hour anti-terrorism course is instructor discretion. That means you can talk about anything related to "terrorism," which is to say... Another 4 hours of rehashing, "Observe, report, do not intervene."

    What is private security actually supposed to do against terrorists? This is not asked facetiously, I'd like to know what people's thoughts are on this.

    Leave a comment:


  • Dragonfyre024
    replied
    Originally posted by SecTrainer View Post
    Thank you very much for posting this. The situation discussed here is, in fact, a national scandal. DHS, the IACP, the DOJ and others have talked and talked and talked about "partnering" with the private security industry, but the talk has meant precious little.

    As of now, almost six years after 9/11, my company, for instance, has never received one direct communication from any of these agencies about "partnering" in any way. Yes, we receive the national security assessment reports and occasional special notices sent out by DHS and the DOJ, but there has been no national effort to engage the private security industry in any meaningful way in homeland security.

    The security industry is not alone in this void. The same agencies talk up a storm about "critical infrastructure" and how important it is to protect these sectors, but in reality they tell the companies occupying these sectors (financial institutions, hospitals, telecom companies, utility companies, transportation companies, etc.) that they're on their own when it comes to implementing higher levels of security. Basically, this amounts to an "unfunded mandate".

    Of course, the national scandal with respect to the underqualification, under-training, under-equipping, under-supervising, under-compensating of security officers has nothing to do with homeland security...it's a scandal all on its own, and it was a scandal long before 9/11 brought domestic and transnational terrorism into focus.
    There absolutely should be a partnership between law enforcement agencies and private security. What few people realize is that we are on the front lines as law enforcement in terms of combatting terrorism. Here are some links that I just used on a paper I had to write for class.


    Leave a comment:


  • iwicgsr
    replied
    Two Issues

    There are in fact, two issues we are addressing here. The first issue is well
    understood by anyone who has worked in this business any length of time.
    It is also a source of frustration for anyone who cares about the quality
    of their work. Under trained, under paid, unmotivated, uncommited, and in
    some cases, justifiably itinerant personnel occupy much of this industry.

    Why then should we wonder that our current role in national security is in
    most cases, no more than symbolic or a lot of empty rhetoric.

    I have the benefit and problems of being assigned many different posts,
    usually on short notice with little information regarding the assignment.
    Sometimes in plain cloths, uniform, armed, unarmed, minimal to moderately
    high danger. I have received only the minimal training required by the state.

    My years as an armored car guard have served me well, in so far as gun
    proficientcy, and the laws regarding its use. Observing people and their body language, looking for set ups or things that look out of place. My five decades have given me some street smarts and a little knowledge of human nature. Who is bluffing and who is not, what I think they are capable of or not.

    However, it is a second rate substitute for critical training. Until we as an industry address this kind of "short term economic thinking", so prevalent
    in this business, we will not be able to assume the kind of role needed in
    today's national security environment. Our part in natinal security will continue to be a lot of empty rhetoric.

    Leave a comment:


  • SecTrainer
    replied
    Originally posted by EMTGuard View Post
    I'm with a warmbody company which only requires you to have a pulse before they put you in a uniform and drop youin a chair at a guard shack somewhere. No terrorism training, no guns. Something happens, call the cops. It's great that some of you are getting the training but it won't happen at my post with my contract outfit. The company isn't interested and the client isn't either.
    Heck, forget the training. We can't even get people to hire on as guards. We are currently 3 people short. My coworker is working her 12th night in a row. When she gets releived in the morning her relief will be coming in for his 13th day in a row. 12 hour shifts. I'm working days this weekend to cover an empty EMT/SO slot then will be back on nights Monday. 2 nights, 3 days and then back for 2 nights. Thank goodness for the overtime considering I havn't had a raise in pay in 3 years.
    Not intending to pry, but why not look for something better?

    Leave a comment:


  • Christopherstjo
    replied
    Originally posted by cocknaces View Post
    Real change would only take place (in my opinion) if the State or Federal Government established uniform mandatory requirements for security
    You are absolutely correct and yet, because we have a bunch of spineless idiots in office who do not want to "upset" private corporations, getting this done is no easy task

    Leave a comment:


  • EMTGuard
    replied
    I'm with a warmbody company which only requires you to have a pulse before they put you in a uniform and drop youin a chair at a guard shack somewhere. No terrorism training, no guns. Something happens, call the cops. It's great that some of you are getting the training but it won't happen at my post with my contract outfit. The company isn't interested and the client isn't either.
    Heck, forget the training. We can't even get people to hire on as guards. We are currently 3 people short. My coworker is working her 12th night in a row. When she gets releived in the morning her relief will be coming in for his 13th day in a row. 12 hour shifts. I'm working days this weekend to cover an empty EMT/SO slot then will be back on nights Monday. 2 nights, 3 days and then back for 2 nights. Thank goodness for the overtime considering I havn't had a raise in pay in 3 years.

    Leave a comment:

Leaderboard

Collapse
Working...
X