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  • verbal identification

    Should a security officer verbally Id himself or herself when in full uniform when intervening in a situation? why or why not?
    "Get yourself a shovel cause your in deep Sh*t"

  • #2
    Originally posted by bigdog
    Should a security officer verbally Id himself or herself when in full uniform when intervening in a situation? why or why not?
    Absolutely, especially if it's a heated situation. If you end up having to use any kind of force, even deadly the question of "did you identify yourself" always comes up. Subjects may or may not disburse from the situation, atleast you identified yourself. For example if you end up gun facing someone it's not a bad idea to yell "public safety or security officer you're at gun point, get on the ground". When, I show up on fight calls i'll give verbal commands. If the subjects involved don't stop, i'll simply start spraying oc in their direction. Normally that makes them stop.
    "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

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    • #3
      I'm gonna go with yes, since you now have people who hit you charged with a felony. Even if you couldn't, you are identifying yourself as a neutral third party and not "backup" or "friends" of one of the parties fighting.
      Some Kind of Commando Leader

      "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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      • #4
        Nathan, Are you suggesting I ID as a licensed S/O or just yell " security officer"?
        "Get yourself a shovel cause your in deep Sh*t"

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        • #5
          "Licensed Security Officer" really doesn't enter into it. They can figure out you're licensed when they try to hit you. Just announce that you are security (lawful authority) and tell them to stop or whatever.
          Some Kind of Commando Leader

          "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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          • #6
            On the other hand surprise can be a valuable tool. Say there is a fist fight between two people... I would just sneak up behind one of them, lock his wrist while handcuffing him, and have my partner watch my back. Then we already have the upper hand on the situation from the get go.

            I would announce I was security only after I had the first subject in my control. "Security, stop resisting"

            The uniform would inform any 3rd parties watching.
            Police Officer

            Experience: Bouncer, EMT, Theme Park Security, Money Transport, Armed Guard

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            • #7
              Originally posted by dannyr619
              On the other hand surprise can be a valuable tool. Say there is a fist fight between two people... I would just sneak up behind one of them, lock his wrist while handcuffing him, and have my partner watch my back. Then we already have the upper hand on the situation from the get go.

              I would announce I was security only after I had the first subject in my control. "Security, stop resisting"

              The uniform would inform any 3rd parties watching.
              Not everyone wears a readily identifiable uniform. I wear a brown suit jacket that looks so unlike security I've been asked to get security (even with 2 badges on!). I'm a firm believer in announcing Security and asking all parties involved to let me see empty hands.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by dannyr619
                On the other hand surprise can be a valuable tool. Say there is a fist fight between two people... I would just sneak up behind one of them, lock his wrist while handcuffing him, and have my partner watch my back. Then we already have the upper hand on the situation from the get go.

                I would announce I was security only after I had the first subject in my control. "Security, stop resisting"

                The uniform would inform any 3rd parties watching.
                And if this guy turned around and clocked you in the face, you may lose the ability to charge him with assault/battery because he didn't know you were acting under authority and all he knew was the fight suddenly became 2 versus him.

                I always announce my presence when I'm making a contact. It would be a very rare occassion that I do not. The good majority of security officers that I see not announcing themselves seem to do it because they want people to see their uniform and think that they are the police.

                There is very little advantage (if any) to NOT announcing yourself. Once you announce yourself as security, the agent of the owner of the property, you are now acting under their authority. You are now clearly identified as who you are and you can now make your intentions clear. You have alleviated two potential issues:

                1. First you have created an awesome defense if someone tries to jam you up for "acting under the color of law enforcement" as you have clearly identified that you are in fact the Site Security Agent, not local law enforcement. This holds especially true to those security officials who wear a uniform that closely mimics that of their local LEA.

                2. Second, you are now properly identified as in fact being someone who may exert control over the property. You are de-facto the property owner while you contact these people and can use the appropriate force to see your will be done. This will save you from being jammed up from a "Well, I thought it was just some guy" arguments.

                Overall, like I said, it is always wise IMO to make your presence be known.
                "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
                "The Curve" 1998

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by dannyr619
                  On the other hand surprise can be a valuable tool. Say there is a fist fight between two people... I would just sneak up behind one of them, lock his wrist while handcuffing him, and have my partner watch my back. Then we already have the upper hand on the situation from the get go.

                  I would announce I was security only after I had the first subject in my control. "Security, stop resisting"

                  The uniform would inform any 3rd parties watching.
                  Depending on what jurisdiction you're in, that's illegal. Always check your local laws, or in states where there is no private arrest law, your case law.
                  Some Kind of Commando Leader

                  "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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                  • #10
                    Myself and my staff identify ourselves with a simple "Security" advisement. But anything past that, only my name is disclosed to any parties other then LE. Reason being, is that I already have the public identity issue, where I am in the paper and news programs, not to mention its not hard to come by the main office and pick up my card.

                    As for my personnel, when asked who they are, they are to identify themselves only by their call sign, not names. We do this for several reasons, but one important one..

                    Retalliation. I have lost officers in the past due to their identity being disclosed to disgruntle subjects. The officer is approached afterwards or any time, at which the upset subject demands to "know your name". The officer gives the subject a simple statement of their call sign. You should see peoples faces when this is the response. Very upset then. The public is under the perception that S/O's are held to the same standard as LE's, in that the S/O is a public official and must disclose their name. PD has even had to be the bearer of bad news to the subject when they respond with the same "The security officer doesnt have to give you his/her name".

                    When it comes to complaints being filed, the complaintant is given the officers call sign, and can be given my name. With that and a number to contact, then they can discuss the issue with me legitimately. As said here before, the uniform and a simple advisement of "security" satisfies our legal system more then enough.

                    I do suggest that we all protect ourselves from retalliation, as we are generally the first faces and last faces any upset person not thinking things through, will remember. Check who is in your parking lot when you get off shift, and always change your path home when leaving. Keep an eye on the rear view mirror, and make a few extra turns or a stop at a gas station for a cup of coffee.. You will find out quickly if you have a guest wishing to follow you home!
                    Deputy Sheriff

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                    • #11
                      I will give my name to guests. Non guests get my call sign, S-2. Freaks them out! I tell them, you are not paying my salary, whereas a guest is. I too have been backed up by police who have told people I was under no obligation to id myself to them.
                      I enforce rules and regulations, not laws.
                      Security Officers. The 1st First Responders.

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                      • #12
                        I don't think we're talking about identifying by name.

                        Bigdog asked, basically from what I can see, "If I step in to stop a fight or something, do I have to say 'security,' or can I just let my uniform speak for me?"

                        As I've said before, I believe that you should verbally identify yourself as lawful authority (security or police depending on who you are) when using force.

                        Now, you can do this AS you are using force. Walk up to someone, grab their arm and say, "You're under arrest. I'm a security officer, do not resist." while moving them to a transporter or takedown.

                        If you're breaking up a fight, I would announce who I am and my intentions before wading in. Usually, though, the threat of "Hey! Break it up. Security, you're gonna get sprayed with mace!" usually made both (or more!) parties scatter like mad.
                        Some Kind of Commando Leader

                        "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Mall Director
                          Check who is in your parking lot when you get off shift, and always change your path home when leaving. Keep an eye on the rear view mirror, and make a few extra turns or a stop at a gas station for a cup of coffee.. You will find out quickly if you have a guest wishing to follow you home!
                          Mall Director... VERY GOOD ADVICE! I have worked at a few clubs in DC and Atlanta where the guy you tossed out 3 hours before is still off in the parking lot or garage waiting to have words with you when you get off work! Most clubs I worked at did not allow you to carry firearms while working. I always armed up at home. De-armed at the club security office and then armed up again before my walk to my car between 3 and 6 am. Do not allow yourself to become a statistic!
                          M E N in B L A C K
                          Personal Security Svcs.

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                          • #14
                            While on the personal-security advice subject I would like to add something myself. The district I supervise includes some of the worst areas in Miami-Dade (I work the night shift). My advice to anyone doing the similar would be to remember that there are A LOT of people who hate cops and could confuse you're patrol as a police car. I watch who is around me at a red light, if anyone is following me, and I keep a list of what gas stations I know are safe to stop at for a break. I've had a lot of people walk up to me during a red light thinking I'm a cop and telling me about someone who robbed them or beat them up ect...

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
                              Depending on what jurisdiction you're in, that's illegal. Always check your local laws, or in states where there is no private arrest law, your case law.
                              Why would this be illegal? Security generally has no more arrest powers than any other citizen.


                              You witness a misdemeanor in progress (the fight), you DETAIN the more aggressive party (putting someone in handcuffs is not always an arrest), then IF the other party involved wants to make a citizens arrest it is done by THEM.

                              With only two officers responding to a two person fight, why would you want to give them heads up as to what is about to happen???
                              Police Officer

                              Experience: Bouncer, EMT, Theme Park Security, Money Transport, Armed Guard

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