Virginia Tech Shooting

[LPCap Member Find all posts View Profile Close LPCap]

You can learn this kind of information from public sources (like the EDGAR database) if the company is required to file SEC documents, or if it's a privately held company, by direct questioning during your interview. Just ask: "What percentage of your net income does your company spend on officer training (equipment, benefits, whatever), Mr. Personnel Man?".

Personally, I'd be mighty impressed if a job candidate ever asked me a question like that, and if I didn't know the answer I'd get it for him.

Companies generally allocate a very SMALL percentage of operating budget to Security/Loss Prevention.

[Mr. Security Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Mr. Security]

Good points as usual, SecTrainer. I like the part about young people being likened to a blank slate. Made me think of why the military prefers 18-19 year olds over those in their late twenties when it comes to the infantry. The older a person is when training commences, the greater the possibility that they will not just blindly follow orders when commanded to kill.

In war-torn countries, factions prefer youth soldiers (really just children) because they will commit atrocities w/o hesitation, war crimes so vicious that even hardened adult soldiers would object.

All that talk about no proof reminds me of the decades were cigarette manufacturers claimed: There's No Proof That Cigarettes Cause Cancer

[SecTrainer Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close SecTrainer]

Companies generally allocate a very SMALL percentage of operating budget to Security/Loss Prevention.

Well, I was speaking of the applicant for a job with a contract security company, but either way it's still all relative, and allows you to compare one company to another. Companies allocate resources to the things they value, and not to things they don't. In making such comparisons, of course, you would use percentages rather than absolute figures. Percentages level the playing field.

So you would use exactly the same technique if you are applying to work for the security department within a non-security company. Yes, the overall percentage of the company's budget spent on security would be small - perhaps only 2% at one company and 3% at another. But, everything else being equal, this does tell you something, namely that Company B spends 50% more of its budget for security percentagewise than company A spends. And, if you're talking about a budget in the $millions, this difference, which appears to be very small when it's expressed as a difference of 1% of the total budget, is actually quite a lot of money.

Naturally, this is only a rough way to make judgements, but as long as I'm comparing apples to apples, if I saw a significant difference in the expenditure percentagewise between two reasonably similar companies, I would be interested in knowing why.

You wouldn't, of course, compare the percentage of the budget spent by Securitas, a contract security company whose business is security, with the percentage spent by General Motors, a nonsecurity company for security when that's not its business. That ain't comparing apples to apples.

As long as you don't compare apples to oranges, the percentage-of-budget or percentage-of-net-income comparison is extremely useful, even if it only leads you to ask the next question: "Why is there this difference, percentagewise, between what Sears budgets for their security people, and what J.C. Penny budgets?" There might be a lot of reasons, of course, but that's what you'd like to know.

[SecTrainer Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close SecTrainer]

All that talk about no proof reminds me of the decades where cigarette manufacturers claimed: There's No Proof That Cigarettes Cause Cancer

...and, of course, no proof that cigarette ads influence kids to smoke, either! No doubt, when Marlboro was looking for "the Marlboro Man", they instructed the ad agency to just run out into the street and pick the first ugly slob they found. "We don't care if he's a total Dork with a capital D and that rhymes with C and that stands for Cancer...er, we mean Cash!", they said. "Nossir. He might look like the Night of the Living Dead and Milton Berle in drag all rolled up into one, for all we care. We just want to show some guy lighting up one of our fags."

Uh-huh, right. You know they looked for the "coolest dude" they could lay their mitts on. Now why would that be?

[Christopherstjo Member Find all posts View Profile Close Christopherstjo]

Deadest town I ever struck.

No, the deadest town in Colorado is called "Last Chance" it was the last town out of Colorado - good name but nothing was there.

[Christopherstjo Member Find all posts View Profile Close Christopherstjo]

The story was that Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris, a pair of lonely, outcast Goths,

The point I was making is that there were multiple student accounts that these individuals, just like in the Tech School shooting, were subjected to bully tactics from other students. True or False, it is nevertheless reported by many students.

[Christopherstjo Member Find all posts View Profile Close Christopherstjo]

Video games can contribute to violent acts. . .

True, but then I think violent movies and even certain music, in general can paly a significant role, as well. If in no other way than giving the perception [true or false] that violence is condoned by society. Both children and those with profound mental health disabilities can be impressionable by the images they see and internal messages translated, as a result.

[Guest Close OccamsRazor]

An oversimplification of the facts. Guns are different from other weapons because they make it easy to kill many people, especially with clips that hold 15 rounds. The other weapons allow people to overpower the perpetrator so that we don't have 30 bodies in 30 minutes.

Well, thank God for the move to ban high-capacity magazines. Now, if it passes, an active shooter would only be able to shoot 10 people instead of 15.

What about these other weapons you speak of...

Knives?

Winston Moseley, the nutjob who stabbed Kitty Genovese to death effectively held 38 people at bay with a knife. That's all he had, yet not one person tried to overpower him.

Box cutters?

How many people were killed on 9/11 by psychos armed with box cutters?

[N. A. Corbier Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close N. A. Corbier]

Not to take away from this, I think the "box cutter" thing was myth.

High-capacity magazines are not a threat to society. A person can be killed with one bullet fired from a muzzle loading flintlock rifle. Three people voted against allowing security in Florida to use semi-autos, all saying, "That's a lot more rounds those guards have, they could do more damage."

What does this mean? It means the same rhetoric you hear all the time. "We do not trust the people behind the gun." Yet, guess what? All three senators are guarded by the same licensees that they do not trust to have more than a .38 revolver, and are protected by men and women with Class C (PI) licenses who can carry 9mm semi-auto with any number of rounds for years.

High cap mag bans are rhetoric, and quite frankly, a method of gun removal by attrition. The more high cap mag-accepting guns you ban, the less guns there are. Except, you know, except for those on the street that are already illegal due to being possessed by felons or stolen or altered or being used in a crime.

[Mr. Security Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Mr. Security]

Knives?

Winston Moseley, the nutjob who stabbed Kitty Genovese to death effectively held 38 people at bay with a knife. That's all he had, yet not one person tried to overpower him.

Nice try. If he had a gun instead of a knife, it may have been 38 dead instead of 1. Moreover, there are plenty of cases were people did act to stop a knife-wielding subject once they realized that he intended to kill everyone possible.

[Christopherstjo Member Find all posts View Profile Close Christopherstjo]

I watched CBS News this morning and a report was given about a college (do not recall the name) that has implemented a comupter program because of the Tech School shooting that enables them to communicate directly with their students by e-mail and text messaging to give emergency notices such as school shooting incidents and what to do / go.

This is a great idea and all colleges should be doing the same. It is also something that others beyond colleges should also consider, such as large coporations, high schools, and so forth.

[davis002 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close davis002]

I watched CBS News this morning and a report was given about a college (do not recall the name) that has implemented a comupter program because of the Tech School shooting that enables them to communicate directly with their students by e-mail and text messaging to give emergency notices such as school shooting incidents and what to do / go.

This is a great idea and all colleges should be doing the same. It is also something that others beyond colleges should also consider, such as large coporations, high schools, and so forth.

I saw a story about this on MSNBC too, but can't find a link. Several software companies market systems that send out emergency messages via multiple delivery systems (phone, email, text, etc.). Phone and Text messages make sense, but email??? I don't think email is the best idea during a time sensitive incident like an active shooter.

Student 1: "Are those gunshots that I hear down the hall?!"
Student 2" "I don't know, let me check my email!"

[Christopherstjo Member Find all posts View Profile Close Christopherstjo]

I saw a story about this on MSNBC too, but can't find a link. Several software companies market systems that send out emergency messages via multiple delivery systems (phone, email, text, etc.). Phone and Text messages make sense, but email??? I don't think email is the best idea during a time sensitive incident like an active shooter.

Student 1: "Are those gunshots that I hear down the hall?!"
Student 2" "I don't know, let me check my email!"

The purpose of the e-mail format, I would think, is to ensure that all available avenues of communication are used so as to distribute the most amount of information as possible in the widest ways possible. Some students are confined to their class rooms or dorms and can, therefore, access their internet to find out what is happening and what to do. Likewise, now days many people also have these palm devices (forget the name - obviously I don't have one ) and can access their e-mail from there, as well.

Incidently, I got word this morning that the State of Missouri is going to review and consider my DIVE Team program, in the scope of providing effective and efficient security services in public places, in wake of the Tech School shooting.

[T202 Member Find all posts View Profile Close T202]

Michigan State University has a system called Reverse 911.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18194494/

[GCMC Security Member Find all posts View Profile Close GCMC Security]

I saw a story about this on MSNBC too, but can't find a link. Several software companies market systems that send out emergency messages via multiple delivery systems (phone, email, text, etc.). Phone and Text messages make sense, but email??? I don't think email is the best idea during a time sensitive incident like an active shooter.

Student 1: "Are those gunshots that I hear down the hall?!"
Student 2" "I don't know, let me check my email!"

As well as some people receive email on their phones or blackberrys. Also some students may live off campus and check their email before leaving the house to go to class.