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  • #16
    There are some good points being made here but the one thing that I would like to know is if there was a program at CNN where an employee can go to H.R. and alert them to any possible domestic issue and security would be notified.

    Are there such programs around ?
    The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. Edmund Burke.

    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes ?

    www.patrol4u.com


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    • #17
      You make good points...

      I will be the first to admit when I was wrong.

      Certain websites don't load well on the work computer, which is what I use during lunchbreaks to catch up on the forum. CNN.com is one of them, so I was only able to receive the story from yahoo, which if you read, doesn't exactly coincide with CNN.com.

      You're right about trying to judge from a press report, and I do admit I was wrong in that. Just some of the information they spoke of about the guard "Watching the fight" sat wrong with me, although they mention nothing about that in the CNN.com article.

      There are still questions about it, and I'm not trying to Monday Morning Quarterback the situation or discredit what they guy did. It is all spur of the moment, and in the end, the only people who really know what occured are those involved.

      I apologize for seeming judgemental, but I think this is a case that could be learned from, especially by the workers or even people who were in the building. I've told my fellow associates before that if something doesn't seem right, or if someone is arguing or people seem threatening, call security. While we're human too, something about a uniform and being trained in deescalating situations tends to help. lol

      What the guard did was perfect in stopping it, especially if he had just arrived on the scene. Those types of decisions, split second or not, are hard to make.

      BadBoynMD
      20 feet sound like its alot? Try it once, you will be surprised.
      Have tried it. And it's not a lot. Especially if you only have a baton and are dealing with someone who's high or deranged.

      SecTrainer
      but that doesn't mean we can say how this specific incident "should have" gone down.

      There was a domestic murder/suicide on the campus of U. Washington just a couple of days ago. I understand that the whole incident took less than 2 minutes from the point of the initial confrontation to having two dead bodies. These events can actually happen in less time than it takes to describe them afterwards.
      I understand where you're coming from with that, and especially with Bill Warnock about the factual reports taken by security and law enforcement. One reason why I like to question, to try to figure out what could have gone different, is because I honestly believe that yes, he did what he needed to do and what he could do. But there had to have been some way to prevent her from getting killed.

      That's my main point. I really, honesty, fully and strongly believe that there is some lesson that we, as Security Professionals, can learn from this incident to find out 1) Why she was killed, 2) Why security wasn't alerted sooner, 3) How he got in with a gun, 4) How we can prevent this next time.

      I'm sure it did go down faster than it took me to write this post. And I know that the guard reacted as quickly and efficiently as he could. But I don't like thinking that this was a tragedy that can be repeated, because it can't be prevented.

      So like Bill said...it's something that should be entred into training. Something that we should analyze, see what went right (The S/O) and what went wrong in this situation.

      Hell...everyone was simply giving praise, and I agree that the Officer wholeheartedly deserves it. I say we give praise but ask what can be done better next time.

      Afterall, criminals are improving every day, and learn from every incident. Why shouldn't we?
      Well...at least it's not a desk job.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Sarin
        I will be the first to admit when I was wrong.

        Certain websites don't load well on the work computer, which is what I use during lunchbreaks to catch up on the forum. CNN.com is one of them, so I was only able to receive the story from yahoo, which if you read, doesn't exactly coincide with CNN.com.

        You're right about trying to judge from a press report, and I do admit I was wrong in that. Just some of the information they spoke of about the guard "Watching the fight" sat wrong with me, although they mention nothing about that in the CNN.com article.

        There are still questions about it, and I'm not trying to Monday Morning Quarterback the situation or discredit what they guy did. It is all spur of the moment, and in the end, the only people who really know what occured are those involved.

        I apologize for seeming judgemental, but I think this is a case that could be learned from, especially by the workers or even people who were in the building. I've told my fellow associates before that if something doesn't seem right, or if someone is arguing or people seem threatening, call security. While we're human too, something about a uniform and being trained in deescalating situations tends to help. lol

        What the guard did was perfect in stopping it, especially if he had just arrived on the scene. Those types of decisions, split second or not, are hard to make.

        BadBoynMD


        Have tried it. And it's not a lot. Especially if you only have a baton and are dealing with someone who's high or deranged.

        SecTrainer


        I understand where you're coming from with that, and especially with Bill Warnock about the factual reports taken by security and law enforcement. One reason why I like to question, to try to figure out what could have gone different, is because I honestly believe that yes, he did what he needed to do and what he could do. But there had to have been some way to prevent her from getting killed.

        That's my main point. I really, honesty, fully and strongly believe that there is some lesson that we, as Security Professionals, can learn from this incident to find out 1) Why she was killed, 2) Why security wasn't alerted sooner, 3) How he got in with a gun, 4) How we can prevent this next time.

        I'm sure it did go down faster than it took me to write this post. And I know that the guard reacted as quickly and efficiently as he could. But I don't like thinking that this was a tragedy that can be repeated, because it can't be prevented.

        So like Bill said...it's something that should be entred into training. Something that we should analyze, see what went right (The S/O) and what went wrong in this situation.

        Hell...everyone was simply giving praise, and I agree that the Officer wholeheartedly deserves it. I say we give praise but ask what can be done better next time.

        Afterall, criminals are improving every day, and learn from every incident. Why shouldn't we?
        I'm all about asking question, because if you don't you won't know. Sadly, we live in a world of opportunity. Let's take the airports in as an example. You damn near have to strip down naked to board a plane. Yet, people are still getting restricted items onboard. Businesses aren't going to pay for White House type security, because the cost would be extremely high. They simply get a consultant to anaylze the property, and give some ideas of the type of security needed.

        All the facts in this situation aren't going to be released until the police, and DA's office finish their investigation. Once they are released I am sure this forum will be flooded with questiond and comments. As of right now, we are simply going on what we've seen (on TV) and read on cnn.com.

        Crimnals don't have rules they have to go by, we do and that's where ALOT of the issues lay.
        "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

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        • #19
          Well, on a different point. I wonder what will happen to the S/O that shot the suspect? Promoted, praised, repremanded or fired? Turner may or may not know any of his security people but I wonder if he will look into the matter himself.
          My views, opinions and statements are my own. They are not of my company, affiliates or coworkers.

          -Being bagger at Publix has more respect these days

          -It's just a job kid deal with it

          -The industry needs to do one of two things; stop fiddling with the thin line and go forward or go back to that way it was. A flashlight in one hand and your set of keys in the other

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Echos13
            Well, on a different point. I wonder what will happen to the S/O that shot the suspect? Promoted, praised, repremanded or fired? Turner may or may not know any of his security people but I wonder if he will look into the matter himself.
            Welp, as a company owner myself, I would only HOPE he would have been notified once the fan has cooled down. I'd also, hope that he has a policy regarding officer involved shootings. I, suppose only time will tell what Happens to Captain Adams (the officer that shot the subject).

            If one of my officers shot a subject that was deemed justified, I wouldn't give a promotion, reprimand or or termination papers. However, a letter to the officer, followed by a commendation award would be likely. Although, someone had died, the officer did in fact stop a potential threat of other lives.
            "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

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            • #21
              Just an FYI
              In the law suit brought by the city of Boston over a bunch of silly led cartoon signs Turner hasn't owned that company for 10 years. And also dumped Hanoi Jane shortly after. The new owners simply kept the Turner name for what it's worth.
              THE AVERAGE RESPONSE TIME FOR A 911 CALL IS FOUR MINUTES
              THE AVERAGE RESPONSE TIME FOR A .357 MAGNUM ROUND IS 1400 FEET PER SECOND?
              http://www.boondocksaints.com/

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