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  • CNN security takes down shooter

    1 dead, apparent domestic shooting situation. hats off to the SEO who took care of this terrible situation.

    http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/03/cnn...ing/index.html

  • #2
    From what I read earlier on CNN.com, the S/O put down the shooter with a head shot.

    Truly tragic that it takes this type of incident to make people realize that private security is not a laughing matter anymore.
    The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. Edmund Burke.

    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes ?

    www.patrol4u.com


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    • #3
      all I can say is... wow.
      "To win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the highest skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the highest skill." Sun-Tzu

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      • #4
        Originally posted by gonzo1510
        From what I read earlier on CNN.com, the S/O put down the shooter with a head shot.

        Truly tragic that it takes this type of incident to make people realize that private security is not a laughing matter anymore.
        Amen! and as Davis said "wow" was my first reaction as well.
        "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

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        • #5
          This shooting could have been stopped.

          The Omni employee was identified as Clara Riddles, 22, of College Park, according to Caryn Kboudi, a spokeswoman for the Irving, Texas-based hotel chain. Riddles checked and restocked honor bars in the hotel rooms, she said.

          Riddles was taken to Grady Memorial Hospital and pronounced dead on arrival, a hospital spokeswoman said.

          The man, identified by police as Arthur Mann, in his late 30s, was in stable condition at the hospital's detention center. He is being charged with murder, Atlanta Police officer James Polite said.
          http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070404/...s/cnn_shooting

          Deadly force doesn't always have to be deadly.

          One of my questions is, if he was watching so closely, how did he not see the gun getting pulled out? And if somehow he had managed to and had shot the guy before the guy shot his girlfriend, would he still be the hero of the story?

          And you guys say it takes something like this to prove security is no laughing matter?

          Gauranteed, no one will remember the guards role in a few more days.

          Hooray for thankless jobs, right? LOL

          But this also poses a few other questions.

          In a building so monumental, and in an area that has suffered from terrorist attacks before, how did the man get in a gun? Do they have metal detectors on the entrances? Why did no one break up the fight before and tell the man to leave, instead of letting it continue? It states in the story that the perp dragged his girlfriend down the stairs--why didn't security tackle him then? That's assault right there. Especially since the victim was an employee of the establishment. Isn't it our job to protect our fellow associates and innocent patrons?

          It's good that the S/O was able to stop the perp before it could get any farther, but doesn't this bother some people? The fact that they could argue in public like this, with an S/O watching, and not be told to stop? And that the Security Officer's let it go so far as to letting this guy have the chance?

          There's a reason this job is thankless: Because when we do our duties correctly, it makes it seem like we're not needed at all. It makes people think they're safe, without realizing that we're the reason why they are.

          Why did the officers let this situation escalate that far? I honestly believe that if all of this had been handled correctly, and if protocol had been followed, this shooting would never have had the chance to occur.
          Well...at least it's not a desk job.

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          • #6
            Its always easier to say Peyton Manning should have thrown short instead of long on Monday morning.
            "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
            "The Curve" 1998

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            • #7
              Monday morning quarterback.

              It sure is Mr Lawson. Great job of monday morning quarterbacking there Sarin.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Sarin
                http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070404/...s/cnn_shooting

                One of my questions is, if he was watching so closely, how did he not see the gun getting pulled out? And if somehow he had managed to and had shot the guy before the guy shot his girlfriend, would he still be the hero of the story?

                In a building so monumental, and in an area that has suffered from terrorist attacks before, how did the man get in a gun? Do they have metal detectors on the entrances? Why did no one break up the fight before and tell the man to leave, instead of letting it continue? It states in the story that the perp dragged his girlfriend down the stairs--why didn't security tackle him then? That's assault right there. Especially since the victim was an employee of the establishment. Isn't it our job to protect our fellow associates and innocent patrons?

                It's good that the S/O was able to stop the perp before it could get any farther, but doesn't this bother some people? The fact that they could argue in public like this, with an S/O watching, and not be told to stop? And that the Security Officer's let it go so far as to letting this guy have the chance?

                Why did the officers let this situation escalate that far? I honestly believe that if all of this had been handled correctly, and if protocol had been followed, this shooting would never have had the chance to occur.
                Maybe you need to read the original link posted by SIW Editor, which seems to tell a more complete story. Nowhere did I get the impression that any security officers stood by and watched the two argue, then only took action once the suspect had shot the woman. Rather, the more complete story says that an employee observed the suspect dragging the woman, and that employee quickly ran and summoned the nearest security officer. The security officer radioed for backup, arrived on scene, and shots were fired.

                I would caution you against criticizing or "armchair quarterbacking" at this point. There are far too few details to get a complete picture right now.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Dam Guard
                  It sure is Mr Lawson. Great job of monday morning quarterbacking there Sarin.
                  Just to comment, I don't think he is so much monday morning qb'ing, but merely asking the questions we should all ask of ourselves in situations like that. It will help us learn and grow. However; all those questions are easy to ask/answer when you weren't the security officer responding to a shots fired situation.

                  However;

                  I do disagree with the "The shooting could have been stopped" title Sarin opened with. These things could have happened at a mile a minute, hell, we could have prevented this by killing this guy at birth, but not everything is feasible. We have to look at the side where this security officer made a move to stop a possible ongoing threat. Saying the shooting could have been stopped is like saying that a potential terrorist was killed at Columbine High School.
                  Last edited by Lawson; 04-04-2007, 10:38 AM.
                  "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
                  "The Curve" 1998

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Sarin
                    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070404/...s/cnn_shooting

                    Deadly force doesn't always have to be deadly.

                    One of my questions is, if he was watching so closely, how did he not see the gun getting pulled out? And if somehow he had managed to and had shot the guy before the guy shot his girlfriend, would he still be the hero of the story?

                    And you guys say it takes something like this to prove security is no laughing matter?

                    Gauranteed, no one will remember the guards role in a few more days.

                    Hooray for thankless jobs, right? LOL

                    But this also poses a few other questions.

                    In a building so monumental, and in an area that has suffered from terrorist attacks before, how did the man get in a gun? Do they have metal detectors on the entrances? Why did no one break up the fight before and tell the man to leave, instead of letting it continue? It states in the story that the perp dragged his girlfriend down the stairs--why didn't security tackle him then? That's assault right there. Especially since the victim was an employee of the establishment. Isn't it our job to protect our fellow associates and innocent patrons?

                    It's good that the S/O was able to stop the perp before it could get any farther, but doesn't this bother some people? The fact that they could argue in public like this, with an S/O watching, and not be told to stop? And that the Security Officer's let it go so far as to letting this guy have the chance?

                    There's a reason this job is thankless: Because when we do our duties correctly, it makes it seem like we're not needed at all. It makes people think they're safe, without realizing that we're the reason why they are.

                    Why did the officers let this situation escalate that far? I honestly believe that if all of this had been handled correctly, and if protocol had been followed, this shooting would never have had the chance to occur.
                    We don't always have the luxury of being like Superman or Batman that can show up out of no where to stop a threat. Without being there, we can all only assume while he's dragging this poor girl, he may have had his gun shoved on her. As Lawson stated this WHOLE event could have happened in under a min.

                    Carrying a firearm is not a walk in the park like some make it out to be. Unfortunately, in this society that we live in, we as security/law enforcement and even police officer/feds all have to abide by rules and regs. However, criminals or as, I like to call them knuckleheads don't have rules or regs to abide by. They do what they what they want, when they want and however they have the gull enough to do. With that said, we all know the media is pretty much always 99% BS.

                    It's a WHOLE new ball game when a knife or gun comes into play. I've been trained on what we call "the 20 feet rule", which is if someone has a knife and enters that 20 feet area, chances of getting shot are very likely. 20 feet sound like its alot? Try it once, you will be surprised. As for a man/woman with a gun, welp you don't drop it on command, and you raise it at someone else, or even the officer giving commands, then again your chances of being shot are very high. As for security officers that "watched", okay let's entertain that for a moment. Not all security officers are armed, and some companies only allow supervisors to carry a weapon. The officer that shot this man was in fact a captain with 11 years service. Our job is simply to "stop the threat", which he did.
                    "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

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                    • #11
                      Curious. I watched the video. There were at least two differant uniforms present, maybe three. One of the uniforms had on bio-gloves. The one covering the suspect appeared to have a straight baton. Is this the S/O that shot the suspect? The scene looked a little cluterd and uncontroled. Still, I guess it could have been worse. You just can't have %100 contol unless your willing to go to extremes like federal buildings. And sometimes they fail every once and a while.
                      My views, opinions and statements are my own. They are not of my company, affiliates or coworkers.

                      -Being bagger at Publix has more respect these days

                      -It's just a job kid deal with it

                      -The industry needs to do one of two things; stop fiddling with the thin line and go forward or go back to that way it was. A flashlight in one hand and your set of keys in the other

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Echos13
                        Curious. I watched the video. There were at least two differant uniforms present, maybe three. One of the uniforms had on bio-gloves. The one covering the suspect appeared to have a straight baton. Is this the S/O that shot the suspect? The scene looked a little cluterd and uncontroled. Still, I guess it could have been worse. You just can't have %100 contol unless your willing to go to extremes like federal buildings. And sometimes they fail every once and a while.
                        Keep in mind this was a shooting that occured in an Atlanta major business complex, naturally your scene is going to be next to impossible to control. As for the multiple uniforms, CNN has Security and Police, it is likely that there was the security officers and CNN Police Officers arriving on scene.
                        "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
                        "The Curve" 1998

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I don't think Sarin's questions are in any way out of line. We should always ask questions, if only to think about situations like these.

                          Where I do take issue with Sarin is that unfortunately, we rarely have all the information from press reports, etc., so that we really can't pass judgement about whether this was preventable or not. In other words, we can and should ask questions - even just asking them is very useful - but that doesn't mean we can say how this specific incident "should have" gone down.

                          There was a domestic murder/suicide on the campus of U. Washington just a couple of days ago. I understand that the whole incident took less than 2 minutes from the point of the initial confrontation to having two dead bodies. These events can actually happen in less time than it takes to describe them afterwards.
                          "Every betrayal begins with trust." - Brian Jacques

                          "I can't predict the future, but I know that it'll be very weird." - Anonymous

                          "There is nothing new under the sun." - Ecclesiastes 1:9

                          "History, with all its volumes vast, hath but one page." - Lord Byron

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                          • #14
                            My last employer got into a firefight outside of a rave club. Thank God nobody was hit, and the situation got put to a stop.

                            But in the following weeks, I heard so many say "he should've....." or "I would've.....", to where I would tell them matter of factly to STFU!!!

                            Anyone who makes those kinds of assessments obviously has never been in such a situation, and God forbid if they ever should. Even those of us who have had close call experiences, and training under our belts never really know what will happen should we get into a deadly force situation. From what I know of this situation with CNN, it appears the SO put the situation to a stop without letting it escalate into something worse, and he should be applauded for that.

                            I just hope the media doesn't turn this into a three ring circus.
                            Never make a drummer mad; we beat things for a living!

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                            • #15
                              That is why after factual action reports examined by seasoned security and law enforcement officers is essential. Lessons learned should be taught at in-service training sessions.
                              When a shooting occurred and as soon as nerves are calmed, a shooting board of seasoned, totally disinterested officers should be convened and an unbiased report rendered. Lessons learned should become a part of both in-service and academy training.
                              Enjoy the day,
                              Bill

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