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  • BadBoynMD
    replied
    I, have been debating if I wanted to install a cage in my unmarked vic. It seems to be a damned if you do, damned if you don't topic. I, personally rarely ever have anyone riding in my car that isn't LE or an employee. However, I am huge fan to the saying "prepare for the unexpected". So, I think I'll have that cage installed now.

    Leave a comment:


  • ValleyOne
    replied
    Originally posted by SecTrainer
    More security vehicles should be equipped with these cages, IMHO
    Tobe honest, up untill a few years ago and before I moved to this area I would disagreed with you. However, down here is S. Oregon, I have had wuite a few LE detainees in the back seat. Temporarily holding them in the secure environment till we can get the situation sorted out.

    I work closer with these 'small town' cops than any other cops I have to date. My only complaint is that they still employ the steel mesh in lieu of the lexan upper portions, unsafe and deadly. Me? Lexan uppers all the way.

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Originally posted by Chucky
    There was a case in FL I believe the Tampa area were the bad guy reached over the seat and procured the Detective drivers gun. He then commenced to shoot both front seat Detectives to death and escaped only to kill a state trooper an hour later. After a long hostage taken standoff he killed himself. A couple hundred bucks for a cage would have saved 4 lives in this case. These were seasoned detectives.

    http://www.amw.com/fugitives/case.cfm?id=26495
    The detectives in question did not routinely transport, nor was the suspect searched by uniforms. They put him in the detective's car with no cage because the media was swarming, and they didn't want him to look "guilty."

    He had a handcuff key, used it, took both of em out, then eventually took out a state trooper while carjacking another car.

    Instead of sticking a suspect in a car with a cage, they put him with two detectives who hadn't transported a suspect in ages... And cuffed him in the front.

    Tampa Police no longer cuffs from the front, always searches for cuff keys, and puts suspects in marked units with cages.

    This also created a law that if you are stopped by the police and have a handcuff key, you are committing a crime. Licensed security guards and private investigators are exempt if they disclose the location of the key upon detention or arrest.

    Leave a comment:


  • Black Caesar
    replied
    Originally posted by Chucky
    Several of us most likely more say that the security guys get little or no press when KIA. Well last night the (AMW) did a piece on a Federal security guy down in I think Texas that was giving a guy a ride to a migrant camp and for unknown reasons the perp stabbed the Security officer to death then took flight.

    Since the bad guy spoke no English no one really knows what his issues were.
    The other thing is they didn't mention if the guard was armed or not. To many mistakes were done here. In my state no official LE etc car is allowed to transport any civilian in the front other than authorized ride alongs. Another was that the security guy didn't have a clear idea as to exactly where this guy was going. I did notice that the actual scene footage showed the Crown Vic had red and blue roof bar.This guard was no rookie. Lots of questions on this one although a Security KIA did make national TV.
    California, Not Texas. The officer worked at a private Veterans home, not for the feds.

    If I remember correctly, it was his personal car as well, not a company vehicle. Edit: Now that I think about it, they did show a crown vic. Hmmm, more digging needed....

    AMW case
    Last edited by Black Caesar; 03-25-2007, 01:44 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • SecTrainer
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
    They should be, but the caveat to it is you get bored cops who pull you over for "that looks like a cop car," and start harassing you over it. One guy I knew who worked proprietary had a cage in the company jeep. Yellow lightbar, said the company's name on the side (Three letter acronym), etc... He got pulled over and they wanted him to remove the spotlight and the cage or else they'd impound it.

    A cage and a-frame spotlight does not a cop car make.
    This sort of thing, fortunately, is relatively rare, and I don't believe in "managing by exceptions". If we try to anticipate all the ridiculous things that some yahoo cop might do, we'll never leave the house.
    Last edited by SecTrainer; 03-25-2007, 01:35 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Chucky
    replied
    There was a case in FL I believe the Tampa area were the bad guy reached over the seat and procured the Detective drivers gun. He then commenced to shoot both front seat Detectives to death and escaped only to kill a state trooper an hour later. After a long hostage taken standoff he killed himself. A couple hundred bucks for a cage would have saved 4 lives in this case. These were seasoned detectives.

    http://www.amw.com/fugitives/case.cfm?id=26495

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    They should be, but the caveat to it is you get bored cops who pull you over for "that looks like a cop car," and start harassing you over it. One guy I knew who worked proprietary had a cage in the company jeep. Yellow lightbar, said the company's name on the side (Three letter acronym), etc... He got pulled over and they wanted him to remove the spotlight and the cage or else they'd impound it.

    A cage and a-frame spotlight does not a cop car make.

    Leave a comment:


  • SecTrainer
    replied
    I'm not sure if we know this perp was in the front seat but even from the back he could have attacked the officer if there was no cage or the partition was down, and presumably with this type of transport he would not have been handcuffed.

    I can think of more than one instance in which I was very happy to have the cage, and the partition between the seats was always up when anyone was in the back seat, handcuffed or not.

    My front passenger seat was usually occupied anyway with my duty bag, which was strapped down. Except for ride-alongs, I never shifted that bag and so no one rode or sat in the front seat.

    More security vehicles should be equipped with these cages, IMHO, if they are or might be used for any type of personnel transport. Even a hysterical or unhinged victim (or the relative of a victim) can become dangerous to the officer who is driving.

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    It sounds like he was FPS, and was either a contract security guard with arrest powers, or a FPS Police Officer. Anyone know?

    Leave a comment:


  • Chucky
    started a topic Amw

    Amw

    Several of us most likely more say that the security guys get little or no press when KIA. Well last night the (AMW) did a piece on a Federal security guy down in I think Texas that was giving a guy a ride to a migrant camp and for unknown reasons the perp stabbed the Security officer to death then took flight.

    Since the bad guy spoke no English no one really knows what his issues were.
    The other thing is they didn't mention if the guard was armed or not. To many mistakes were done here. In my state no official LE etc car is allowed to transport any civilian in the front other than authorized ride alongs. Another was that the security guy didn't have a clear idea as to exactly where this guy was going. I did notice that the actual scene footage showed the Crown Vic had red and blue roof bar.This guard was no rookie. Lots of questions on this one although a Security KIA did make national TV.

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