Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

what new regs should and CAN we lobby for to boost pay?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • what new regs should and CAN we lobby for to boost pay?

    Looking into future on New Year's Eve, what regs and extra lic requirements could ACTUALLY HAPPEN that would end up boosting pay for Security Guards?

    I'm working on the premise that Barriers To Entry of a needed vocation always boost pay, or encourage replacement by tech, or adoption of duties by other cross-trained personal, but mostly more Govt mandated requirements boost pay.

    Also, what can be done to INCREASE ENFORCEMENT of operators that are not complying with regs? When I was inquiring about getting a Qualified Operator's lic and heard it was months and months for each of several steps, I was told "but don't worry too much, BSIS is so back logged even if you get cited for No Lincense by the time they get around to your case you will have your QO and PPO and they will retro-accept that".

  • #2
    You're on the right track. Basic CPR / first aid. Conflict resolution skills (something like Verbal Judo), and you have to pass a test on it. Basic English competency - I know, that's not PC, but how the heck do you communicate with 911 or emergency services if you don't have basic language skills? Require more training for armed officers, along with a mandated minimum wage for the position that isn't a joke.

    As far as regulation enforcement, the only solution I've come up with is to find a private entity that has enough power to make state governments do something, like the insurance industry. Otherwise, nothing happens unless a guard massively screws up, and then there's a big push for awhile, followed by the same old routine. The only thing that gets government moving is money, or the threat of having it taken away. (Can you imagine if your state's licensing dept. got fined or sued whenever a company they were supposed to be regulating screwed up? I imagine they'd be more diligent.)



    Comment


    • #3
      Hazard pay, for one. I don’t what country everyone is from, but here in the US we have the 2nd amendment. Each encounter on the job could be your last.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Lone Wolf View Post
        Hazard pay, for one. I don’t what country everyone is from, but here in the US we have the 2nd amendment. Each encounter on the job could be your last.
        What does the 2A have to do with someone illegally using a Weapon? Why should security guards get “hazard” pay?

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Soper View Post

          What does the 2A have to do with someone illegally using a Weapon? Why should security guards get “hazard” pay?
          Because this job is hazardous. I swear, do you argue just for the sake of arguing? We, as an industry, are undertrained, unarmed, and lack backup. When seconds count, the police are minutes away. So we are on our own to fend for ourselves and our sites. I think that deserves extra pay, don’t you?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Soper View Post

            What does the 2A have to do with someone illegally using a Weapon? Why should security guards get “hazard” pay?
            The concept of Hazard pay isn't that far out there.

            A security guard that sitting at the front desk of a major corporation essentially acting as a receptionist doesn't have a job that's as dangerous as a guy who's working in a parking garage and whose job is to deal with drunks and homeless Tweakers all night additionally spends most of his shift outdoors in the cold.

            I think a guard who's in a position that routinely requires him to enforce policies that bring him into direct conflict with client customers should make a little bit more.

            if I'm sitting in an office somewhere looking at security monitors and C *Cure should I make as much as a guy who's wondering is this the time somebody's going to rob me every time he gets out of the armored car.


            I do agree however that the Second Amendment has zero bearing on the illegal use of firearms by criminals
            Last edited by Lunch Meat; 01-01-2019, 11:12 AM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Lone Wolf View Post

              Because this job is hazardous. I swear, do you argue just for the sake of arguing? We, as an industry, are undertrained, unarmed, and lack backup. When seconds count, the police are minutes away. So we are on our own to fend for ourselves and our sites. I think that deserves extra pay, don’t you?

              There was a guard up in Denver who got murdered trying to kick a homeless person out of a parking garage last year. That's one of the reasons I don't escalate with people. If I have to ask somebody to leave property I ask them one time and then I call the police.

              I mean I'm armed and I am an observe and report guard. Primarily, because I don't think my company would back me. Based on the company culture I am absolutely convinced that if my sidearm ever comes out of the holster I'm unemployed the INSTANT it breaks leather.

              If I get killed my wife is going to get whatever workers comp pays for an on the job death and double indemnity from my life insurance policy and that's it.

              if I'm permanently disabled I don't get the state employee pension. Again, I get whatever workers comp pays and SSI. If I see somebody committing an actual crime on my site (I don't care if they kill each other outside the fence) I keep an eye on them and I call the cops

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Lone Wolf View Post

                Because this job is hazardous. I swear, do you argue just for the sake of arguing?
                Has he actually ever posted a post that contributes to the discussion instead of just being insulting and rude to people?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hazard pay would be an issue because the guard co. would essentially be admitting the site was dangerous - and I notice they don't like doing that. One of the guard companies I worked for had everything from routine patrols with low risk to some flat out dangerous gigs (i.e. hospital emergency rooms / pysch wards). They never matched trained S/Os to the job, just moved the warm bodies around like chess pieces, claiming all the sites were low risk.

                  It would be nice if contract companies were required to have a tier system and certain sites would be required to have a level 2 or 3 security officer, as opposed to the guy that just got out of orientation class a half hour ago. The two biggest obstacles are clients who want to do everything the cheapest way possible, and state license departments that don't see any need to oversee the industry other than just making sure they're current on their payroll taxes and don't hire felons. (The last one being kind of hit and miss depending on your state.)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The best way to increase the pay for the security industry is to mandate more training and have resources to regulate the industry. In my state of California, it only takes 40 hours of training to become a guard. The industry should demand at least 160 hours of professional training (one month) to get a license to be a security guard. Also California has a major problem with sleazy security companies operating without following the rules, more tax money should be thrown at the regulatory agency to fine and/or shutdown these companies.
                    http://firearmsnerd.com/

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Condo Guard View Post
                      You're on the right track. Basic CPR / first aid. Conflict resolution skills (something like Verbal Judo), and you have to pass a test on it. Basic English competency - I know, that's not PC, but how the heck do you communicate with 911 or emergency services if you don't have basic language skills?


                      IIRC the required written test is in English but I've also seen "Trainers" hand out the answers, bit by bit, under the theory as long as they pass one way or another all that counts is at some point they knew the answers.

                      Issue with CPR/First Aid is does the Client's UNDERWRITER want marginal people trying to do it to random people, or do they just want a 911 call? "Exceeding Orders" is a bigger issue than "under performing" once actually on site and in right location for most Guards.

                      I'm pretty sure 911 has the major languages covered, or at least has some phrases like "wait a minute while we find a XXX speaker".....

                      its the Guard VS public I'm worried about.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I've worked on several sites where the post orders explicitly stated that the only medical aid a guard was allowed to render was calling 911 IF a Supervisor approved it.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          As a last resort, maybe something that would actually bring more value to Client.

                          I've got no personal prob with doing janitor's work at your typical "nothing ever happens" site, if its not too much and would "tie you up" so bad guys know where you gonna be for an hour. IMO methodically emptying trash and generally poking around in trash is best place to start in Lost Prevention because trash is #1 way people can think they are smart and sneak items out.

                          Only prob is that gets most employers thinking "So, I guess I should pay Guards same as lazy janitor".

                          Better idea might be to get educated on finer points of common alarm systems, so Client doesn't have to call another vendor for on site visit at $100/pop if a sensor acts up.

                          In CA I've worked with guys who got unarmed Guard Card but couldn't get Gun Permit due to prior conviction for Attempted Murder. Maybe that could be tighten up a little, but that would be going against the grain in CA where they are passing new laws to protect criminals from having to disclose records for employment.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Squid View Post
                            Better idea might be to get educated on finer points of common alarm systems, so Client doesn't have to call another vendor for on site visit at $100/pop if a sensor acts up.
                            Double plus ungood if the security system ever fails in such a way that the client incurs a loss after you messed it the first thing the client and the alarm vendor is going to do is blame you for the failure.

                            I stay in my lane.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Lunch Meat View Post

                              Double plus ungood if the security system ever fails in such a way that the client incurs a loss after you messed it the first thing the client and the alarm vendor is going to do is blame you for the failure.

                              I stay in my lane.
                              meh, I've worked sites where it was the ESL janitor's job to fix the sensors, after rain, after wind, after frost, after no reason at all. It was understood the system was just part of overall program, trying to play the odds.

                              I'm not so much talking about high end jewelry store, just your average building with legacy system.

                              But mostly would be nice that when you make one of those 3am phone calls to client you can say something besides "alarm making noise, thats all I know". Be nice to know how to reset and what might give false pos, how to quickly replace suspect sensor, etc.

                              Comment

                              300x250

                              Collapse

                              Mid 300x250

                              Collapse

                              Taboola

                              Collapse

                              Super Leaderboard

                              Collapse
                              Working...
                              X