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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Originally posted by Central
    i heard security guards can cuff them and use the word detained but are not allowed to say miranda rights or the term "you are being arrested" as your not a police officer. Is that correct?
    Miranda is an American court decision, look into the law in your country, that would provide better guidance.

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  • Central
    replied
    i heard security guards can cuff them and use the word detained but are not allowed to say miranda rights or the term "you are being arrested" as your not a police officer. Is that correct?

    Leave a comment:


  • Mr. Security
    replied
    Ct

    In the example you provided, I would cuff him if he had dropped the weapon and was waiting for the police to arrive. Crazy? Depends. Sometimes people will wait for the police after committing a violent felony. Perhaps the rage has subsided or revenge has been served, and they know arrest is unavoidable anyhow. Cuffing them prevents further harm to others or the suspect in the event that they become violent again or are contemplating suicide.

    Of course if the suspect was unwilling to be cuffed, then concentrate on minimizing further attacks and help the victim if possible.

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  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Tennessee has the same law. The idea is that you are accorded all the powers of a law enforcement officer, and sometimes even the immunity of one, when you are engaged in enforcing law through private arrest.

    Merely because someone runs inside their home does not mean that you have to give up making a private arrest. Especially for a misdemeanor, where a public law enforcement officer lacks probable cause to break the door down to "take over" where you were required to stop.

    Many state's citizen's arrest statutes enable the citizen the powers "traditionally reserved" by a law enforcement officer (making arrests, breaking down doors, freeing themselves if trapped, etc) when making an arrest. Usually, because the state hasn't altered the original wording which took into count that there was one Sheriff and two deputies in the 1900s for a county.

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  • CorpSec
    replied
    Here are some of Minnesota's laws. They actually give us a lot of latitude in making arrests for all types of crimes.

    How many states would let a private person break down the door of a house to get to a felon? (629.38)

    I am not suggesting that as a security officer, I would be busting down doors to get to the bad guy. But, I suppose it is a nice feature.

    629.30 ARRESTS; BY WHOM MADE; AIDING OFFICER.
    Subdivision 1. Definition. Arrest means taking a person into custody that the person may
    be held to answer for a public offense. "Arrest" includes actually restraining a person or taking
    into custody a person who submits.
    Subd. 2. Who may arrest. An arrest may be made:
    (1) by a peace officer under a warrant;
    (2) by a peace officer without a warrant;
    (3) by an officer in the United States Customs Service or the Immigration and Naturalization
    Service without a warrant;
    (4) by a private person.
    A private person shall aid a peace officer in executing a warrant when requested to do
    so by the officer.
    History: (10566) RL s 5225; 1981 c 108 s 1; 1985 c 265 art 10 s 1

    629.37 WHEN A PRIVATE PERSON MAY MAKE AN ARREST.
    A private person may arrest another:
    (1) for a public offense committed or attempted in the arresting person's presence;
    (2) when the person arrested has committed a felony, although not in the arresting person's
    presence; or
    (3) when a felony has in fact been committed, and the arresting person has reasonable cause
    for believing the person arrested to have committed it.
    History: (10573) RL s 5232; 1985 c 265 art 10 s 1

    629.38 REQUIRING A PRIVATE PERSON TO DISCLOSE CAUSE OF ARREST.
    Before making an arrest a private person shall inform the person to be arrested of the cause
    of the arrest and require the person to submit. The warning required by this section need not be
    given if the person is arrested while committing the offense or when the person is arrested on
    pursuit immediately after committing the offense. If a person has committed a felony, a private
    person may break open an outer or inner door or window of a dwelling house to make the arrest
    if, before entering, the private person informs the person to be arrested of the intent to make the
    arrest and the private person is then refused admittance.
    History: (10574) RL s 5233; 1985 c 265 art 10 s 1; 1986 c 444

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  • HotelSecurity
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
    That was changing a username from 1 to another. You're asking about "account" or "username" merging, which may not be possible. Changing a username is 1 click in most forum software, where that's two user accounts that would have to be merged.
    Dix-quatre! (That's French for 10-4!)

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Originally posted by HotelSecurity
    Didn't BHR Lawson used to post under BHR Wakenhut (sp?). Someone changed all his posts to his new name. Could my 2 valuable posts( ) posted under Neil not be changed to HotelSecurity?
    That was changing a username from 1 to another. You're asking about "account" or "username" merging, which may not be possible. Changing a username is 1 click in most forum software, where that's two user accounts that would have to be merged.

    Leave a comment:


  • ValleyOne
    replied
    Originally posted by lexor
    This might be a stupid question but ive always been wondering about, and it has never been brought to my attention.

    Can you cuff someone to detain them...(example) There is a fight the victom is stabbed, can u take down the suspect and cuff him untill police arrive to the scene?
    *Laughing at myself* I totally skipped over this part, taking down a suspect armed with a knife who just stabbed someone? I know this is just a what if type of scenario, but always remember if he has a knife make sure you have a gun. If not, just observe and report. Then call it in, and provide aid to the victim if you can.

    But that's just me...

    As for the answers to your Q, Lex just go through and read the posts we all have left and make the smart decision(s).

    Leave a comment:


  • HotelSecurity
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
    By Admin, you mean Geoff Kohl, and I don't think so. That is most likely beyond the powers of vBulletin.
    Didn't BHR Lawson used to post under BHR Wakenhut (sp?). Someone changed all his posts to his new name. Could my 2 valuable posts( ) posted under Neil not be changed to HotelSecurity?

    Leave a comment:


  • LPGuy
    replied
    Originally posted by lexor
    This might be a stupid question but ive always been wondering about, and it has never been brought to my attention.

    Can you cuff someone to detain them...(example) There is a fight the victom is stabbed, can u take down the suspect and cuff him untill police arrive to the scene?
    You can always make a citizen's arrest for a felony crime and hold the suspect for the police. Whether or not you can use handcuffs may or may not be addressed in your state law. That's where you should check. Then, as others have said, be sure that you are within company policy if you are using handcuffs--if the company didn't issue them to you in the first place, you may be in trouble with your company if you use them.

    I would also advise getting some training in handcuffing techniques if you are going to be using them.

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Originally posted by HotelSecurity
    Opps I got caught! I joined the forum back in 2005 & made 1 post. When I rediscovered it last year I forgot that I was already a member & when I tried to register with my real name (I have nothing to hide), it said that the name was already being used. Not realizing it was being used by ME I re joined, as HotelSecurity but I kept the same password, so looks like I can post under either

    Can one of you Admin people cancel my Neil listing & transfer the posts to HotelSecurity?
    By Admin, you mean Geoff Kohl, and I don't think so. That is most likely beyond the powers of vBulletin.

    Leave a comment:


  • HotelSecurity
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
    Did you forget or remember a login?
    Opps I got caught! I joined the forum back in 2005 & made 1 post. When I rediscovered it last year I forgot that I was already a member & when I tried to register with my real name (I have nothing to hide), it said that the name was already being used. Not realizing it was being used by ME I re joined, as HotelSecurity but I kept the same password, so looks like I can post under either

    Can one of you Admin people cancel my Neil listing & transfer the posts to HotelSecurity?

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Originally posted by Neil
    Almost all of this on this forum reject the idea that we are want-a-bees. Yet we seem to forget that there is a big difference in policing & security. For the most part police enforce laws, security enforces rules. Some of us have other safety type duties such as fire watch, first aid service etc. I estimate that 90% of my job does not involve dealing with criminal matters. I carry cuffs. None of my staff do. In 30+ years I've used them maybe 10 times.
    Did you forget or remember a login?

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    If you're not issued cuffs, then 9 times out of 10, you are not to detain or arrest anyone. This would be a violation of company policy, and grounds for denying your unemployment insurance.

    Oh, and if you are injured, grounds for denying your worker's compensation, because you performed activities that were directly against the company's orders.

    This is how warm body companies get out of paying worker's comp claims: The guard was never supposed to confront the person, so we're not paying, he violated policy.

    Leave a comment:


  • davis002
    replied
    Originally posted by Chucky
    I don't know if you have ever dealt with someone on meth determined to get what he needs free. My post is in a drug distribution center. Armed and with some civilians for back up. Ok the guy comes in and he's bug eyed. Tweakers have exceptional strenth. It takes five guys to subdue this guy. He will not stop fighting. We are all getting to the end of our strenth. The cops are still 5 mins away.

    Now and I mean right now something has to be done or this guy breaks free, Ok I reach for my cuffs as 1 more tool. Oh NO! I don't have cuffs because they may be a liability. At this point do I really care about the company that put me in this situation or the cops arresting me for having cuffs? Or do I say I lived through another day on the job hi kids. Or do I simply let him come at me with out a weapon and tell the judge that I put a 40 cal hollow point in his head because I was in fear for my life and no other lessor means were available to me. If this was a real world scenario all these decisions would have to be made in less time then it took you to read this. This is what I do for real and very well could be real.

    If you still would want to fire me then would you be so kind as to sign the form so that I may collect unemployment compensation?
    I actually agree with Hotel Security on this. If you are not allowed to carry something, regardless of what it is, then you simply shouldn't. If you disagree, you don't ignore them and go ahead and carry it anyways. You are better of starting some dialogue with the policy makers, and argue as to why you need cuffs. Based on what you wrote, you can make a solid arguement. As far as the unemployment insurance comment... good luck on that. Most states will only grant unemployment benefits if you lost your job at no fault of your own. Termination due to carrying unauthorized equipment won't get you a dime.

    Leave a comment:

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