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Security Association: Expectations, Dues, Etc...

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    SecTrainer
    Senior Member

  • SecTrainer
    replied
    Yes, but you're still trying to address "what other lodges might be" or how they might work. I'm being much more specific than that and saying start your own local organization and address some particular issue(s). When you have a healthy, thriving local organization that has some solid accomplishments on behalf of its members - and only then - do you think about whether the model might be replicated elsewhere.

    This seems to fly in the face of the idea that we should plan, but actually it does not. What it does is to focus your planning on the immediate issues, and prevents you from diffusing time and energy on issues that are much less immediate.

    My advice would be to get your local organization going and focus every bit of your attention on that. Think of the local organization as your pilot model, and one that must show proof-of-concept before it even thinks about moving out. There's something marvelously energizing about stopping down your lens. Just finding and then organizing enough officers in your local area who will actually work for the organization in order to first agree upon and then accomplish even the smallest real objective (except serving tea and swapping war stories) will prove to be a very significant challenge, and one that is quite different from "starting lodges" over the Internet.

    Having done that, you can then come back and say "We've done this", and the rest of us will have a working model to emulate.
    SecTrainer
    Senior Member
    Last edited by SecTrainer; 02-24-2007, 07:15 PM.

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  • N. A. Corbier
    Senior Member

  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Originally posted by Dam Guard
    I will add my 2 cents for what it's worth. The WWW changed things so I see no reason an organisation couldn't start out National or maybe even North American. Such an organisation could indeed exist as a sort of security lobbyist so to speak. As far as dues maybe start at $5 or 10 monthly for individuals?
    Here are some reasons why national or international don't work. I know this, because I watched an organization fail on this scope, NAPSOA.

    1. No local voice. A senator in Florida really could give less care if an organization has people who aren't even in the state he is elected to is writing him talking about something. Now, 200 people IN Florida, he cares.

    2. No face time. I've built several sites for organizations. But, when it comes down to it, there's no face time between members, and this translates into lack of force to do things and effect change.

    3. Lack of Return on Investment. So, you pay $10 bucks a month, and you get what, exactly? Access to a forum? Guess what, we have a forum ,its free, its right here. An ID card? Big whoop. A badge? That you can't wear, may be illegal in your state to possess, etc. Where' the ROI on an organization that's "on the internet?"

    An organizational website should support its organization, but not be the actual organization itself.

    Leave a comment:

  • Dam Guard
    Member

  • Dam Guard
    replied
    I will add my 2 cents for what it's worth. The WWW changed things so I see no reason an organisation couldn't start out National or maybe even North American. Such an organisation could indeed exist as a sort of security lobbyist so to speak. As far as dues maybe start at $5 or 10 monthly for individuals?

    Leave a comment:

  • N. A. Corbier
    Senior Member

  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    This is one of the requirements I have set for FOPSO. There must be enough people in one geographical area to support a lodge. The lodge must work independently, within the framework set up, and support itself.

    Large "national organizations" from scratch are prone to fail. Too many things to cover, not enough people to cover them, not enough influence.

    One lodge could (and from what I understand, will shortly) cover a city, a county, or even a site. It is that small level that allows people to associate themselves together for whatever purpose they wish. Be it change a law, work towards a goal, or simply hang out with those who work in the industry but may never meet due to other company affiliations.

    Leave a comment:

  • SecTrainer
    Senior Member

  • SecTrainer
    replied
    It's interesting to read the history of the FOP. The FOP started out as a small local organization (two or three guys on a local PD) to address one central issue of concern to that particular department, and they did so successfully. Then, and only over time, it became what it is today.

    This is the path that most successful organizations follow - businesses, religions, nonprofits, political movements, etc. They start small, start local, and they succeed in doing one thing. Only then do they think about growing and expanding their focus. There are many, many reasons why this model is the one that works best.

    The age of the Internet can create the illusion that this "growth" pathway is no longer necessary. We can create organizations, throw up websites and sign up members, all seemingly in the blink of an eye...and that's sufficient for some things, like discussion forums and a very small set of business models. Most organizations that involve real projects and real human effort that must be directed and managed should not try to leapfrog over the initial local-growth stages.

    My point is that babies aren't born as adults and I think the FOP is a good model to think about - not just as they are today, but also in the way they began and became successful.
    SecTrainer
    Senior Member
    Last edited by SecTrainer; 02-24-2007, 06:53 PM.

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  • Guest
    Guest

  • OccamsRazor
    Guest replied
    Originally posted by Mr. Security
    Boy, where to start..
    Dues: Annual; based on wage and type of security
    I would agree more on the wage and less on the "type". I know some armed guards making $12.50 less an hour than I am. There are in-house guards around here making less than contract guards.

    Etc.

    Leave a comment:


  • tlangsr
    replied
    Originally posted by Mr. Security
    Boy, where to start..

    Scope: National
    Mission: Decent wage; Competent Officers; Safe Working Conditions; Public Relations Department w/ LE Liason
    Dues: Annual; based on wage and type of security

    Just as a start.

    I 100% agree

    Leave a comment:


  • Eric
    replied
    Perhaps start national, then move to Canada etc.

    Different levels of membership, based on salary or position.

    Raise awareness/importance of security roles to us, general public and government, and then push for a training basic/advanced standard.

    Not to take HotelSecurity's thunder, but he is right on about the Insurance companies taking a lead on standards.

    Leave a comment:

  • Mr. Security
    Senior Member

  • Mr. Security
    replied
    Boy, where to start..

    Scope: National
    Mission: Decent wage; Competent Officers; Safe Working Conditions; Public Relations Department w/ LE Liason
    Dues: Annual; based on wage and type of security

    Just as a start.

    Leave a comment:

  • N. A. Corbier
    Senior Member

  • Security Association: Expectations, Dues, Etc...

    Remember when there was talk of making a security association on SIW? Then there was NAPSOA, and Histfan71 throwing fits about how he's a federal law enforcement officer and security guards should only observe and report... And that NAPSOA is evil because they want guards to do more than that...

    Anyway... This is me asking, not an Advisor of NAPSOA or a manager at NAPSOA Incorporated. But, you know, me. The one who rarely advertises NAPSOA on this forum, or even really talks about it.

    Throw NAPSOA, IFPO, ASIS, and the rest of the acronyms out of the picture for a minute, and I'd like to know a few things.

    1. What do you expect a security association, organization, or fraternal order to do for you? Especially in exchange for paying dues to belong to it. (Are we talking politicking, or the cool credit cards and stuff FOP has, or just comradere?)

    2. What would you consider a "bearable" dues for the individual officer? We don't make much. Not at all. Some of you know I'm going back into the rat race soon as a uniform. Yearly? Bi-Yearly? Monthly?

    3. What do you think the mission of a security association should be?

    4. How large of a scope do you think it should be? International, National, State, or Local? Or a combination of those, in a tiered arrangement, like Eagles and Elks and FOP, etc.

    Nobody take this as a suggestion that I'm plotting anything, please.

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