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  • #31
    Its "agent of the goverment." A Company Police Officer in NC can't carry, nor can someone like Histfan71 (Government contractor, no matter what his badge says) but a state university or state junior college officer can.
    Some Kind of Commando Leader

    "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Black Caesar
      An out of state LEO who meets the requirements of HR218 in their own state can carry anywhere in the United States except under special circumstances where state law says they can't.
      "We disagree" isn't a special circumstance.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
        nor can someone like Histfan71 (Government contractor, no matter what his badge says)
        Where has that fool been? I have a friend who's a Sgt. on Kwaj, turns out he's his boss.

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        • #34
          Office of the Revision Counsel, U.S. House of Representatives

          Please go to that site and enter the following: Title 18, US Code Sections 926B and 926C.
          Enjoy the day,
          Bill

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Jackhole
            Where has that fool been? I have a friend who's a Sgt. on Kwaj, turns out he's his boss.
            Banned for making personal attacks. Permabanned.

            I have heard disturbing things from guys who know guys on Kwaj about that guy. Disturbing things. But, its all second hand, so I take it with a grain of salt.
            Some Kind of Commando Leader

            "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
              Banned for making personal attacks. Permabanned.

              I have heard disturbing things from guys who know guys on Kwaj about that guy. Disturbing things. But, its all second hand, so I take it with a grain of salt.
              I'm sure I've heard the same things.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Jackhole
                "We disagree" isn't a special circumstance.

                ???

                What are we disagreeing about?

                EDIT: Oh, I see what you mean, Wisconsin can't just disagree with the Feds.

                You're right, BUT they have ways of doing things, allowed in HR218. If they wanted to they could make a law saying out of state LEOs can't carry in wisconsin, see below:

                (from HR218)
                `Sec. 926B. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified law enforcement officers

                `(a) Notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof, an individual who is a qualified law enforcement officer and who is carrying the identification required by subsection (d) may carry a concealed firearm that has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, subject to subsection (b).

                `(b) This section shall not be construed to supersede or limit the laws of any State that--

                `(1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the possession of concealed firearms on their property; or

                `(2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local government property, installation, building, base, or park.
                The underlined parts are those that allow the states to restrict where LEOs covered by HR218 can carry. New Jersey says you can't carry in their casinos, so you can't. The Federal Government says you can't carry on a military base, so you can't. Ect Ect.

                But it also means that HR218 covered LEOs can carry in places where "civilians" with CCWs can't. Thats how it was explained to me anyways.

                It's moot for active and retired "out of state" LEOs, you just have to meet the requirements in your state, Wisconsin can't say anything to you about that.

                Wisconsin's problem is Sec. 3 of HR218. The part about Retired LEOs. In state retired LEOs are facing an up hill battle getting the right to carry off duty in Wisconsin it seems.

                HR218 text
                Last edited by Black Caesar; 12-02-2006, 07:14 PM.
                ~Black Caesar~
                Corbier's Commandos

                " "The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." ~Margaret Thatcher

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Black Caesar
                  The problem with Wisconsin (as I understand it) has nothing to do with OUT OF STATe LEOs. Nothing Wisconsin can do can prevent out of state active and retired LEOs cover under the act from carrying concealed. The probelm exists for IN STATE retired LEOs. Supposedly, Hr216 conflicts with some existing laws and such in wisconsin.

                  Exactly my point!!!

                  If WI allowed retired PO's to carry conceled, then they would have to allow PI's & security personal to carry concealed. The state is very against any CCW laws.
                  "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."

                  ~~George Orwell.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Bill Warnock
                    Please go to that site and enter the following: Title 18, US Code Sections 926B and 926C.
                    Enjoy the day,
                    Bill
                    Here's another:

                    hr218
                    ~Black Caesar~
                    Corbier's Commandos

                    " "The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." ~Margaret Thatcher

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
                      Its "agent of the goverment." A Company Police Officer in NC can't carry, nor can someone like Histfan71 (Government contractor, no matter what his badge says) but a state university or state junior college officer can.
                      I know quite a few guys are are royally ticked off about that too. Friends of mine who work for Private Institutions (Baylor Health Care System Police, Methodist Hospital of Dallas Police, and Southern Methodist University PD specifically).

                      Same academy requirement, same state requirements to become peace officers, same authority, but if they want to carry legally in another state they have to get a CCW. "Civillians" who take a one day CCW class can carry out of state, but they can't.

                      I know that would tick me off. The provision about officer's "working for the gvernment" was pushed but FoP and other unions I heard, for what reasons I'm not sure..
                      ~Black Caesar~
                      Corbier's Commandos

                      " "The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." ~Margaret Thatcher

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Special Investigator
                        Exactly my point!!!
                        You have funny ways of proving your points then. I told you a few times that I was not a retired in-state LEO, yet you continued to insist that I wouldn't be allowed to carry there.

                        It's a moot point anyway. I can't think of any reason I would need to travel to WI with my weapon, other than to kill myself with it because I was in WI.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Jackhole
                          You have funny ways of proving your points then. I told you a few times that I was not a retired in-state LEO, yet you continued to insist that I wouldn't be allowed to carry there.

                          It's a moot point anyway. I can't think of any reason I would need to travel to WI with my weapon, other than to kill myself with it because I was in WI.
                          There goes that psych. test....
                          Security: Freedom from fear; danger; safe; a feeling of well-being. (Webster's)

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Jackhole
                            You have funny ways of proving your points then. I told you a few times that I was not a retired in-state LEO, yet you continued to insist that I wouldn't be allowed to carry there.

                            I can't think of any reason I would need to travel to WI with my weapon, other than to kill myself with it because I was in WI.
                            Originally Posted by Special Investigator
                            .....but if you are a retired LEO, you cannot carry a CW in WI.

                            Your answer - Yes, you can.
                            No you cant! I didn't say if your a 'current' LEO you couldn't, only if your a retired LEO.

                            Looking foreward to your visit to WI.
                            Last edited by Special Investigator; 12-02-2006, 07:59 PM.
                            "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."

                            ~~George Orwell.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              SEC. 3. EXEMPTION OF QUALIFIED RETIRED LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS FROM STATE LAWS PROHIBITING THE CARRYING OF CONCEALED FIREARMS.

                              (a) In General- Chapter 44 of title 18, United States Code, is further amended by inserting after section 926B the following:

                              `Sec. 926C. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified retired law enforcement officers

                              `(a) Notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof, an individual who is a qualified retired law enforcement officer and who is carrying the identification required by subsection (d) may carry a concealed firearm that has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, subject to subsection (b).

                              `(b) This section shall not be construed to supersede or limit the laws of any State that--

                              `(1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the possession of concealed firearms on their property; or

                              `(2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local government property, installation, building, base, or park.

                              `(c) As used in this section, the term `qualified retired law enforcement officer' means an individual who--

                              `(1) retired in good standing from service with a public agency as a law enforcement officer, other than for reasons of mental instability;

                              `(2) before such retirement, was authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of, or the incarceration of any person for, any violation of law, and had statutory powers of arrest;

                              `(3)(A) before such retirement, was regularly employed as a law enforcement officer for an aggregate of 15 years or more; or

                              `(B) retired from service with such agency, after completing any applicable probationary period of such service, due to a service-connected disability, as determined by such agency;

                              `(4) has a nonforfeitable right to benefits under the retirement plan of the agency;

                              `(5) during the most recent 12-month period, has met, at the expense of the individual, the State's standards for training and qualification for active law enforcement officers to carry firearms;

                              `(6) is not under the influence of alcohol or another intoxicating or hallucinatory drug or substance; and

                              `(7) is not prohibited by Federal law from receiving a firearm.

                              `(d) The identification required by this subsection is--

                              `(1) a photographic identification issued by the agency from which the individual retired from service as a law enforcement officer that indicates that the individual has, not less recently than one year before the date the individual is carrying the concealed firearm, been tested or otherwise found by the agency to meet the standards established by the agency for training and qualification for active law enforcement officers to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm; or

                              `(2)(A) a photographic identification issued by the agency from which the individual retired from service as a law enforcement officer; and

                              `(B) a certification issued by the State in which the individual resides that indicates that the individual has, not less recently than one year before the date the individual is carrying the concealed firearm, been tested or otherwise found by the State to meet the standards established by the State for training and qualification for active law enforcement officers to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm.

                              `(e) As used in this section, the term `firearm' does not include--

                              `(1) any machinegun (as defined in section 5845 of the National Firearms Act);

                              `(2) any firearm silencer (as defined in section 921 of this title); and

                              `(3) a destructive device (as defined in section 921 of this title).'.

                              (b) Clerical Amendment- The table of sections for such chapter is further amended by inserting after the item relating to section 926B the following:

                              `926C. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified retired law enforcement officers.'
                              http://www.kcpoa.org/legal/hr218.html
                              "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
                              "The Curve" 1998

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Black Caesar
                                I know quite a few guys are are royally ticked off about that too. Friends of mine who work for Private Institutions (Baylor Health Care System Police, Methodist Hospital of Dallas Police, and Southern Methodist University PD specifically).

                                Same academy requirement, same state requirements to become peace officers, same authority, but if they want to carry legally in another state they have to get a CCW. "Civillians" who take a one day CCW class can carry out of state, but they can't.

                                I know that would tick me off. The provision about officer's "working for the gvernment" was pushed but FoP and other unions I heard, for what reasons I'm not sure..
                                Because the Fraternal Order of Police lobbies for the betterment of government-derived law enforcement officers, not specials or auxiliaries or other private law enforcement. Without speaking for the Grand Lodge, they consider them security personnel taking jobs away from government sanctioned police forces.

                                In other words, they wanted to make sure that only government-appointed LEOs got to carry. Those who are not government-appointed cannot join the FOP, and are not "brothers in blue" to the FOP. They're the competition.
                                Some Kind of Commando Leader

                                "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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