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  • #16
    Originally posted by kingsman
    The first week at a new sight with 5 officers on duty, and me the new supervisor of night shift, I found two officers asleep in the patrol vehicle.
    Now, they didn't just nod off sitting in teh vehicle, they had the seats fully reclined and didn't wake up until we rapped several times on the window. I had them both removed from my team.

    Now, I have caught several others nodded off from time to time. but as long as they are not intentionally sleeping and don't make a habit of it I don't ream their ass. I make sure they get up and move around. stretch, jog in place, get a drink, whatever you need to do to stay awake.

    Currently, I have one guard I know is sleeping on duty, but I can't prove it because we are now only two and he does it on patrol where I cannot see him.
    I was a little bit of the opposite, but I guess thats because of the site I worked. If you nodded off at our security desk, you were pretty much gone. I cant have officers sleeping in front of people. However; if someone realized they were tired and had someone else hold down the fort and they took a short nap, this was more preferable. I have also found that having somebody move around and be active doesn't always work. All that is going to happen is they get the blood flowing until they have to sit back down, I would rather them take a little bit, be refreshed, and ready to go than dragging ass the entire shift.
    "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
    "The Curve" 1998

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    • #17
      Originally posted by copelandamuffy
      It could have been a warm and muggy night. Perahaps he is a true gentleman
      helping a young lady in need of being cooled down
      Yea, that's what happened
      I enforce rules and regulations, not laws.
      Security Officers. The 1st First Responders.

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      • #18
        Sticky dillema..

        Wow, after reading all the posts to this, I know I will probably come off as a tyrant. I definately sympathyse with the reasoning and justification, but I am torn..

        A few months back, I terminated an Officer who felt it necessary to find a comfy couch after closing the mall on a sunday, and snoring away until the night janitor came in to wake him up. I did not ask for reason why, or for an excuse. Needless to say, he was known for tipping quite a few when he should have been sleeping.

        I was taught the hard way, and alot of my staff operate the hard way. Several of my officers have had to pull 17 1/2 hour shifts, to turn right around 6 hours later and pull another 8 hour shift. I can see the pain in their eyes as they are completely fried, but they hang in like real troopers, and do not go off and pass out somewhere. I hate it ever coming down to having someone work that long, but sometimes its unavoidable.

        My situation.. Having had all the fun i did in the military, It was not uncommon to end up with a Staff Duty shift, which an Army background would understand the pure hell behind it, especially combat arms. You come in on the morning around 4:00 am, conduct a couple hours of PT (physical training, generally consisting of running your keester off), go get changed, then report to the headquarter building. You enter through the front doors, and there is a plain desk, with a phone on it. You go over, sit down at the desk, and that is your station for the next 24 hours. You do not leave for any reason, unless you catch another soldier passing through, at which you ask him to post at the desk while you go squeeze a leaf, then return and stay at that desk. Officers come in and out, you jump to attention, salute each and every one of them, and go back to sitting down. Anyone who knows government buildings, know that the walls are plain and eeath toned.. makes for a wonderful time. Once your 24 shift is up, you turn right around, get changed into PT clothes, and go to PT for another 2 hours. Then you are off for the day....Sometimes!!!! The unlucky days, you have to work with your gear, getting it ready for a deployment, then at 5:00 (17:00) you get off.

        I hated this with a passion, and couldnt understand why we did this. I thought it was punishment or somebodies way of hating you... Then came the time we had all trained for, for so long. Being re-assigned to 3ID, and going on an outing to visit new people, and do such wonderful things. Needless to say.. we got the hook up. They set us up for success.. before reaching the hot deserts, we all got a wonderful dose of Small Pox vaccines (and any one who knows about small pox, it gives you flu and fever symptoms). Heat on top of heat.. So everything is against you. Finally, I got to make that utopically wonderful drive non-stop for 4 days. Being a driver, and staying awake for so long, especially when the front view out your window looks like everything else.. all the time.. can make for a great road trip. Dont get me wrong.. I cant say we never stopped, because we did, but it wasnt to sleep. Some foriegn Yehoo decided to want our attention. After all of this, I fully understood the value of challenge.

        Now, i know I work with civillians, and expecting them to handle themselves the same way with as much hardship is wrong.. Its not fun, it can be miserable, and sometimes you just dont feel you have it in you.. But it will come to an end. I wish I could explain, but the look in peoples eyes that we deal with (meaning all of us), you can see they count on us for something. People always look to Security for answers. Sometimes they expect something from us, we know we cant provide. But, my motto is, lets alaways be alert to provide what we can. Its the least we can do to help the client, and help others.. We wouldnt be doing this job if we didnt want to help others!
        Deputy Sheriff

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        • #19
          I do not think you are providing special treatment, you looked at all the circumstances and made an intelligent choice.
          I would consider a bit of unannouced supervision, only to be sure a habit is not formed, keeping a good officer, good.
          Quote me as saying I was mis-quoted.
          Groucho Marx

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          • #20
            [QUOTE=copelandamuffy]
            And I make a effort every month to choose an Officer
            of the month and turn that person's name into the
            branch office. The above named Officer will be choosen in the coming
            months for his pitching in and thus saving on overtime

            I wish my boss was like that, but it seems the ones that do the right thing get treated badly and the ones that continually do the wrong thing get rewarded.
            But on topic I had to watch hsc ( high school certificate)papers in a school yard church, I relieved the boss at 6oclock in the arvo and she was supposed to relieve me at 6am it got to about 9am and I felt myself dosing off so I got up and walked around this tiny little room filled with paperwork only until I found a little mouse to talk to in the kitchen. I can honestly say I have never been that tired in my whole life, to a point I was seeing things move out of the corner of my eyes that were not there. My boss arrived at 1pm that arvo all nice and fresh and stated that she had a lovely sleep in and thanks for that. never mind the fact that I have a young child that I should have been at home with and my then fiancee (now husband)who I had to get to walk up and drive me home because i couldnt possibly drive. but anyway i wasnt going to let myself go to sleep no matter what.
            ozsecuritychic
            Member
            Last edited by ozsecuritychic; 09-29-2006, 10:49 AM.

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            • #21
              Um, if your national police or whoever runs your licenses cares, report your boss for leaving you on post for 19 hours. I know in the US, that's several violations of both labor law and (if you have them in your state) security licensing law.

              At the end of that, would you really of been able to do your job if you had to, due to fatigue and exaustion?
              Some Kind of Commando Leader

              "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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              • #22
                I believe armed security is limited to 12 hour shifts here in michigan, but I know my supervisor has exceeded that on many occassions. They both work 80 hours a week working 16 hour shifts.

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                • #23
                  I never sleep on the .......ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
                  Security: Freedom from fear; danger; safe; a feeling of well-being. (Webster's)

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                  • #24
                    Yes, there are a few labor laws being violated if you have armed officers on post over 12 hours, I believe that is a federal deal as well, applicable to all states. Something were to go down, things went bad and later your officer was deemed unfit for duty, due to working a doube 8, somebody is going to own up for that..bigtime.
                    I was a roving GSA supervisor, some of my assigned post I had to check on were way out in the boonies, sites like a FEMA trailer staging area. (several square acres of empty 5th wheel trailers behind barb wire fences, no one for hundreds of miles) Our officers were not allowed radio or TV under federal regulations, so it was easy for any human being to nodd off at 4.00am on a 12 hour night shift all alone or with just 1 partner.
                    I would make it a habbit of calling my officers about 5-10 minutes out from my arrival each night. That way, I never 'caught' them sleeping, if they were, it simply made things work for everyone involved.
                    We did have to term 2 guys, whose big idea was to sneak off & sleep in a movie theater that was technically on thier post area, while the double movie was playing...just when you think you have seen it all!
                    Yoda
                    Sometimes there is "Justice", sometimes there is "Just Us"

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                    • #25
                      Can you find those labor laws, especially as they apply to armed only? They may be for GSA contracts, but the only federal regulations I know of for armed security is the one which allows armored couriers to carry in every state on 1 state's license, even if the local laws prohibit weapons are armed security.
                      Some Kind of Commando Leader

                      "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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