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aren't these "sub-contractor" positions illegal on several levels???

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  • aren't these "sub-contractor" positions illegal on several levels???

    OK, not only are they illegal unless guard in question has his own PPO lic, but the 'Labor Board' will tell you if they 'control your hours of employment and place of work you are an EMPLOYEE, not a 'sub', and that leads to various TAX LAWS being broken, all of which are felonies.





    Security Code 3 is hiring today! Sub-Contractors for 30 Days! (palo alto)



    We are an Equal Opportunity Employer and support Female Equality in the workplace.

    Position: Sub Contractors
    Location: Palo Alto
    Rate: $15.00 (Per Hour)
    Details: Must have reliable transportation. Must have a working cell phone. Must be willing to work between the hours of 6AM to 8PM.
    How to Apply: Apply in Person at our main office On Monday Feb. 3 and Thursday Feb. 6 located at 1735 N 1st Street #104, San Jose, CA 95112. From 9am to 5pm.

    CANDIDATES MUST HAVE:
    Guard Card Required. Successful applicants must have the ability to write and communicate in English, be eligible to work in the United States, pass drug screen, criminal background, reference check and reliable transportation.

    RESPONSIBILITIES:
    Conduct walking patrols of client properties. Complete detailed reports of all activity, observations and report incidents when appropriate. Provide courteous customer service. Maintain a safe, comfortable and secure work environment and at assigned locations. Complete a daily activity report. Ability to follow detailed procedures and have superior customer service skills. Strong verbal communication skills. Professional appearance and demeanor. Ability to interact with all levels of the public. Be Reliable and Punctual. Be Physically able to walk and stand for 8 hours.

    Compensation: $15.00 (Per Hour)
    Principals only. Recruiters, please don't contact this job poster.
    do NOT contact us with unsolicited services or offers

  • #2
    Ah, the old "independent contractor" routine. Do I have to sew my own uniform, too?
    I'm not up on CA labor laws, but I would imagine given all the regulations that being a "contractor" of any sort has a specific legal meaning. The fact that you have to have a guard card means you have to be with a specific guard co. or in-house department, which I would think makes you an employee. (I know in WA you don't just get to "freeelance" - your card is issued to you through the company.)

    This is why I limit my Craig's List reading - guaranteed to instantly generate a headache or "What the frog?" response.

    Comment


    • #3
      I'm sure the company knows what a 1099 is and how contractors work...
      You don't need an employer to get a guard card, gun card, etc.

      Comment


      • #4
        In Florida, we just call this spam. F.S.493, the statute that governs private security in the state, prohibits the use of 1099 subs as security officers because a 1099 removes you from the liability coverage that every company must maintain.
        "Lo Que Sea, Cuando Sea, Donde Sea"

        "Veni, Vidi, Vici!"

        "Whatcha gonna do now, PL?"

        "Strategy is the craft of the warrior. Commanders must enact the craft, and troopers should know this Way. There is no warrior in the world today who really understands the Way of strategy." Shinmen Musashi No Kami Fujiwara No Genshin

        http://sentinelsofflorida.com/ is where I go for all of my Florida security info.

        Comment


        • #5
          Soper, I don't what podunk state you operate in, but CA we got "guards" and 'PPO'(guard company), and something called http://www2.dca.ca.gov/pls/wllpub/wllqryna$lcev2.startup?p_qte_code=PSE&p_qte_pgm_co de=2420

          You can work as guard for a non-guard company, but only as a W-2 employee. We were all directly cautioned against non-employee type 'gigs' as security guards. All fine and well until "something happens", which it often does at parties and events.

          But I've never gotten a straight answer as to the most fundamental question of "What IS a 'guard'?", being as non-card carrying employees seem perfectly able to do anything a guard does, including arresting shoplifters, issuing ID badges, etc.

          In CA you don't need an employer to get guard or gun cards(in fact you are supposed to get them BEFORE working as a "guard") but the PPO needs to have extra insurance required by BSIS if they do ANY armed guarding.

          Interestingly, while all guard companies will say "no unauthorized weapons" while on duty, if your company has the BSIS required coverage SUPPOSEDLY if you have a gun card you can LEGALLY be 'strapped' (as we say in the ghetto) against company policy/orders and without permission.


          "Code-3" is a pretty big operation here in San Jose with lots of regular employee guards so I wonder WTF they are up to with this 'contractor' stuff.
          Last edited by Squid; 02-02-2014, 06:47 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Squid View Post
            Interestingly, while all guard companies will say "no unauthorized weapons" while on duty, if your company has the BSIS required coverage SUPPOSEDLY if you have a gun card you can LEGALLY be 'strapped' (as we say in the ghetto) against company policy/orders and without permission.
            Of course you would be legally allowed to carry any weapons you have a license for. But that doesn't mean you won't get fired for it. If you are told not to bring pepper spray but do because you 'legally' are licensed to do so, you will get fired. Plain and simple.

            Comment


            • #7
              I'm in CA you stupid tool. You can't carry anything unless the company is authorized to provide that level and you are licensed.
              Carry a firearm out of contract and it's the same change as anyone else: possession of a loaded weapon.

              Are you even an adult? You must be some 12 year old basement dweller...
              Last edited by Soper; 02-02-2014, 07:52 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                I don't think "out of contract" has any bearing on anything. Some posts got both armed and unarmed, and some of the unarmed got permits and SOMETIMES work the armed part of the post, etc, and IIRC "the contract" calls for armed when certain deliveries are made but it seemed only kinda sorta followed.

                No one is gonna get charged by cops for something "out of contract" and BSIS gets no, nor wants, any details of who is actually 'strapped' on any given day or post if the company in general is authorized to do armed and guards have permits, etc.

                As far as LE is concerned it would be an "internal company matter" and none of their biz same as "uniform policy violation" if some guard "mistakenly" is armed at work if he has permits and company is OK to do armed.

                Can you show me different? Anything on BSIS site etc that even hints at any particular official "company authorized" thingy anyone needs to do to control who is gonna be armed at a particular site?

                I've worked at large guard company and it was $2 extra for 'armed' but you didn't 'put in' for it till AFTER the shift, so the company had no info on who was armed out on the site.

                As far as I know with the required insurance for armed in CA they want to know how many (more or less) but insurance doesn't monitor anything closely and a company can (and do) sometimes decide to make a post 'armed' on the fly, and there are no laws as to what level of 'management' is able to do that, down to individual guards.


                I'd have thought maybe a certain ins. policy would come with a finite number of 'active lic.' on top of the guard's individual permit that needed to be doled out by the PPO for him to be legal w/gun, but no such mechanism exists.


                PS-and in CA an armed guard in uniform is allowed to carry his loaded holstered gun 'directly to and from work' including on public transit.....but he is NOT allowed to take it out and put it in a case or something if requested by transit employee OR EVEN POLICE. At gun class we were told to inform any cops of this and if THEY want to take our gun that is A-OK.
                Last edited by Squid; 02-02-2014, 09:03 PM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Soper View Post
                  I'm in CA you stupid tool. You can't carry anything unless the company is authorized to provide that level and you are licensed.
                  Carry a firearm out of contract and it's the same change as anyone else: possession of a loaded weapon.

                  Are you even an adult? You must be some 12 year old basement dweller...
                  If I was going to question anyone's age on this thread it would most certainly be you, with your penchant for name calling here.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Still butting heads with your supervisor over segway helmet policies?
                    Sergeant Phil Esterhaus: "Hey, let's be careful out there.."

                    THE VIEWS EXPRESSED ON THIS WEBSITE/BLOG ARE MINE ALONE AND DO NOT NECESSARILY REFLECT THE VIEWS OF MY EMPLOYER.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Squid View Post
                      I don't think "out of contract" has any bearing on anything. Some posts got both armed and unarmed, and some of the unarmed got permits and SOMETIMES work the armed part of the post, etc, and IIRC "the contract" calls for armed when certain deliveries are made but it seemed only kinda sorta followed.

                      No one is gonna get charged by cops for something "out of contract" and BSIS gets no, nor wants, any details of who is actually 'strapped' on any given day or post if the company in general is authorized to do armed and guards have permits, etc.

                      As far as LE is concerned it would be an "internal company matter" and none of their biz same as "uniform policy violation" if some guard "mistakenly" is armed at work if he has permits and company is OK to do armed.

                      Can you show me different? Anything on BSIS site etc that even hints at any particular official "company authorized" thingy anyone needs to do to control who is gonna be armed at a particular site?

                      I've worked at large guard company and it was $2 extra for 'armed' but you didn't 'put in' for it till AFTER the shift, so the company had no info on who was armed out on the site.

                      As far as I know with the required insurance for armed in CA they want to know how many (more or less) but insurance doesn't monitor anything closely and a company can (and do) sometimes decide to make a post 'armed' on the fly, and there are no laws as to what level of 'management' is able to do that, down to individual guards.


                      I'd have thought maybe a certain ins. policy would come with a finite number of 'active lic.' on top of the guard's individual permit that needed to be doled out by the PPO for him to be legal w/gun, but no such mechanism exists.


                      PS-and in CA an armed guard in uniform is allowed to carry his loaded holstered gun 'directly to and from work' including on public transit.....but he is NOT allowed to take it out and put it in a case or something if requested by transit employee OR EVEN POLICE. At gun class we were told to inform any cops of this and if THEY want to take our gun that is A-OK.
                      I don't think anyone said that you would be criminally charged if you were outside the contract limitations or company policies but had the proper licenses. Soper and I just said that you would probably be fired.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Failure to comply with the laws of the State of CA, instructions of a Peace Officer, and violation of BSIS are going to get you nailed to a wall. Your "instructors" are incorrect or you must have engaged in selective hearing...again.
                        It's obvious that YOU have determined that only YOU are correct, no one else.

                        Go ahead. Be a test case.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          WD,

                          Go back you your Paul Blart movie. The grown ups are busy...

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I check this forum often with the hope that it becomes more active; then I read strings like this one and understand the hesitation to use this tool for meaningful conversations.

                            For those sane people still reading this post:
                            CA requires armed guards to have a firearms license and only carry when authorized by the employer (the PPO).
                            If the PPO authorizes any armed work, he/she must meet aditional insurance requirements.
                            Guard card owners can work "for hire" but must only work unarmed and also cannot carry a baton.
                            Armed work can only be done under a PPO contract and with the proper permits.
                            Any guard (even with a firearms permit) working with a firearm without being "under" a proper PPO, is violating CA criminal law and is subject to arrest.
                            http://guardtourreport.com

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by SoCalGuard View Post
                              I check this forum often with the hope that it becomes more active; then I read strings like this one and understand the hesitation to use this tool for meaningful conversations.
                              I know, right. What with throwing out comments like 'Paul Blart' and '12 year old' I too understand your hesitation.

                              Comment

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