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Abortion Clinic Security Guard found guilty

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  • Abortion Clinic Security Guard found guilty

    http://www.lifesitenews.com/blog/bre...o-lifers-video

    I'm guessing he will be cleared upon appeal.

  • #2
    Why would he be cleared on appeal?
    There was no justification for use of pepper spray.

    Comment


    • #3
      Abortion Clinic Security Guard Found Guilty

      From a dictionary:

      "The trial court record usually contains the pleadings that first initiated the case, a complete transcript of the court proceedings, materials admitted into evidence, and documents indicating the final judgment.An appellate court differs from a trial court in another important respect: only the trial court determines the factual issues in a case. In its review, the appellate court does not try factual issues. Instead, it determines only whether there is sufficient evidence to support the findings of the trial court and whether the trial court correctly applied the law."

      Is there some allegation that the local court erred? I think some people have the idea that an appeal is just another shot at re-trying the case. It isn't. It is basically to see if the court with original jurisdiction acted properly.

      Comment


      • #4
        Nothing like an unbiased article written by a blogger with a cause.
        Retail Security Consultant / Expert Witness
        CoAuthor - Effective Security Management 6th Edition

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        • #5
          I thank each, and every day for our closed down industrial complex
          Nothing but coyotes, deer, and snakes, and toss in a
          some thunderstorms, and lightning strikes at the electrical
          junction box at the gatehouse
          http://www.laurel-and-hardy.com/ Greatest Comedy team ever!

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          • #6
            video appears to be oddly vertically 'cropped' so that is just happens to crop out the actions of the person being sprayed.

            I don't know how to make a camcorder do that, or even how to crop out the sides like that, but although I've owned at least 2 cams, not counting cellphones, not my area of expertise.

            From the obviously doctored vid, taken by one 'side' of this, it looks like a 'bad spray', but I'm also guessing this guard had been acting properly for days or weeks and they did something to 'threaten' him into spraying them.

            It ain't like this is some 'sudden' happening at an otherwise sleepy post. I'm sure this guard was drilled at to exactly what he could spray, etc for and what he couldn't.

            This looks like a classic case of why client(underwriter) would rather a guard not take action 9 out of 10 times. Now the protestors have a 'good case' to sue the client who hired the guard, which will cost the client money regardless which is a 'win' for the protestors.


            But unless he was getting paid a LOT more than standard guard low pay, this is one any guard should "walk away" from, personal risk wise. It ain't like these crappy companies got some even 1/2 decent insurance for a guard that 'gets in trouble in line of duty'.

            Guards aren't cops and should have their own personal interests always first like any private citizen. That means "walking away" first, and calling dispatch after you are safe.

            Typically, a company will have you sign a paper saying one thing(to not take action) then have supervisors tell you they expect different. Had it happen at least 3 times and ask for supervisor to put it in writing or email and they always back right down and 'put on airs'.
            Last edited by Squid; 11-24-2013, 03:03 PM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Jim1348 View Post
              From a dictionary:

              "The trial court record usually contains the pleadings that first initiated the case, a complete transcript of the court proceedings, materials admitted into evidence, and documents indicating the final judgment.An appellate court differs from a trial court in another important respect: only the trial court determines the factual issues in a case. In its review, the appellate court does not try factual issues. Instead, it determines only whether there is sufficient evidence to support the findings of the trial court and whether the trial court correctly applied the law."

              Is there some allegation that the local court erred? I think some people have the idea that an appeal is just another shot at re-trying the case. It isn't. It is basically to see if the court with original jurisdiction acted properly.
              Oh no I know that. But this case isn't about the facts. It's about the justification. If the lower court erred in believing something was unlawful, then the appeals should be successful.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Squid View Post
                video appears to be oddly vertically 'cropped' so that is just happens to crop out the actions of the person being sprayed.

                I don't know how to make a camcorder do that, or even how to crop out the sides like that, but although I've owned at least 2 cams, not counting cellphones, not my area of expertise.

                From the obviously doctored vid, taken by one 'side' of this, it looks like a 'bad spray', but I'm also guessing this guard had been acting properly for days or weeks and they did something to 'threaten' him into spraying them.

                It ain't like this is some 'sudden' happening at an otherwise sleepy post. I'm sure this guard was drilled at to exactly what he could spray, etc for and what he couldn't.

                This looks like a classic case of why client(underwriter) would rather a guard not take action 9 out of 10 times. Now the protestors have a 'good case' to sue the client who hired the guard, which will cost the client money regardless which is a 'win' for the protestors.


                But unless he was getting paid a LOT more than standard guard low pay, this is one any guard should "walk away" from, personal risk wise. It ain't like these crappy companies got some even 1/2 decent insurance for a guard that 'gets in trouble in line of duty'.

                Guards aren't cops and should have their own personal interests always first like any private citizen. That means "walking away" first, and calling dispatch after you are safe.

                Typically, a company will have you sign a paper saying one thing(to not take action) then have supervisors tell you they expect different. Had it happen at least 3 times and ask for supervisor to put it in writing or email and they always back right down and 'put on airs'.
                It was most likely filmed on a cell phone. There's a mode called portrait mode that does that.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Jim1348 View Post
                  From a dictionary:

                  "The trial court record usually contains the pleadings that first initiated the case, a complete transcript of the court proceedings, materials admitted into evidence, and documents indicating the final judgment.An appellate court differs from a trial court in another important respect: only the trial court determines the factual issues in a case. In its review, the appellate court does not try factual issues. Instead, it determines only whether there is sufficient evidence to support the findings of the trial court and whether the trial court correctly applied the law."

                  Is there some allegation that the local court erred? I think some people have the idea that an appeal is just another shot at re-trying the case. It isn't. It is basically to see if the court with original jurisdiction acted properly.
                  Actually, the defense is appealing the decision.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Squid View Post
                    video appears to be oddly vertically 'cropped' so that is just happens to crop out the actions of the person being sprayed.

                    I don't know how to make a camcorder do that, or even how to crop out the sides like that, but although I've owned at least 2 cams, not counting cellphones, not my area of expertise.

                    From the obviously doctored vid, taken by one 'side' of this, it looks like a 'bad spray', but I'm also guessing this guard had been acting properly for days or weeks and they did something to 'threaten' him into spraying them.

                    It ain't like this is some 'sudden' happening at an otherwise sleepy post. I'm sure this guard was drilled at to exactly what he could spray, etc for and what he couldn't.

                    This looks like a classic case of why client(underwriter) would rather a guard not take action 9 out of 10 times. Now the protestors have a 'good case' to sue the client who hired the guard, which will cost the client money regardless which is a 'win' for the protestors.


                    But unless he was getting paid a LOT more than standard guard low pay, this is one any guard should "walk away" from, personal risk wise. It ain't like these crappy companies got some even 1/2 decent insurance for a guard that 'gets in trouble in line of duty'.

                    Guards aren't cops and should have their own personal interests always first like any private citizen. That means "walking away" first, and calling dispatch after you are safe.

                    Typically, a company will have you sign a paper saying one thing(to not take action) then have supervisors tell you they expect different. Had it happen at least 3 times and ask for supervisor to put it in writing or email and they always back right down and 'put on airs'.
                    Well, it appeared as if the protesters were indeed indeed interfering with the abortion clinic property. So the security guard had every right to use force to remove them.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Not pepper spray. Guess you aren't familiar with the rulings that spray is for defense, not offense.

                      Defense always appeals a guilty verdict. Nothing new there.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Soper View Post
                        Not pepper spray. Guess you aren't familiar with the rulings that spray is for defense, not offense.

                        Defense always appeals a guilty verdict. Nothing new there.
                        Well in our state security guards may use force in the protection of property to prevent or terminate another’s trespass or other unlawful interference with the possession of real or personal property. That would apply in this situation.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          STILL doesn't justify it. No one is in physical danger.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Soper View Post
                            STILL doesn't justify it. No one is in physical danger.
                            1000% correct, brother. He became frustrated and used the OC as a way of venting that frustration. He'll lose the appeal.
                            "Lo Que Sea, Cuando Sea, Donde Sea"

                            "Veni, Vidi, Vici!"

                            "Whatcha gonna do now, PL?"

                            "Strategy is the craft of the warrior. Commanders must enact the craft, and troopers should know this Way. There is no warrior in the world today who really understands the Way of strategy." Shinmen Musashi No Kami Fujiwara No Genshin

                            http://sentinelsofflorida.com/ is where I go for all of my Florida security info.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I look at this if it was me -before- this got out of hand. You know' what if's, yada.

                              I am there to keep the honest people honest and that's about it. They decide that honesty is no longer valid then so be it I am making a safe retreat and making that phone call.

                              Unless someone lays a hand on me and I believe they are going to hurt me its best to retreat and call in the authorities. Property is not living, that is what insurance is for.

                              Just my views... nuff'said.
                              My views, opinions and statements are my own. They are not of my company, affiliates or coworkers.

                              -Being bagger at Publix has more respect these days

                              -It's just a job kid deal with it

                              -The industry needs to do one of two things; stop fiddling with the thin line and go forward or go back to that way it was. A flashlight in one hand and your set of keys in the other

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