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  • #16
    Originally posted by Black Caesar
    Legal in Texas as long as one party to the conversation knows it's being recorded.
    Ditto for Louisiana. That said, you may have problems carrying one if your company thinks it will cause problems. For Example, I had a problem with an employee of the plant where we are contracted. THis employee was confrontational with the contract security and often filled complaints to her union rep against security officers. I started carrying a tape recorder and recording every encounter I had with employee. I filled my own reports and included the audio as a wav file with the emails I sent to my supervisor. When the Union rep, the plant officers and our Security supervisor and company rep sat down to investigate the problems this employee was reporting my reports and the audio attached were presented. Needless to say, the union rep was NOT happy that his client had been caught on tape instigating disturbances with the contract security officers and belittling them with comments like, "You can't tell me anything. You don't even work for the company. You are just a bunch of contractors." While our security company was proven to be not at fault and I kept my job, which was in jepordy, the union rep made it clear that the plant employees felt that being recorded by security officers was creating a hostile workplace. I was told not to carry a recorder on the job in the future. While the security company admits it was the recordings that saved my job they do not wish to upset the client and the employees anymore than necessary. So now we are back to fileling competeing reports and He Said/She Said arguments. When it comes down to it the security company WILL sacrifice a security officer to appease the client even when that officer is not in the wrong.
    Hospital Security Officer

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    • #17
      Originally posted by EMTGuard
      Ditto for Louisiana. That said, you may have problems carrying one if your company thinks it will cause problems. For Example, I had a problem with an employee of the plant where we are contracted. THis employee was confrontational with the contract security and often filled complaints to her union rep against security officers. I started carrying a tape recorder and recording every encounter I had with employee. I filled my own reports and included the audio as a wav file with the emails I sent to my supervisor. When the Union rep, the plant officers and our Security supervisor and company rep sat down to investigate the problems this employee was reporting my reports and the audio attached were presented. Needless to say, the union rep was NOT happy that his client had been caught on tape instigating disturbances with the contract security officers and belittling them with comments like, "You can't tell me anything. You don't even work for the company. You are just a bunch of contractors." While our security company was proven to be not at fault and I kept my job, which was in jepordy, the union rep made it clear that the plant employees felt that being recorded by security officers was creating a hostile workplace. I was told not to carry a recorder on the job in the future. While the security company admits it was the recordings that saved my job they do not wish to upset the client and the employees anymore than necessary. So now we are back to fileling competeing reports and He Said/She Said arguments. When it comes down to it the security company WILL sacrifice a security officer to appease the client even when that officer is not in the wrong.
      Hey, you have my congrats on doing a job well done, not only in protecting your agency, but yourself. That was some sharp thinking on your part! I commend you for thinking ahead and "staying alive"! I do however dislike the mentality of your company in the loosing good officers to aplease the client. In my opinion, Security Officers are not elected into position so that the popularity of others can effect their residence with the company, this creates a nasty cycle of the job not getting done. Not saying Security is out to make enemies or friends, but to do a job most couldnt, which is safety and enforcing rules! Again, smart thinking on your part!
      Deputy Sheriff

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      • #18
        Originally posted by mh892
        Florida says its a no-no. Unless all parties "know" they are being recorded and consent.
        If you are on property you control, or in a public place, they give consent by virtue of entering the property or choosing the remain on it. My agency had this issue, we sought legal guidance from the Chief of Tampa, Florida Police, the State Attorney for Hillsbrough & Pasco/Pinellas Circuits, and corporate counsel. The landlord for a project wanted us to carry a video camera. THe residents started screaming, "I don't consent to your taping me!" And to which, we always replied, "You're standing on private property in an open area, your presence on my property is your consent."

        The Tampa Police Department was extremely leery of those video cameras we had, till they noticed that we controlled when they came on and turned off. Then they were no longer afraid that we were going to accidently on purpose tape them doing something to be used against them.

        We considered the video tape evidence, and maintained chain of custody requirements for it. It was primarily used for the client to evict people. Tampa Police's drug unit also requested copies. They were given just that, copies, the original tapes and recorders were locked in little fire safes every time we were not actively using them.
        Some Kind of Commando Leader

        "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Mall Director
          .....I need to find out Colorado's laws concerning this. For one reason primarily, and that is to assist my officers in training and to hear for myself the conversation between a violator and my officer, then I can approach a subject a re-state his exact words to him, when the violator attempts to denie what he said. Word power basically. When a subject is aware they have been recorded or their exact words are recited back to them from a previous conversation, it tends to limit the subject in contesting an issue.

          I am not sure I would ever need it for a court proceeding, so that may help since I have no intentions in running some one through the embarrasment of lying as the courts tend to take our side pre-trial. I will peak around!
          Mall Director, Colorado is a "one party" recording state, meaning that as long as one party to the conversation (you say) is aware that the conversation is being recorded it is legal. This mirrors federal law.

          So if you have a recorder out of site in your pocket, with a lapel mike (which may also be concealed) you're legal. This also applies to telephone conversations.

          Added during edit: However, keep your officers aware that this is a two way street!
          Last edited by aka Bull; 07-10-2006, 12:04 PM.
          "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." -Aristotle

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          • #20
            Cha-Ching.. More money spent.. LOL~

            And so on I went, and spent more money! We went and got those new "digital audio recorders", found the recorder carrying cases at Galls, and some mic's. My poor people are hard wired like crazy. They have their ear peices, mics, and other cables running all through their uniforms. I have to give them a little extra time coming onto shift to get ready, but its all worth it.

            I was surprised at how every one of them jumped as the first few sets of recorders were purchased. It was like candy to a sugar fiend. Time will only tell now.. We havent had an issue of "he said- she said" yet, now that we record, but I am waiting patiently. I wished we picked this stuff up several weeks ago, as we had issues of people "not being forth right" with what they said to the officers, but oh well, cant win them all as much as we try. We are one step ahead though.

            My assistant is working on linking up a reciever to the monitors, so we can put pinhole cams on the officers as well. The prices for these cams have come down big time since I first looked into it, but thats another subject. As for the recorders, they download directly into the computer network, and we can burn CD's of the conversations. We are already archieving them as we go. I can say that it honestly has made a major improvement on the officer moral, as well as the actions to follow. Officers are now feeling much better engaging people that violate rules, and performing very professionally.

            I cant suggest this enough!
            Deputy Sheriff

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Mall Director
              And so on I went, and spent more money! We went and got those new "digital audio recorders", found the recorder carrying cases at Galls, and some mic's. My poor people are hard wired like crazy. They have their ear peices, mics, and other cables running all through their uniforms. I have to give them a little extra time coming onto shift to get ready, but its all worth it.

              I was surprised at how every one of them jumped as the first few sets of recorders were purchased. It was like candy to a sugar fiend. Time will only tell now.. We havent had an issue of "he said- she said" yet, now that we record, but I am waiting patiently. I wished we picked this stuff up several weeks ago, as we had issues of people "not being forth right" with what they said to the officers, but oh well, cant win them all as much as we try. We are one step ahead though.

              My assistant is working on linking up a reciever to the monitors, so we can put pinhole cams on the officers as well. The prices for these cams have come down big time since I first looked into it, but thats another subject. As for the recorders, they download directly into the computer network, and we can burn CD's of the conversations. We are already archieving them as we go. I can say that it honestly has made a major improvement on the officer moral, as well as the actions to follow. Officers are now feeling much better engaging people that violate rules, and performing very professionally.

              I cant suggest this enough!
              While I am happy this is working out for you, I also want to put out a caution to those officers working in medical facilities. Even if you are working in a one-party recording state you must take care of any audio recordings you may make. Since we must comply with HIPAA law we must be careful that no protected information ends up in that recording, either directly or indirectly. Protected information will invalidate the use of the recording since that information can not be released to anyone unless under the exceptions authorized under HIPAA. Those of us working in medical facilities (especially ER's) know how loud it gets and what could easily be picked up on a recording that has nothing to do with the individual we are recording.

              That is why concealed recorders are prohibited for use within our facilities.
              "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." -Aristotle

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              • #22
                I beleive it is legal you just can't do it somewhere where they expect to have privacy like their own home but out in the street or anywhere else other than their personal property they have to assume they are being recorded. If I remember correctly only people like a police officer and a detective have to ask permission or let you know they are recording

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by VargaM
                  I beleive it is legal you just can't do it somewhere where they expect to have privacy like their own home but out in the street or anywhere else other than their personal property they have to assume they are being recorded. If I remember correctly only people like a police officer and a detective have to ask permission or let you know they are recording
                  They don't either. That's hollywood.
                  Some Kind of Commando Leader

                  "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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                  • #24
                    well I was misinformed by my instructor during my security course, unless it is by state

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
                      They don't either. That's hollywood.
                      Well out here, law officers don't have to ask you, but I think they do have to tell you. When I was an Explorer for a Police department and an officer went on a traffic stop with a video/audio recorder, they always started out their stop by telling the person they were being recorded. I think it is because there is an expectation of privacy in your own car.
                      "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
                      "The Curve" 1998

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by BHR Lawson
                        Well out here, law officers don't have to ask you, but I think they do have to tell you. When I was an Explorer for a Police department and an officer went on a traffic stop with a video/audio recorder, they always started out their stop by telling the person they were being recorded. I think it is because there is an expectation of privacy in your own car.
                        That and I think its more of a deterance, when someone knows they are being recorded they can't turn around and accuse you of cussing at them or they won't make stupid comments.

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                        • #27
                          Mall Director,

                          I too am looking at purchasing a voice recorder, and quite possibly a button camera/mini-DVR setup. To start though, i'm going to simply try out the voice recorder in the meantime. I want something digital that I can easily backup onto the computer via USB. Is this the kind of setup you went with? If so, what brand did you find to fit your needs?

                          Thanks in advance!
                          "To win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the highest skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the highest skill." Sun-Tzu

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by GCMC Security
                            That and I think its more of a deterance, when someone knows they are being recorded they can't turn around and accuse you of cussing at them or they won't make stupid comments.
                            When I discussed this with the officer, he said he had to tell them, but I dont know if it just a department policy or a law.
                            "Alright guys listen up, ya'll have probably heard this before, Jackson vs. Securiplex corporation; I am a private security officer, I have no State or governmental authority. I stand as an ordinary citizen. I have no right to; detain, interrogate or otherwise interfere with your personal property-... basically all that means is I'm a cop."-Officer Ernie
                            "The Curve" 1998

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              http://www.rcfp.org/taping/

                              interesting thing I found while being bored! Apparently not an issue for me in florida

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by GCMC Security
                                http://www.rcfp.org/taping/

                                interesting thing I found while being bored! Apparently not an issue for me in florida
                                Good find!
                                "To win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the highest skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the highest skill." Sun-Tzu

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