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  • Jackhole
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
    In the State of New York. Some states specifically state what a Deputy Sheriff is, and limit the Sheriff in what powers he may give his deputies. In Florida, a Deputy Sheriff retains all the powers of the Sheriff. They act in his steed. It is also illegal to call a non-LEO deputy a "deputy sheriff," as they are not sworn law enforcement officers and statute specifically states that a sheriff's deputy is a LEO.
    I'm so glad I live in New York sometimes.

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  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Originally posted by Jackhole
    The Jail deputies ARE deputies here, but they're not police officers. A jail deputy could never work on the road and a road deputy could never work in the jail. Just because your title is "Deputy" doesn't mean you're a police officer with full arrest powers. Even the person who sits behind a desk in the office and processes pistol permit applications is a deputy. The term "deputy" just means you've been charged with some responsibility by the Sheriff, it doesn't imply any law enforcement capability.
    In the State of New York. Some states specifically state what a Deputy Sheriff is, and limit the Sheriff in what powers he may give his deputies. In Florida, a Deputy Sheriff retains all the powers of the Sheriff. They act in his steed. It is also illegal to call a non-LEO deputy a "deputy sheriff," as they are not sworn law enforcement officers and statute specifically states that a sheriff's deputy is a LEO.

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    California uses both systems. The state prisons are run by either the California Department of Corrections (CDC) who handle adult offenders or the California Youth Authority (CYA) who handle juvenile offenders. The Correctional Officers of both entities are sworn peace officers who have their status 24/7. CDC officers are permitted to carry a loaded and concealed firearm off duty. The last I heard CYA officers are forbidden by their department policy from carrying off duty, but this might have changed.

    County jails are run by the county sheriffs. About half the counties in the state have Correctional Deputies who are sworn peace officers. However, Correctional Deputies do not attend a full Basic Police Academy and cannot work patrol. I do not know which sheriffs have granted their Correctional Deputies the right to carry off duty. The other half use Deputy Sheriffs to staff their jails, and those deputies have graduated from a full Basic academy and are waiting for a patrol position to open up.

    City jails, which are usually just temporary holding facilities until the arrestee is transported to the county jail, are run by city police departments. Most cities use non-sworn "jailers" to run their facility. Only one city I know of, Anaheim in Orange County, employs sworn "Correctional Officers" to administer their jail. Those Correctional Officers get the same training as Correctional Deputies. A few cities use Wackenhut to run their jails. Azusa in Los Angeles County and Seal Beach in Orange County are the only two I can think of, but I know there are a few more.

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  • Jackhole
    replied
    Originally posted by Bridgegate
    It's essentially the same in Oregon as well.. Correction Officers are Deputies and carry all the same rights/priviledges as the Patrol guys... Only difference is they don't carry a sidearm inside the facility.
    The Jail deputies ARE deputies here, but they're not police officers. A jail deputy could never work on the road and a road deputy could never work in the jail. Just because your title is "Deputy" doesn't mean you're a police officer with full arrest powers. Even the person who sits behind a desk in the office and processes pistol permit applications is a deputy. The term "deputy" just means you've been charged with some responsibility by the Sheriff, it doesn't imply any law enforcement capability.
    Last edited by Jackhole; 06-24-2006, 12:39 PM.

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  • GCMC Security
    replied
    Originally posted by Bridgegate

    I can't remember which state it is, but I heard a while back that a midwestern state had actually hired Wackenhut to provide it's Correction Officers and Court Officers..
    Wackenhut Services, Inc and Corrections Corporation of America are the 2 largest providers of private corrections.

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Originally posted by Bridgegate
    It's essentially the same in Oregon as well.. Correction Officers are Deputies and carry all the same rights/priviledges as the Patrol guys... Only difference is they don't carry a sidearm inside the facility. (They're checked into lockers near the control centers)
    I'm still learning the specifics of the system here in Washington, but from what I understand so far it's pretty much the same, except that there's a state Department of Corrections that oversees the whole system, down to the city/county jails.

    I can't remember which state it is, but I heard a while back that a midwestern state had actually hired Wackenhut to provide it's Correction Officers and Court Officers..
    Several states use private corrections. Florida uses Wackenhut. Correctional Associates of America (?) controls a lot of Wisconsin jails. Their prisoner transport buses (huge things) roll through my town all the time.

    Keep in mind. Under WI law, these jailers on these buses are unarmed. They're not LEOs, they don't get to carry guns.

    Leave a comment:


  • Charger
    replied
    Originally posted by Jackhole
    I never realized how out of whack some states are. Here, there are 4 types of Sheriff's Deputies: Road Deputies (full police powers), Jail Deputies (peace officer), Civil Deputies (peace officer) and Court Deputies (armed peace officers). All of these people are Deputy Sheriffs, but only the road Deputies are police officers.
    It's essentially the same in Oregon as well.. Correction Officers are Deputies and carry all the same rights/priviledges as the Patrol guys... Only difference is they don't carry a sidearm inside the facility. (They're checked into lockers near the control centers)
    I'm still learning the specifics of the system here in Washington, but from what I understand so far it's pretty much the same, except that there's a state Department of Corrections that oversees the whole system, down to the city/county jails.

    I can't remember which state it is, but I heard a while back that a midwestern state had actually hired Wackenhut to provide it's Correction Officers and Court Officers..

    Leave a comment:


  • Jackhole
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
    The County itself may run a "House of Corrections." Jailers aren't considered LEOs here. They don't need to be. The Sheriff can hire civilians who work the jails. They are not armed. They have no powers of arrest other than citizen. They basically babysit the prisoners. They are civilian employees of the County Sheriff, at that time. They only need a 2 week jailer course, then.

    If a prisoner is to be transported, a deputy sheriff in the detention center is called to transport. Court appearances? Deputy Sheriff takes them.

    Some Sheriffs elect to use sworn deputy sheriffs to fufill the needs of a civilian jailer. They must be fully WI POST certified. They may use weapons, etc.

    Just this year was the state prison guard (Now called a correctional officer) given "protective services" classification for the state law enforcement pension system. Before this, they were considered non-LEOs by the state retirement fund, and were not eligible.

    Also, something to consider. In Florida, a full Sheriff's Deputy is a correctional officer. He is a full deputy, and can do road work. He just works in the jail.
    I never realized how out of whack some states are. Here, there are 4 types of Sheriff's Deputies: Road Deputies (full police powers), Jail Deputies (peace officer), Civil Deputies (peace officer) and Court Deputies (armed peace officers). All of these people are Deputy Sheriffs, but only the road Deputies are police officers.

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Originally posted by Jackhole
    I guess I don't follow. County jails aren't run by the Sheriff? Who's working in these jails if they're not Jail Deputies?

    In NY, each county's jail is run by the Sheriff and the personnel working inside are sworn jail deputies (peace officers). State correctional facilities are run by the NYS Department of Correctional Services and the personnel working inside are Correctional Officers (also peace officers). A police officer would never work in a jail or correctional facility.

    There is no one in the state charged with the supervision of county or state inmates that's not a sworn peace officer.
    The County itself may run a "House of Corrections." Jailers aren't considered LEOs here. They don't need to be. The Sheriff can hire civilians who work the jails. They are not armed. They have no powers of arrest other than citizen. They basically babysit the prisoners. They are civilian employees of the County Sheriff, at that time. They only need a 2 week jailer course, then.

    If a prisoner is to be transported, a deputy sheriff in the detention center is called to transport. Court appearances? Deputy Sheriff takes them.

    Some Sheriffs elect to use sworn deputy sheriffs to fufill the needs of a civilian jailer. They must be fully WI POST certified. They may use weapons, etc.

    Just this year was the state prison guard (Now called a correctional officer) given "protective services" classification for the state law enforcement pension system. Before this, they were considered non-LEOs by the state retirement fund, and were not eligible.

    Also, something to consider. In Florida, a full Sheriff's Deputy is a correctional officer. He is a full deputy, and can do road work. He just works in the jail.

    Leave a comment:


  • Jackhole
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
    Um... In Wisconsin, you are a non-sworn jailer unless the county sheriff decides to take the House of Corrections under his agency and swear you as a correctional deputy.

    They will not do that, because it means less jobs and less overtime potential for the deputies, and the union has a fit if the Sheriff tries to create less overtime potential for deputies.
    I guess I don't follow. County jails aren't run by the Sheriff? Who's working in these jails if they're not Jail Deputies?

    In NY, each county's jail is run by the Sheriff and the personnel working inside are sworn jail deputies (peace officers). State correctional facilities are run by the NYS Department of Correctional Services and the personnel working inside are Correctional Officers (also peace officers). A police officer would never work in a jail or correctional facility.

    There is no one in the state charged with the supervision of county or state inmates that's not a sworn peace officer.

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Originally posted by Jackhole
    Just because you're a jailor and not a cop, doesn't mean you're not sworn. They're peace officers here in NY.
    Um... In Wisconsin, you are a non-sworn jailer unless the county sheriff decides to take the House of Corrections under his agency and swear you as a correctional deputy.

    They will not do that, because it means less jobs and less overtime potential for the deputies, and the union has a fit if the Sheriff tries to create less overtime potential for deputies.

    Leave a comment:


  • Jackhole
    replied
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier
    I'd love to know who the original story was, and if they have an agenda. The Faternal Order of Police at national and state levels vehemently opposes the privization of corrections. (Note, of course, that they only represent sworn correctional officers. Non-sworn jailers like we have up here are on their own. They can be privitized and the FOP don't care, they're not cops.)
    Just because you're a jailor and not a cop, doesn't mean you're not sworn. They're peace officers here in NY.

    Leave a comment:


  • aka Bull
    replied
    Correctional work is nothing more than police work. A micro-society exists in confinement facilities requiring "cops" to police the "streets". The only difference correctional staff have from street policing is the knowledge that any "citizen" we contact is a bad guy. Officers must use the same skills as any patrol officer to maintain his safety and carry out his duties.

    A correctional officer knows, or should know, that the authority and control we exercise inside a facility is only with the willingness of the population we police. While inmates hate officers, they also know they need staff to be the balance between some semblemce of order and utter chaos.

    Also, while officers gain experience in their profession, inmates become experienced in their "profession" as well. The hope and goal is for the "cops" to always be smarter than the crooks.

    It just bothers me when I hear the kind of general statements stereotyping corrections, or for that matter cops, security, or any other professional group doing work for the safety and good of the people.

    I'll get off my soap box now. My apologies for the tirade.

    Leave a comment:


  • N. A. Corbier
    replied
    Jail is a processing facility. For those who want to: They learn a trade or skill to tide them over in the "real world." While their doing that, they also bulk up, make bones with an affiliation, learn the skills to make themselves better in their choice of criminal enterprise, pass intelligence data to their superiors, recieve instructions form their superiors near their release date, learn the legal system better so that they may better defend themselves and others using it (jailhouse lawyer)...

    Its a processing center.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bill Warnock
    replied
    Originally posted by aka Bull
    I worked in corrections as an officer at both state and county levels in my past and I have had the comment made to me that we looked like "goons". It is an old stereotype that corrections officers have a smaller IQ that their hat size.

    It is unfortunate that such stereotypes continue the deviseness that occurs between professions. Judge the person not the profession.
    aka Bull:
    Anyone who has had a talk with folks that guard, house or move prisoners can say with a degree of certainty that this not for the dim witted or to whom thoughts come slowly. Prisoners are crafty and savvy. They are always looking for a weakness in the system. System includes correction officers.
    In regards to Kingman's posting, I've gone to FLETC on several occasions to instruct Court Security Officers, Deputy US Marshals and foreign nationals on the use and limitations of security screening equipment. During one visit, while in the mess hall, I asked one of the USMS instructors who were those group of men sitting around by themselves and apparently guarded by others, all of whom looked like they were unkept street people. These are BOP officers in training. It was explained this was an experiment to see if they took away the "Military Look" from officers it they could then better manage inmates. Tomorrow, those guarding, would be seated at the table eating. It was an ongoing effort by the federal government to get an edge on a very dangerous occupation. All federal, state, county and city corrections officials make it their business to keep fit, working out at the gym to stay in tiptop shape. In many instances, the inmates do nothing but workout and add bulk to defend themselves against other inmates and seek an advantage in dealing with corrections officers.
    Enjoy the day,
    Bill

    Leave a comment:

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