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  • #46
    Originally posted by Maelstrom
    I would've thought the need to prevent confusion within the population over who was security and who is Police was obvious? isn't that the reason for regulatory bodies... to regulate?
    Well here in the states private companies are taking more responsibility in the area of public safety. Some of the first responders after Hurricane Katrina where Private security companies and their effort to secure their clients properties helped to restore law and order in New Orleans.

    We also have private correctional Institutions and Inmate transport is quickly being privatized. I have done both working for private companies.

    Here in the United States Security Officers are quickly becoming the most likely to be the first on the scene of many different types of incidents and it is becoming more acceptable for Private Security forces to take over rolls that where traditionally handled only by Law Enforcement. For example Neighborhood Associations are now hiring private security companies to secure their neighborhoods and help prevent crime.

    Does all of this make Security Officers Peace Officers?

    No it does not however the idea of the Traditional do nothing Security Officer who will just "Observe and Report" for the police is being replaced by more proactive companies with better trained Officers who will make better attempts at securing the clients property by preventing crime and making an active effort to assist in apprehending criminals.

    To spell it out flatly people are tired of being the victims of crime because the Police are stretched thin and they are willing to pay for a more proactive approach from better trained Security Officers.

    I for one have no problem with Security Officers looking more like they mean business.

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by bigshotceo View Post
      While I think that security guards should look distinct from police and other LEOs, I think that part of the problem is that there is no consensus within the LEO community or even within local police departments concerning their uniforms. Heck, in your United States I've seen frontline police with black shirts, navy blue shirts, "chief wiggum blue" shirts, light blue shirts, grey shirts, white shirts and tan shirts. I've seen just about every colour of pant stripe, badge type, shoulder patch type and hat type available. I think that if the police are so concerned about security looking like them they need to get together and develop a single "police uniform", with similar shirt colours, hat type, pant stripe, shoulder patch, badge type, etc. That way, it would be simple for security companies to avoid the "police uniform" while being able to dress in a way that maintains the shared but distinct uniform styles between private security and law enformement.
      That's something I've noticed about your country... why so many different types of uniform?
      Obviously you need to be able to know who is a State Trooper and who is the County Sheriff but is there really a need for all the different colours.

      Over here it's quite simple, look for the Black and White Square pattern on their Caps or their clothes, on their high visibility coats it's Reflective Blue and Reflective Grey so there really isn't any difference.

      Friend of mine went to the US and he was in a ''mall'' and stopped a security guard thinking he was a Police Officer. It's all in the badges my friends, simply stick a bloody great badge on your back with POLICE or SECURITY on it... the confusion ends there.
      Ewfr 'Gomulee - EuwFer 'Gom-You-Lee
      Court Security Officer - Her Majesty's Courts Service HMCS

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by Maelstrom
        Looking smart in a well turned out uniform, being observant/vigilant, conducting yourself in a professional manner & interacting courteously with the public can achieve the means business 'projection' without having to copy LEO colour schemes

        You say "copy" like LEO's have some patent on specific colors. That is why I like our uniform laws. If you aren't smart enough to see the word 'security' dont not equal 'police' then shame on you. Basically, the uniform coul dbe any color and people will automatically assume LEO long before S/O. We sevre the same basic purpose, so what difference does the uniform make? None.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Maelstrom
          In some places they do

          However in the US where everybody seems to have a different uniform colour scheme, I guess ultimately it's unavoidable you'll end up resembling some Law agency or worse yet... a Deli assistant




          No we don't... we enforce the client's wishes on their behalf working within the parameters set by the law, whereas the Police/LEO's actually enforce the laws of the county, state & nation
          Please stop projecting your country's rules and social views on the United States. In the United States, several states specifically authorize or empower private security personnel to "actually enforce" the laws of the city, county, state, and nation.
          Some Kind of Commando Leader

          "Every time I see another crazy Florida post, I'm glad I don't work there." ~ Minneapolis Security on Florida Security Law

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          • #50
            Here in alaska if I personally witness a misdemeanor or have positive ID on a felony suspect, crime either witnessed myself or known through my chain of command, I can effect an arrest.

            don't know if I piped in earlier... duty belt.. buckle at 12... 1 is my pager pouch 3 is pistol holster with belt keeper fore and aft, glove pouch at about 4, radio pouch clip at 7, 8 is cuffs, 9 is flashlight, and 11.5 is double mag pouch.

            Probably will be adding a multiuse pouch on the left side to the rear of the mag pouch to hold other amenities required on duty but ungainly in cargo/shirt pockets.
            Last edited by Alaska Security; 03-02-2008, 05:14 AM.
            Overmotivated and Underpaid... I'm a Security supervisors wet dream...

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            • #51
              Originally posted by Alaska Security View Post
              Here in alaska if I personally witness a misdemeanor or have positive ID on a felony suspect, crime either witnessed myself or known through my chain of command, I can effect an arrest.

              don't know if I piped in earlier... duty belt.. buckle at 12... 1 is my pager pouch 3 is pistol holster with belt keeper fore and aft, glove pouch at about 4, radio pouch clip at 7, 8 is cuffs, 9 is flashlight, and 11.5 is double mag pouch.

              Probably will be adding a multiuse pouch on the left side to the rear of the mag pouch to hold other amenities required on duty but ungainly in cargo/shirt pockets.
              Wow... I thought you guys working on the pipeline carried some type of intermediate force weapon. (OC, expandable baton, taser). Kinda goofy that they allow the guys from Doyon guarding the military bases those tools and not the TAPS guys.

              Or was I just missing something?

              Justice_Hound
              LP Manager
              We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm.
              -George Orwell

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by N. A. Corbier View Post
                Please stop projecting your country's rules and social views on the United States. In the United States, several states specifically authorize or empower private security personnel to "actually enforce" the laws of the city, county, state, and nation.
                I distinctly remember you personally jumping all over a forum member who was drawing parallels between Security & Police... but hey, it's your sandbox and things will be how you wish them to be.

                Off topic posts deleted...
                "We make a living by what we get, but we make a life by what we give" - Winston Churchill

                Comment


                • #53
                  After looking at how some of you set your belts up, here is what I went with for my gear. Everything except for the CPR Mask/Case I purchased on my own:

                  1:30 - Keeper
                  2:00 - Cell Phone
                  2:30 - Key Ring Holder
                  3:00 - Silent Key Holder
                  4:30 - Radio Hodler
                  5:00 - Keeper
                  7:00 - Keeper
                  7:30 - CPR Mask
                  8:30 - Double Latex Glove Pouch (I use Nitrile Exam Gloves)
                  9:30 - 3 Watt LED Mini-maglite
                  10:00 - Pager/Glove Pouch (I use it for holding specific keys and such)
                  10:30 - Keeper

                  Nylon Duty equipment by LawPro (QMUniforms.com)

                  Somtimes I swap my CPR Mask to 6:00 so it's more comfortable when I sit in my car going to and from work.

                  Edit: I was just told by Bill Warnock that I need to relocate my CPR mask... guess I need to rethink the setup. Problem is the mask i'm supplied with is big and bulky, not really anywhere good to keep it. any suggestions?
                  Attached Files
                  Last edited by Deputy Dawg; 03-03-2008, 01:36 PM.
                  "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Deputy Dawg View Post
                    After looking at how some of you set your belts up, here is what I went with for my gear. Everything except for the CPR Mask/Case I purchased on my own:

                    1:30 - Keeper
                    2:00 - Cell Phone
                    2:30 - Key Ring Holder
                    3:00 - Silent Key Holder
                    4:30 - Radio Hodler
                    5:00 - Keeper
                    7:00 - Keeper
                    7:30 - CPR Mask
                    8:30 - Double Latex Glove Pouch (I use Nitrile Exam Gloves)
                    9:30 - 3 Watt LED Mini-maglite
                    10:00 - Pager/Glove Pouch (I use it for holding specific keys and such)
                    10:30 - Keeper

                    Nylon Duty equipment by LawPro (QMUniforms.com)

                    Somtimes I swap my CPR Mask to 6:00 so it's more comfortable when I sit in my car going to and from work.

                    Edit: I was just told by Bill Warnock that I need to relocate my CPR mask... guess I need to rethink the setup. Problem is the mask i'm supplied with is big and bulky, not really anywhere good to keep it. any suggestions?
                    your not permitted to carry any defensive weapons?
                    "Get yourself a shovel cause your in deep Sh*t"

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by bigdog View Post
                      your not permitted to carry any defensive weapons?
                      no, RH&R does not allow their officers to have ANYTHING defensive. I used to carry mace but was told that I would get in trouble if management found out. So I don't bring it anymore.

                      Thats the one thing I have never liked about where I work. I guess they feel that by us not having weapons or cuffs, it makes us try to communicate more. That or it enables them to avoid liability issues if an officer ever used it.

                      I don't blame them at times though, as from what I have observed, some of the people they hire wouldn't be too good with mace or a tazer anyway. I would like to try and push to get mace allowed though anyway..

                      They seem to feel that if a major issue ever occured that County will be there in a few minutes... Not a good idea in my opinion though.
                      "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        I could understand not having defencive weapons in a non-high-risk area but if I were in the states I'd atleast have a maglite to hit someone with if I had to... hah!. I dunno if it's just me being British and not used to weapons being readily available to Enforcement Officers and Guards.

                        I'll post a picture of my belt soon, I was going to use it for COMET but the management thought it would ''scare the customers, police and other members of the public''.

                        Personally I think they look quite smart!

                        Oh and I had an idea!, British Guards should dress like American Police (or Guards) and American Guards should dress like British Police (Or Guards)... that would stop any confusion for sure
                        Ewfr 'Gomulee - EuwFer 'Gom-You-Lee
                        Court Security Officer - Her Majesty's Courts Service HMCS

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Ewfr 'Gomulee View Post
                          I could understand not having defencive weapons in a non-high-risk area but if I were in the states I'd atleast have a maglite to hit someone with if I had to... hah!. I dunno if it's just me being British and not used to weapons being readily available to Enforcement Officers and Guards.

                          I'll post a picture of my belt soon, I was going to use it for COMET but the management thought it would ''scare the customers, police and other members of the public''.

                          Personally I think they look quite smart!

                          Oh and I had an idea!, British Guards should dress like American Police (or Guards) and American Guards should dress like British Police (Or Guards)... that would stop any confusion for sure
                          The area I work in isn't exactly low risk, but not high risk either, just that decent minor medium. The denny's next door has had stabbings, and my hotel has seen vehicles broken into, strong arms with and without weapons, and we deal with drunks and easily irate people all the time. Not to mention, being in a local/tourist area, during the weekend especially, after 2am, when all the clubs and bars let out, things can get pretty hectic. A few weeks ago we had a bunch of domestics occur resulting in people being hospitalized as well as 4 S/O's breaking up a fight.

                          Luckily my Mini-Mag has a 4-5 inch handle so it's enough to briefly daze someone if I ever had too. Pretty much just gotta hope that if something happens, your fellow officers will back you up.

                          And yes, we should change uniforms, would be kinda funny to see everyones reactions haha. Especially since our hotels get a lot of british guests hehehe
                          Last edited by Deputy Dawg; 03-04-2008, 01:53 PM.
                          "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke

                          Comment


                          • #58




                            My Gear, as you can see... it's hardly worth keeping a belt on me because there's next to nothing to put on it.

                            Anyhow, here's my system:

                            SIA Badge Holder (Far Right)
                            Mobile Phone hooked onto my double pouches, good for putting a little FM transmitter in for patrols. (Next to SIA Badge holder)
                            Gun Holster which is now an improvised Motorola HT600E Holster (Left)
                            And last... the thing that keeps my lunch money safe! my plastic card pouch with a Halo3 Badge and a Union Jack badge on it!.

                            and as you can see, I keeps me boots all shiney
                            I also like to put my Eppulette slide onto my tie, when I am in my shirt I am usually taller than other people so I keep it on my tie so that people can read it.

                            Obviously I do not work for Comet Loss Prevention anymore so I do not wear the uniform... soon as I start my new assignment I'll be puttin' on the ol' belt and firing up me radio!

                            Oh and dude, you should put my suggestion to your company! never know... they might like the idea

                            I also noticed another thread wear people said their nylon belts tore? I bought a pair off of a surplus site before I started my comet assignment and they had velcro with them, I simply put them together.... worked a treat! STRONG and light!
                            Attached Files
                            Last edited by Ewfr 'Gomulee; 03-04-2008, 02:22 PM.
                            Ewfr 'Gomulee - EuwFer 'Gom-You-Lee
                            Court Security Officer - Her Majesty's Courts Service HMCS

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              In all honesty I sort of thought about recomending the Reflective Yellow Security vests for our staff as we already have enough issues with people not paying attention while on property. But It's probably not worth it.

                              We wear All white Uniform shirts with Navy Blue pants and silver SEO badges for regular officers and gold SEO badges for Supervisors. Our new director is in the process of changing uniform companies though and he is thinking about changing to Military style pants (cargo pocket on each side). Not sure about the shirts yet though. Kinda feel like we are becoming a police force honestly lol, not that I mind, as long as the pay incrases a bit perhaps, heheh. We are even supposed to start doing bag checks on our housekeepers eventually I think.

                              I just got new boots myself and haven't had a chance to really shine em up yet. As I mentioned, they don't provide us with anything but uniforms and radios so everything else I bought on my own. LawPro PursuitPro Boots. $49.99 and very comfortable!

                              I also redid my belt setup to adjust for the big CPR mask so that heavin forbid I fall on my back I won't kill myself. Moved the pouch to the right and the gloves to the left giving me room to slide the CPR mask further to my left side. No more problems with having anything in the small of my back.
                              Attached Files
                              Last edited by Deputy Dawg; 03-04-2008, 02:39 PM.
                              "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Dude, those boots look pretty sweet.
                                But are you able to use Parade gloss polish on them? wouldn't it get into the fabric? that's why I like my boots. All leather and steel toe cap and heel protection.
                                Ewfr 'Gomulee - EuwFer 'Gom-You-Lee
                                Court Security Officer - Her Majesty's Courts Service HMCS

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