Tasers

[rauker]

Does anyone here who works for a hospital police/ security department, carry Tasers? If you do, how are they working for you? What do you think about a hospital police department carrying them?

[OccamsRazor]

Does anyone here who works for a hospital police/ security department, carry Tasers? If you do, how are they working for you? What do you think about a hospital police department carrying them?

You should ask DDog.

[N. A. Corbier]

round 1

The Fight Of The Moment

An Unnamed Forum User

Vs

Random Electrical Murder Machine

Fight!

[bpdblue]

Mr Corbier, do you think OUCH would qualify as a reasonable response to you post.

[HotelSecurity]

RCMP responds to recent complaints about Taser use

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2007/12/12/4720751-cp.html

[Black Caesar]

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2...720751-cp.html

OMG OMG OMG those evil TASERS!!!!!!!

(from the article)

Dziekanski is recorded as the 18th person in Canada to die in recent years after being hit by a Taser.

Mounties have wielded the electronic guns over 3,000 times since their introduction in December 2001

(also note, this does not mention other Candian police forces with Tasers, i'll bet Tasers have been used more than 3000 times since 2001).

18 is a little bit more than 1/2 of 1 percent of 3,000 (.6% actually). OMG OMG Tasers are just killing everyone stop them OMG OMG.......

I will also never understand how anyone could think like they do in that article. Why would you use a Taser in a sitiution where you obviously should be using a firearm? Tasers are an alternative to more dangerous Batons (never heard of a Taser breaking a bone, batons do) and longer lasting Pepper Spray (after a Taser hit the suspect is back to normal in a couple minutes, it'll be a full hour before the effects of pepper wear of). Tasers are NOT a substitute for guns.

That's the problem with 'civilian' watchdogs, they are civilians, it's not THEIR LIVEs AND SAEFTY on the line..

Tightening up where the Taser fits on the use-of-force continuum is vital," he said. "We are not against use of force. And we're not necessarily against the Taser.

Liars

"We've said, at the very least, if governments aren't prepared to go ahead with a moratorium, they should ensure that the Taser is the second-last stop on the use-of-force continuum - that officers are only reaching for it when their next choice would be to reach for the gun."

Stupid liars at that. You don't use TASERs like that because they are 1 shot weapons. If you try to use a Taser where you should be using a gun and MISS (OR only hit with 1 prong, which can happen if the suspect is in heavy clothes, (like a winter coat during a cold Canadian winter) you might not have TIME to transistion to the firearm. That means you = hurt or dead.

[N. A. Corbier]

Everyone and their brother swears that the Taser:

1. It a non-lethal alternative to firearms.
2. Should only be used when facing deadly force.
3. Should never be used when a baton, OC, or other weapon could be used.

You go on the college liberal-heavy social media sites (Reddit, Digg, etc.) and you'll notice that the UK liberals (who have this thing about force, believing that all Americans are savages and the best solution to any problem not involving a gun is to let the bad person do what he wants) are saying the above things.

Maybe this is how the Met uses tasers, as a deadly force alternative. I've read, in the past, that special Armed Police units would have tasers as an alternative to just up and shooting people, something that scares the living f- out of their citizens. (That they have cops with guns who can shoot you. We all know bobbies don't carry guns!)

I know several British folks, and they thought I was full of it when I mentioned that Met and several other agencies have Armed Police Response units. "Police don't carry guns here! That's stupid! Only the Nuclear/Atomics Police do, and they don't police us."

When a Met page about APUs was shown, they were angry and afraid that police were running around with guns.

Same mentality, I think.

[bpdblue]

Almost anything can kill.........

You ever hear of someone over drinking water and then they die.

Tasers may indeed have been the primary cause of death in a very few of the cases reported.

But most of the deaths have been caused by drug use, and resisting arrest cases. In some of these cases, if just physical techinques had been used to make the arrests, do you think some of the same people would have still died. I do, and have heard of numerous deaths occurring for just that same reason.

Have you EVER heard of just ONE volunteer of a taser demonstration dying? How many human taser volunteers have been zapped? I don't know the total, but I have NEVER heard of even one death.

I'm not saying the taser is perfect, but I can tell you that in the three or four times a taser was used in my presence, against resisters, or suicidal persons, it has worked every time. In one case it probably saved the persons life, because we believed he had a gun, was suicidal, and had told his friends he wanted to take out a cop with him.

Well, he had his hands in his pockets when we found him, basically face to face with us, and he started to pull his hands out of his pockets, while being told not to move, two of us had guns pointed at him, and one of us had the taser. The guy got tasered insted of shot. Now I will admit that the taser going off next to my ear was no fun (it makes a mildly loud high pitched pop), but it was much better than having to shoot someone.

The result, one suicidal subject alive, and on the way to the mental ward, and a few of us knowing how close it came to having to kill someone, and then the relief knowing that we didn't have to.

By the way, it was our policy to have to wear the taser opposite your gun side on your duty belt, so your gun hand was available at all times if needed.

[OccamsRazor]

When a Met page about APUs was shown, they were angry and afraid that police were running around with guns.

Once Great. Britain.

Those pesky periods.

[HotelSecurity]

(also note, this does not mention other Candian police forces with Tasers, i'll bet Tasers have been used more than 3000 times since 2001).

Probably not much more. The police in Canada's second largest province(Quebec) only have 113 Tasers.

The government of Quebec will be making new regulations for their use, I believe this coming Monday.

[gcmc security part 2]

Interesting enough, someone in Canada arguing FOR Tasers!

From Healthcare Security Weekly eNewsletter

Canadian physician lobbies to arm hospital guards with Tasers

An emergency department physician in Canada wants security guards at his hospital armed with Tasers or pepper spray to deal with an increase in violent confrontations between staff and patients, reported the National Post.

Brian Dufresne, MD, chief of emergency medicine at the Northern Lights Regional Health Centre in Fort McMurray, Alberta, said not a day goes by without at least one incident of verbal abuse or physical threats. The increase in violent confrontations includes a recent assault on a security guard who was left with a black eye and facial cuts.

Dufresne, 52, an 11-year veteran at the hospital, said the facility needs to step up security to make the facility safer. He said a large transient population coupled with high levels of alcohol and cocaine abuse fuel much of the violence. The regional health authority is reviewing the security situation, but said it does not support arming guards, the news report said.

[SecTrainer]

Interesting enough, someone in Canada arguing FOR Tasers!

The regional authority "does not support arming guards". Based on the description of the problem (large transient population, alcohol, drugs, frequent assaults and threats), this authority might as well say that it "does not support protecting the healthcare community or patients" and that it "does not care about the safety of security officers either".

...and so it goes. It will take a murder that a court finds was completely predictable and preventable, along with an enormous sum awarded to someone's family, to wake these idiots up (if they wake up even then). Unfortunately, this will do nothing for the victim(s).

It would be better if the authority were sued and/or reported to a Canadian labor safety agency for failure to meet workplace safety mandates before this happens. In the US, we should be reporting many similar situations to OSHA for such policies. Many venues are clearly at risk for violence, and even have histories of violence. They are not meeting their mandated obligations for workplace safety when officers cannot be armed.

[HotelSecurity]

Interesting enough, someone in Canada arguing FOR Tasers!

From Healthcare Security Weekly eNewsletter

I do not think they will get them. The Criminal Code would have to be changed or they Security Guards would have to be given Peace Officer status.

Also I'm sure the problem in that part of the country involves Native Canadians, The Inuit people lack a enzime in their blood which effects the way acohol reacts in their system. The Tasers would be used more on Native Canadians than Whites. This would cause major human rights issues.

[jmaccauley]

The racial disparity of TASER usage has always come up in law enforcement. The logical solution is to be sure to criminally charge appropriately, those who are Tased. For example, a subject who is actively resisting arrest gets tased, then is simply charged with the the original crime. This doesn't indicate the level of resistance offered nor does it explain the officers justification for using that level of force. The media loves to say a person got 50,000 volts of electicity for refusing to produce I.D. when the facts were that the subject had displayed violent actions and when confronted by the police, took a combative and threatening stance which the officers knew, based on their training and experience, was indicative of an imminent attack. PHEW! A mouthful, but necessary when gaining support of such a useful and controversial tool.

[HotelSecurity]

The racial disparity of TASER usage has always come up in law enforcement. The logical solution is to be sure to criminally charge appropriately, those who are Tased. For example, a subject who is actively resisting arrest gets tased, then is simply charged with the the original crime. This doesn't indicate the level of resistance offered nor does it explain the officers justification for using that level of force. The media loves to say a person got 50,000 volts of electicity for refusing to produce I.D. when the facts were that the subject had displayed violent actions and when confronted by the police, took a combative and threatening stance which the officers knew, based on their training and experience, was indicative of an imminent attack. PHEW! A mouthful, but necessary when gaining support of such a useful and controversial tool.

I think that is the problem with the RCMPs use of the tool. They APPARENTLY have been using it against passive resistors when according to Canadian law they can one be used against someone who is actively resisting.