tips and tricks

[Defensive tactics]

I am new to the forum so hopefully we can start a good conversation. Lets hear from everyone some of there diffrent tips and tricks (if you dont want to discuss it over a public forum please send me a PM) some of mine are,

1. Watch there hands never look them directly in the eyes
2. Watch there foot placement yours and there's
3. be aware of breathing yours and there's
4. Be easily concealed read a newspaper or talk on your cell phones well watching someone

PLEASE ADD TO THE LIST
thank you

[Guest]

PLEASE ADD TO THE LIST

Bill,

There are five areas of awareness:

1. HANDS I think this is self-explanitory.
2. WEAPONS Not just the obvious weapons, but improvised weapons as well.
3. FOOTING Watch where you step. You do not want to trip over something and end up on the ground. I triped over a curb once while on a felony traffic stop and it was wasn't pretty.
4. ASSOCIATES I don't just mean anyone with the bad guy. To me, anyone in the area who does not have a badge that says "Police Officer" or "Deputy Sheriff" (OK, maybe "Security Guard") can be an associate.
5. ESCAPE ROUTES Both for the bad guy AND for you.

Good topic, Bill. Thanks for bringing it up.

[Bill Warnock]

Bill,

There are five areas of awareness:

1. HANDS I think this is self-explanitory.
2. WEAPONS Not just the obvious weapons, but improvised weapons as well.
3. FOOTING Watch where you step. You do not want to trip over something and end up on the ground. I triped over a curb once while on a felony traffic stop and it was wasn't pretty.
4. ASSOCIATES I don't just mean anyone with the bad guy. To me, anyone in the area who does not have a badge that says "Police Officer" or "Deputy Sheriff" (OK, maybe "Security Guard") can be an associate.
5. ESCAPE ROUTES Both for the bad guy AND for you.

Good topic, Bill. Thanks for bringing it up.

Histfan71, thank you.
Back home again.
Getting into a rut could preclude going home at night. We must always remember, the difference between a rut and a grave is its depth.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[wisconsinite]

Quote:
Originally Posted by histfan71

There are five areas of awareness:

1. HANDS I think this is self-explanitory.
2. WEAPONS Not just the obvious weapons, but improvised weapons as well.
3. FOOTING Watch where you step. You do not want to trip over something and end up on the ground. I triped over a curb once while on a felony traffic stop and it was wasn't pretty.
4. ASSOCIATES I don't just mean anyone with the bad guy. To me, anyone in the area who does not have a badge that says "Police Officer" or "Deputy Sheriff" (OK, maybe "Security Guard") can be an associate.
5. ESCAPE ROUTES Both for the bad guy AND for you.


histfan, good points on your 1-5. May I elaborate?
1. HANDS-If you can, politely ask the "suspect" to keep his hands out of his pockets. That way, he'll be less likely to pull a blade, or other blunt weapon on you. Also, do not cross YOUR arms or leave them at your sides. Keep your arms and hands at your mid-chest level. That way, if the suspect does take a swing at you, you'll be more likely to swat or deflect his attack.
2. WEAPONS-That goes back to, asking him/her to keep his hands out of his pockets.
3. FOOTING-Keep your legs shoulder lenght apart. Keep equal weight on both legs. And try to keep a low center of gravity. That way it may be less likely of YOU going down, or being tackled. Also, if you can get backup, do so. Have one security person speaking to the suspect head-on, and have another security person standing at a 45-degree angle to the rear of the subject, to watch the suspect's backside, to minimize "surprises".
4. ASSOCIATES-If the suspect has other "friends", be aware of that fact, and call for backup if you feel threatened and outmanned.
5. ESCAPE ROUTES-As you said already, routes for the suspect, but more importantly, YOU! If all hell breaks loose, the LAST thing you want, is to be cornered.
I like what Bill said. "the difference between a rut and a grave is its depth".
Stay Safe!

[Lawson]

Remember the bladed stance... dont talk to them face to face, turn your body to an angle (I guess unless you are wider from the side than from the front) so that the suspect is looking at your shoulder and across your chest almost. This gives them a smaller area to attack and any body shots will be toward your arm.... the body part you were going to use to deflect a shot anyway.

[wisconsinite]

Tou'che, Lawson...the bladed stance=a lesser attack area. But keep your strong-side away from the subject. That way, if you need to throw a punch or kick, or, for you lucky folks, that carry a sidearm...you'll have for room to wind-up and execute those active countermeasures.

[astorms]

Some additional points...

Talk with your hands. When dealing with a suspect, always have your hands in front of you, ready to react to whatever they might attack with. Your hands also act as a distraction for the suspect.

Never, ever talk face to face (or in the 1 position). You always want to be in the 1.5 position for inerviewing. This enables you to step out of the way of any punch or kick that may be delivered. If the perp turns, you turn to maintain the 1.5 position, always.

Always try to have a 'reactionary gap'. This is the space that keeps you at a safe distance from your perp/suspect, so they cannot easily strike you with a punch or a kick(usually 4-6 feet). This gap also give you time to react, in case there is an attack. The reactionary gap also takes into consideration personal space. Both yours and your perp's. If your too close, they may feel your attacking/confronting them, which can escelate a situation faster than you wanted to. Always be in control.

Breathing is important. Your heart rate can jump from resting to over 170bpm in a matter of seconds when dealing with a potentially life threatening situation. Tactical breathing is taking a breath, holding it for 5 seconds, breathing out, hold for five seconds and repeat. In addition, tunnel vision accompanies this natural reaction to stressful situations. With tactical breathing, you allow more blood to stay in your extremities, reducing tunnel vision. Hearing is also affected when fight or flight kicks in.

Always be aware of what and who is around you. You never know if the perp has a partner or accomplice. Be ready to react to their possibe attack. Also, if you carry a baton, that you may not have all the space around you to extend it. You may need to improvise your tactics.

Training, once again, is key! You need to practice and train all the time. We have monthly sessions where we practice and refresh our PPCT, baton and knife defense skills. We come up with situations we might encounter, and we re-enact situation we have encountered and see how they could have turned out differently. Officers will become more confident in their skills with practice. There is no replacement for real life experience, and that includes training. Another way to train is to visualize what you would do in certain situations. This is good for those who don't receive physical training, and for those who want to stay sharp. Visualize potential occurrences for your respective work place(s), and what your reaction would be.

Lastly, nobody ever likes to read the headlines about S/O's getting killed on the job. If you feel your skills are not equal to, or above those of your perp's, then back off and call the police. It's not worth a life to attempt an arrest you can't conduct yourself. This subject ties in to working in pairs or with a partner, but labour costs don't always allow for this. But that is a totally different topic.


Adam

[FoxGhost]

Dont be shy with usage of force.The safest detainments&ejections for me have been when i have come up from behind the bad guy and immidiately took hold over the elbow of his strong arm.Dont just controll a situation, dominate it.

Everything else is pretty much covered in the previous messages.But when everything else fails, body armour saves.Wear it and love it.Mine is a level II laminated dynema with a steel trauma plate over the chest.Me going home is worth the extra sweat.

FoxGhost

[wisconsinite]

Dont be shy with usage of force.The safest detainments&ejections for me have been when i have come up from behind the bad guy and immidiately took hold over the elbow of his strong arm.....

FoxGhost

FoxGhost, I don't know how laws and procedures are over on your side of the pond, but here in the U.S., you can't just walk up behind somebody on their 3 o'clock position, without just cause, and execute an escort hold or compliance hold. And while you think may be their dominant arm, just may not be. Even with their weak arm, they can swing around and punch you in your face, even while you try to maintain that pincer grip. Things happen quickly. Especially when someone resists. Escpecially when they are equal to or bigger than YOUR build.
Stay Safe.

[Mr. Security]

Man, am I glad that I don't work in LP. If you need to use such force on a regular basis with all its inherent risks, why not choose LE? The pay, benefits, training, and resources likely are better as well. I know someone has to do it, but not me.

[FoxGhost]

FoxGhost, I don't know how laws and procedures are over on your side of the pond, but here in the U.S., you can't just walk up behind somebody on their 3 o'clock position, without just cause, and execute an escort hold or compliance hold. And while you think may be their dominant arm, just may not be. Even with their weak arm, they can swing around and punch you in your face, even while you try to maintain that pincer grip. Things happen quickly. Especially when someone resists. Escpecially when they are equal to or bigger than YOUR build.
Stay Safe.

The gist of the post was for you to hold the initative at all times and keep the subject on the defensive without allowing him either the time or space to think about anything other than doing as you tell him to.Little physical force works marvels for this effect when paired with confidence and certain sternness.Sorry for not making it clearer, i tend to forget im talking from a totally diffrent security culture.
As for someone swinging around and hitting you from that particular comealong,if it does escalate to a comealong that is, its not that easy when you have somebody controlling your arm&shoulder from your 4 o'clock

And for Mr.Security
The sad truth is the only fatalities i know that we have here have been guards working retail security.They died because they either failed or were unable to dominate a situation and the bad guy took the initative.Thankfully, the store i currently work in is fairly peaceful, but my first posts were regular nightmares.Grocery stores are particulary hazardous as even Charlie the Crackhead needs to eat, though he doesnt have the cash for it.And for LE....well,their pay sucks even more than ours when compared to the risks they take.And they go out looking for trouble, mine come through the door to me.I would be perfectly happy just sitting in my office watching the cameras doing nothing, but the crackheads just wont let me

FoxGhost

[Mr. Security]

.And for LE....well.... they go out looking for trouble...

FoxGhost

That's true. Good point.

[CanISeeYourReciept]

Well im currently in school to be LE, so im doing LP now to pay for books, food and some good times

[JCreasey]

Hope this helps someone...

I am new to the forum so hopefully we can start a good conversation. Lets hear from everyone some of there diffrent tips and tricks (if you dont want to discuss it over a public forum please send me a PM) some of mine are,

1. Watch there hands never look them directly in the eyes
2. Watch there foot placement yours and there's
3. be aware of breathing yours and there's
4. Be easily concealed read a newspaper or talk on your cell phones well watching someone
[FONT=Arial]
PLEASE ADD TO THE LIST
thank you
Ben Wallace

5. When you want to see what someone has in thier hands or get a better look at a shoplifter, walk right at them and then by them. Remember...you are just another customer. As you are passing them and in thier blind spot...then get a good look.
6. If a shoplifter or someone you are watching surprises you in the store...don't do anything other than continue to do what you were doing. The more you move, the more you stand out. The more you try to look innocent, the more guilty you look.
7. Try using a Black Jewel (CD) Case. They make a perfect mirror and do not stand out in stores that carry them. I have used this tactic extensively and am still amazed at how many shoplifters would conceal right behind me. Trust me...it works. I have received boxes full of awards for District productivity and multiple National awards (Canada) for arrest stats.

[Mr. Security]

Of course, if prevention is your goal instead of arrest quotas, you could dress like a store clerk, approach them and then ask if they need any assistance. If you misjudged a shopper, they will think that you're just being helpful. If you are dealing with a shoplifter, you may just rattle them enough so that they move on to a different store.