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  • #16
    Originally posted by LPCap View Post
    Read. Comprehend. Post.

    I SAID...Shoplifters generally think that they will be approached from the BACK...hence the reason they look over their shoulder and back into the store when they are leaving.
    Incorrect. Here is what you really said:

    Originally posted by LPCap
    Shoplifters generally expect someone so approach them from behind, if you are in front, it is very easy.
    I can read, comprehend, and post perfectly fine, thank you. I suggest you learn to type, use proper grammar, and formulate a complete idea. With your typo and comma splice in the above sentence, it means something completely different than what you apparently intended. How do your narratives look?

    Originally posted by LPCap
    An apprehension like that one should have gone down with the LP approaching in a calm manner.
    Ideally, yes. As I said, there may be more to the story that we don't know. Therefore, you cannot judge this incident on a short video clip! I would not approach someone who is known for running, fighting, or carrying a weapon "in a calm manner."

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    • #17
      Originally posted by LPCap View Post
      What would have happened if she shot you?
      I'd be bleeding, probably.

      I recognized her threat for a simple bluff, and I was positioned so that she was unable to reach for a weapon anyways. As soon as the words came out of her mouth, I had her in a counterjoint wrist lock and in a handcuffing position. She was too surprised to do anything but squirm around and yell.

      Originally posted by LPCap
      Every training manual I have read (and I have read a ton) have said to disengage if they threaten violence.
      My company allowed for officer discretion and trained us to a high standard. I have enough common sense to know when someone is going to shoot me and when they are simply bluffing because they're scared of being arrested.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by LPGuy View Post
        How do your narratives look?
        I don't write narratives, it is not my job.

        You are a master of avoiding the topic at hand. Compare the two quotes you have of mine and see if they don't say the exact thing (minus the typo).

        When you look at the video in its entirety, including the person who posted it, the title of the clip and the purpose for posting it, you will see that this is a common approach by these "cowboy" LP.
        Last edited by LPCap; 07-04-2007, 11:38 AM.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by LPCap View Post
          I don't write narratives, it is not my job.

          You are a master of avoiding the topic at hand. Compare the two quotes you have of mine and see if they don't say the exact thing (minus the typo).

          When you look at the video in its entirety, including the person who posted it, the title of the clip and the purpose for posting it, you will see that this is a common approach by these "cowboy" LP.

          You do LP work and writing narratives isn't your job?
          "Gun control, the theory that 110lb. women have the "right" to fistfight with 210lb. rapists. " Author Unknown

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          • #20
            Did ever consider he might be in an elevated position whcih requires he reads and approves reports and not write them!?

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            • #21
              There is no question that this was handled improperly by the LP agents. Think about it.

              - They had 3 agents outside to make the stop, but lost the advantage of using the numbers when the first guy charged through the doors. This created a one-on-one situation instead of a three-on-one.
              - The charging in creates an instant fight or flight situation. When you approach like that, you guarantee the guy is going to run or fight. You do not leave an option for a peaceful apprehension.
              - They did not follow any policy that I know of that would allow that type of aggressive approach.

              I don't care about the other facts. If the guy has a history of running, then this was the wrong approach, as you assue he is going to run. If the guy has a history of violence, then this was the wrong approach as the guy is sure to get violent.

              No professional LP agents should ever engage in making an apprehension like this. This is amateurish and thuggish. All it does is make everyone in the industry look bad. I suspect that anyone supporting this action is someone who engages in this type of apprehension themselves.
              www.plsolutions.net
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              • #22
                I got an idea why don't we just slap him on the wrist and say next time don't do it again! It's funny how people complain about the increase in crime. I wonder why. Do you really think this piece of work will ever go back to that store to ply his handy work? I hope they messed him up good. Maybe if you live in Pleasantville then what you say might apply. But try your way in the human sewers that some of us work in and see how fast word spreads that your store is an easy target. My hats of to those guys and there old school way to combat punks like him that think stores are there personal free for the taking goodies.
                THE AVERAGE RESPONSE TIME FOR A 911 CALL IS FOUR MINUTES
                THE AVERAGE RESPONSE TIME FOR A .357 MAGNUM ROUND IS 1400 FEET PER SECOND?
                http://www.boondocksaints.com/

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                • #23
                  With a Mr. Assault logo I am not surprised by your comment.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by panther10758 View Post
                    With a Mr. Assault logo I am not surprised by your comment.
                    LOL. Try again. Chucky's logo says Air Assault, in reference to airborne military units such as the 101st or 82nd Airborne Divisions.

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                    • #25
                      My bad time for new glasses

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by LPGuy View Post
                        LOL. Try again. Chucky's logo says Air Assault, in reference to airborne military units such as the 101st or 82nd Airborne Divisions.
                        Thanks for the clarification. Because of it's size it does not show up as it should. It is a UH1A spuing fire. The wings represent the coiling of the lz smoke made by the down draft from the bottom being sucked back through the rotors. The front of the ship has an erie look like a skull. This is supposed to frighten the little people back into their tunnels.
                        Last edited by Chucky; 07-04-2007, 04:23 PM.
                        THE AVERAGE RESPONSE TIME FOR A 911 CALL IS FOUR MINUTES
                        THE AVERAGE RESPONSE TIME FOR A .357 MAGNUM ROUND IS 1400 FEET PER SECOND?
                        http://www.boondocksaints.com/

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by LPCap View Post
                          I don't write narratives, it is not my job.
                          I'm glad that's the truth, because you'd probably confuse the hell out of your local prosecutor.

                          Originally posted by LPCap
                          Compare the two quotes you have of mine and see if they don't say the exact thing (minus the typo).
                          Read: "Navigate your way through my poorly-written sentence and try to figure out what I was trying to say."

                          Okay, I'll humor you. Let's dissect:

                          Originally posted by LPCap
                          Shoplifters generally expect someone so approach them from behind,
                          Because shoplifters generally expect someone, you should approach them from behind. I suppose you're trying to tell me that I should have known your "so" was supposed to be "to," which would actually make this mean something closer to what you intended.

                          Originally posted by LPCap
                          if you are in front, it is very easy.
                          No matter which way I interprete the first independent clause in your sentence, the second makes no sense whatsoever.

                          Let's say, for the sake of argument, that I understood your typo in the first independent clause. I would then be forced to understand that your second clause is following from the first; i.e., "Because shoplifters generally expect someone to approach them from behind, if you are in front, it is very easy."

                          This means... what, exactly, in terms of our conversation? What is really easy? The apprehension? This really had no bearing on the topic, because the officers in question made the stop from in front of the subject.

                          Here is how you tried to explain your clumsily-written sentence:

                          Originally posted by LPCap
                          I SAID...Shoplifters generally think that they will be approached from the BACK...hence the reason they look over their shoulder and back into the store when they are leaving.
                          Again, this is not what you said. You said, "[. . .] if you are in front, it is very easy," which no one had the slightest idea what the hell you were talking about. Nor did that fit into the conversation, because the officers did not approach the subject from behind, nor did he ever look over his shoulder as he exited the store.

                          Originally posted by LPCap
                          When you look at the video in its entirety, including the person who posted it, the title of the clip and the purpose for posting it,
                          I don't see any harm in this. It's no different than the videos we watch on COPS where the suspects run and get Tased or jumped on and we laugh at their stupidity. The subject in this shoplift video ran and got jumped on. It's funny and the poster thought so, too. You apparently found some interest in it as well, otherwise you wouldn't have been looking up videos on shoplift apprehensions.

                          Originally posted by LPCap
                          you will see that this is a common approach by these "cowboy" LP.
                          I wasn't aware that you were familiar with these officers in question.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Chucky View Post
                            Thanks for the clarification. Because of it's size it does not show up as it should. It is a UH1A spuing fire. The wings represent the coiling of the lz smoke made by the down draft from the bottom being sucked back through the rotors. The front of the ship has an erie look like a skull. This is supposed to frighten the little people back into their tunnels.
                            Very cool logo indeed.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Lynch Mob View Post
                              There is no question that this was handled improperly by the LP agents.
                              I'm glad you brought your vast expertise in shoplift apprehensions to this discussion. Oh, wait... you don't make apprehensions.

                              Originally posted by Lynch Mob
                              I suspect that anyone supporting this action is someone who engages in this type of apprehension themselves.
                              No, sir, I did not. However, I can see several circumstances when such an approach may be warranted. Because I don't know if those circumstances were in place, I won't sit on a forum and judge another officer's actions based on my very limited knowledge of the situation in question.

                              At any rate, I'm not crying for the shoplifter here. He knew damn well who the three officers were, as I assume they were yelling something along the lines of, "Loss prevention! Don't run!" The important thing to remember here is that the choice of running and the choice of going along calmly or being taken down to the ground was the shoplifter's. We, as officers, don't ever force people to run or fight. They make that choice themself.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Chucky View Post
                                Thanks for the clarification. Because of it's size it does not show up as it should. It is a UH1A spuing fire. The wings represent the coiling of the lz smoke made by the down draft from the bottom being sucked back through the rotors. The front of the ship has an erie look like a skull. This is supposed to frighten the little people back into their tunnels.
                                I have a Son who is with the 101st Airborne Air Assault, at Ft. Campbell
                                Retail Security Consultant / Expert Witness
                                Co-Author - Effective Security Management 6th Edition

                                Contributor to Retail Crime, Security and Loss Prevention: An Encyclopedic Reference

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