Deter vs app

[lpguy40]

In a recent thread (LP techniques that work), the topic of what works best was brought up. I have been in the “business” for over 20+ years now and like most of you was full of piss and vinegar when I first started. Apps apps apps, chase chase chase. That is all I ever did. One time chasing someone over 4 city blocks in August heat all for a $12.00 CD. Fast-forward to present day, countless Russian martinis and Cuban cigars later, and I am lucky if I could catch a cold yet alone a shoplifter. When I first started and to some extent, even today LP is often thought of as an us against them mentality and in some situations as an afterthought all together. This line of thinking proally evolved from the fact that most store managers see LP as an expenditure that eats up payroll without producing any sales revenue. The line of thinking that says LP just looks at cameras all day and flirts with the female associates. True to some extent but those are not LP professionals; they are hacks plain and simple. I am a firm believer in the pro-active approach to LP the more store employees that are behind you the better. If you can stop a theft before it happens great. Why bother chasing someone down fro what amount to pennies in most cases. If I am going to chase you it had better be for a huge dollar amount and when I catch you (and I will) its not going to be a good day for you that I can assure. Now I understand that some situations such as a dishonest employee call for 100% discretion as well it should be. In most other cases however, get employees as involved as you think necessary; the more eyes on the floor the better. I hope I was not too long winded but I will add more to this thread when time allows. So long for now.

[mbmx13]

In my experience as a law enforcement officer, I have noticed the frustration on some chain retail stores when they have a policy to just let people walk out with stuff, they will usually say insurance will cover it.

I saw this and it angered me because I know that in the end, the consumer ends up paying for the loss through higher priced merchandise.

When I was a LE, I went to the different stores and talked to them about their policy on shoplifters. I was shocked to find out that their corporate policy was that if it is a misdemeanor that they won't apprehend or even prosecute.

I felt that arresting shoplifters would help as a deterrent and hopefully recoup some of the loss the company experiences since it is usually the same people shoplifting. I told each of the LP Personnel in each store that if they are willing to apprehend these shoplifters then I will do my best to make it a felony so they don't have to sign a Citizen's Arrest in hopes that it would also prevent them from wasting time in court on a misdemeanor arrest.

I was pretty successful in getting most shoplifting's charged as a Felony. The way that I did it was by conducting an interview in the jail after they were arrested for misdemeanor shoplifting. The interview was audio and video recorded, I would read them Miranda and they would end up telling me that they entered the store with the intent to steal.

In the state of California, if you enter a specified structure with the intent to commit a petty theft, grand theft or any serious felony then you have just committed the crime of Burglary (a felony).

The end result is that I arrested a lot of people for shoplifting, had their charges upgraded to Burglary and they got the charges reduced to probation with search terms. That opened the floodgates for skilled narcotic officers that wanted to put them away for a long time since most were dopers.

Long story short is that it was a means to an end and I wish that there were more cops that were willing to go the extra mile but unfortunately their are a lot of lazy ones out there that just don't care.

This is my second post and I am really enjoying the topics discussed here.

Ray

[LPGuy]

In my experience as a law enforcement officer, I have noticed the frustration on some chain retail stores when they have a policy to just let people walk out with stuff, they will usually say insurance will cover it.

I saw this and it angered me because I know that in the end, the consumer ends up paying for the loss through higher priced merchandise.

When I was a LE, I went to the different stores and talked to them about their policy on shoplifters. I was shocked to find out that their corporate policy was that if it is a misdemeanor that they won't apprehend or even prosecute.

I felt that arresting shoplifters would help as a deterrent and hopefully recoup some of the loss the company experiences since it is usually the same people shoplifting. I told each of the LP Personnel in each store that if they are willing to apprehend these shoplifters then I will do my best to make it a felony so they don't have to sign a Citizen's Arrest in hopes that it would also prevent them from wasting time in court on a misdemeanor arrest.

I was pretty successful in getting most shoplifting's charged as a Felony. The way that I did it was by conducting an interview in the jail after they were arrested for misdemeanor shoplifting. The interview was audio and video recorded, I would read them Miranda and they would end up telling me that they entered the store with the intent to steal.

In the state of California, if you enter a specified structure with the intent to commit a petty theft, grand theft or any serious felony then you have just committed the crime of Burglary (a felony).

The end result is that I arrested a lot of people for shoplifting, had their charges upgraded to Burglary and they got the charges reduced to probation with search terms. That opened the floodgates for skilled narcotic officers that wanted to put them away for a long time since most were dopers.

Long story short is that it was a means to an end and I wish that there were more cops that were willing to go the extra mile but unfortunately their are a lot of lazy ones out there that just don't care.

This is my second post and I am really enjoying the topics discussed here.

Ray

Thank you for your input. I appreciated hearing about the way that shoplifting is viewed from a law enforcement perspective. I previously worked in loss prevention myself, for a company that has a strict 100% prosecution policy. All shoplifters were apprehended, prosecuted, and trespassed.

I fully support these kind of policies for a variety of reasons. I do believe it deters shoplifters, especially amateurs, from future violations. Being handcuffed, having your picture taken, your information entered into a computer system, and being trespassed all have an impact on many people. They would hardly ever come back, except for the very few unintelligent ones. Many of the local police officers enjoyed the way we worked as well. It gave them a good reason to take the shoplifter down to the jail to be booked (and get their fingerprints/photo/information into the system).

I believe in "hardening" the target (the retail store) as thoroughly as possible in the first place to discourage thieves from even attempting to steal, through various security means such as cameras, warning notices, EAS tags, ink tags, locked up merchandise, security cables, employee awareness, etc. However, if someone manages to circumvent these measures I support a 100% apprehension and prosecution policy.

[mbmx13]

It sounds like you really know your stuff. If it is okay, I plan on picking your brain from time to time if I have any questions.

Thanks for the job that you did as an LP, those guys don't get enough respect!

Ray

[lpguy40]

thank you Ray I currenly work for a major Bio Tech firm let me know if I can help in any way

[lpguy40]

Back to practices that work, Yes arrest does work in some cases, as a matter a fact, there was a retailer that opened shop in Boston some years ago in a particularly bad area, and they had a policy of 100% arrest for the first 3 months. Doing this sent out a message that the store would not tolerate theft of any kind, sure it was expensive, but it was worth it.
Word got out to the neighborhood not to steal from them. Now they can sort of pick and choose whom they lock up. Of course none of this or any other practice makes a damn difference with out strong relations with the local police. This is easier said than done in some towns here in MA. Some towns refuse to arrest unless an assault occurs or the item is worth more than 250.00 (felony) others will bend over backwards to help.

[LPGuy]

It sounds like you really know your stuff. If it is okay, I plan on picking your brain from time to time if I have any questions.

Thanks for the job that you did as an LP, those guys don't get enough respect!

Ray

Thanks again! Feel free to fire away with any questions anytime.

[Curtis Baillie]

Thanks again! Feel free to fire away with any questions anytime.

LPGuy - You responded to a post directed to LPGuy 40. Are you both one in the same? If so, posting under two different screen names is confusing to others.

[LPGuy]

LPGuy - You responded to a post directed to LPGuy 40. Are you both one in the same? If so, posting under two different screen names is confusing to others.

We are not the same.

How do you figure mbmx13's second post was directed to lpguy40?

[Curtis Baillie]

We are not the same.

How do you figure mbmx13's second post was directed to lpguy40?

Because lpguy 40 thanked him. Sorry if I'm confused.

[LPGuy]

I apologize if I sound petty, but I do believe mbmx13's second post was directed to me. I had replied to his previous post, and he replied "thank you" for the job I "did" as LP (I had stated that I previously worked in LP).

The two screennames are indeed confusing. Maybe I should change mine since I don't even work in LP anymore.

[Curtis Baillie]

No need to change - bit if you want too contact me. I can give you a list of names my ex-wife used to call me.

[fordy125]

here in the uk we are getting a lot of bother from police regarding shoplifters,the police want us to deter instore and take the items from the offender.
the company i work for gives us yearly arrest targets so this doesn't work.
also if we arrest a person for theft they just get a fixed penalty fine from the police on the spot

[Chucky]

here in the uk we are getting a lot of bother from police regarding shoplifters,the police want us to deter instore and take the items from the offender.
the company i work for gives us yearly arrest targets so this doesn't work.
also if we arrest a person for theft they just get a fixed penalty fine from the police on the spot

Hi Fordy I'm not sure that I understand what you are saying. It could be your accent. But are you saying that there is a fixed fine that a lifter must pay to the police each time there are caught? As like 30 er per offense? Why would your company care how you do it the main thing is the store is getting the LP that it pays you all for.

[fordy125]

hi chucky
the fixed penalty fine in the uk is 80 pounds payable in 21 days,even for prolific offenders.