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  • Pop pop
    replied
    Originally posted by ctx2 View Post
    Youre just rude and come off as one of those people who think they know everything. But, hey its water under the bridge. Take care.

    Don't have thin skin, drive on, nut up and get over it. Your talking with Security Professionals who have many years in the field as skilled professionals. It's not that they know everything, it's because they've seen everything. Take care.

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  • zm88
    replied
    And Curtis is the rude one?

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  • ctx2
    replied
    Youre just rude and come off as one of those people who think they know everything. But, hey its water under the bridge. Take care.

    Leave a comment:


  • Curtis Baillie
    replied
    Originally posted by ctx2 View Post
    With all do respect; I have read a lot of your replies to other people and if I critiqued you on the wording used in most of your sentences you would be made out to be a BIG ol' bottle of ASSprin dropped into a rabbit HOLE. In my opinion we are all here to share stories. And ask advice. I myself was telling a story. I will however, be more precise when giving my opinion based on my training, ability and experience.
    All that because I commented on your "hands off" post? Really?

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  • ctx2
    replied
    With all do respect; I have read a lot of your replies to other people and if I critiqued you on the wording used in most of your sentences you would be made out to be a BIG ol' bottle of ASSprin dropped into a rabbit HOLE. In my opinion we are all here to share stories. And ask advice. I myself was telling a story. I will however, be more precise when giving my opinion based on my training, ability and experience.

    Leave a comment:


  • Curtis Baillie
    replied
    I commented on it because you included it in your post.

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  • ctx2
    replied
    Cutis, what i meant to say was: At my company we are not to initiate physical contact unless absolutely necessary. The point.of.my post wasnt.to debate hands.off/hands on. The point.of my post was to say i do not believe size matters. I apologize if i was not clear enough.

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  • PolarDeer
    replied
    Originally posted by ctx2 View Post
    Size definitely does not matter. I am five foot nothing on a good day and have brought down huge ORT guys (with help from.management) sceaving thousands of dollars worth of merch. My comlany is "hands off" use force only equal to what the actor is using and dont leave the sidewalk. It is all about how you carry yourself physically and professionally. IF **** does hit the fan and you find yourself "fighting" use enough force to protect yourself as not to injure the actor. I have had knives pulled and have found myself on the bottom of a 5 person pig pile. I figured i was safer on the floor as they all hit eachother thinking they were hitting me. I came out with a busted knee but it could have been worse. And since i didnt hit them, they got felony retail and assault charges. Size doesnt matter just do what your supposed to do and keep positive. Oh, and i am a female .
    A couple of the best retail security officers I know are a at about 5,5 feet or so, and one of them is also female, so I'd say that more important than the size is your "fighting spirit", ie. the ability to react in a tough spot and how you carry yourself.

    On the other hand, I'm 6,6 feet and 231 pounds, and I've definitely found the size somewhat helpful at work. In addition to apprehensions we're expected to intervene in case of disturbance (drunk/drugged up people doing whatever drunk/drugged up people usually do, mental cases, etc.) and more often than not I can manage both apprehensions and disturbances (in which case we throw them out, unless in a "crowd control" account where we are legally allowed to apprehend someone for breaching the peace if removal from the premises proves ineffective, for instance if the same guy returns two or three times on the premises) without having to resort to physical force.

    And if I've needed to use force, the size is something of an advantage unless the subject has a knife or something in which case I'd rather unload the can of pepper spray rather than play "Bas Rutten: Mall Edition". What I'm trying to say is that the size does come into account to a certain degree, but it's definitely not everything.

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  • Curtis Baillie
    replied
    Originally posted by ctx2 View Post
    Size definitely does not matter. I am five foot nothing on a good day and have brought down huge ORT guys (with help from.management) sceaving thousands of dollars worth of merch. My comlany is "hands off" use force only equal to what the actor is using and dont leave the sidewalk. It is all about how you carry yourself physically and professionally. IF **** does hit the fan and you find yourself "fighting" use enough force to protect yourself as not to injure the actor. I have had knives pulled and have found myself on the bottom of a 5 person pig pile. I figured i was safer on the floor as they all hit eachother thinking they were hitting me. I came out with a busted knee but it could have been worse. And since i didnt hit them, they got felony retail and assault charges. Size doesnt matter just do what your supposed to do and keep positive. Oh, and i am a female .
    "My comlany is "hands off" use force only equal to what the actor is using and dont leave the sidewalk" - If that is the case your company is not "hands off'."

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  • ctx2
    replied
    nope!

    Size definitely does not matter. I am five foot nothing on a good day and have brought down huge ORT guys (with help from.management) sceaving thousands of dollars worth of merch. My comlany is "hands off" use force only equal to what the actor is using and dont leave the sidewalk. It is all about how you carry yourself physically and professionally. IF **** does hit the fan and you find yourself "fighting" use enough force to protect yourself as not to injure the actor. I have had knives pulled and have found myself on the bottom of a 5 person pig pile. I figured i was safer on the floor as they all hit eachother thinking they were hitting me. I came out with a busted knee but it could have been worse. And since i didnt hit them, they got felony retail and assault charges. Size doesnt matter just do what your supposed to do and keep positive. Oh, and i am a female .

    Leave a comment:


  • Kawi
    replied
    Originally posted by Curtis Baillie View Post
    I recommend becoming a student of "verbal Judo".
    Awesome advice! ...I own several copies of the book and have been known to give away copies.

    In response to the OP's question, Does size matter?

    Someone once said, "Size matters not. Look at me. Judge me by my size, do you?" (Yes, I threw out a Yoda quote )

    I'm 5-06 and 160 lbs. By all means, not the most intimidating guy you'll come across. Self-confidence is everything. Practice your approach and responses to any resistance. As an LPM I constantly role-played with my team. They all though it was silly, but we had a pretty good amount of apprehensions with little to no force being used. You worry about the 1% that won't comply and that's understandable. Hopefully, your company has given you effective self-defense training if that's their expectation. I also have military, law enforcement and martial arts training that helps me deal with the very few that haven't complied.

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  • Pop pop
    replied
    Originally posted by Curtis Baillie View Post
    I recommend becoming a student of "verbal Judo".
    LOL, solid advice. Well Nick, when it comes to being a trooper or a Loss Prevention Officer, size never matters. It's your investigative savvy, skills knowledge and ability to make and close a case. The best never break a sweat, in most cases.

    Trust your training, use your skills, brains and technology. LP officer is a good and important gig in today's world.

    Some have a saying, pay the restitution or face the fullest extent of the law. Good luck!

    Leave a comment:


  • Nick_williams
    replied
    Curtis, we learn verbal deescalation techniques during certification and I have seen some agents use them pretty effectively. I think I will be able to do the same, its just those 1% of people that can't be reasoned with that I'm concerned about.

    I work for a big box retailer. Grocery, electronics, clothes, housewares, etc.

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  • capurato
    replied
    What kind of retailer? Remember, no merchandise is worth your, or someone else's life.

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  • Curtis Baillie
    replied
    I recommend becoming a student of "verbal Judo".

    Leave a comment:

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