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  • #16
    Originally posted by N. A. Corbier View Post
    I think its cultural, as well.

    Down in Florida, duty rigs are bought by individual guards. With some police departments as well, you bought your sidearm, ASP, and boots.

    Anyone know of a Tampa Bay agency that gives you a full duty rig with sidearm? Give as in, "You are not paying for this, nothing out of your check, etc."
    I agree! I had never heard of officers paying for their own uniforms until I entered the world of consulting and starting dealing with very small companies throughout the US. It seems to be particularly common here in Texas. A few thoughts on this issue, many reiterating other responses:

    1) Even if you can charge your officers for uniforms, it becomes a business issue relative to your ability to recruit and retain qualified officers that your clients (not necessarily you) find acceptable. As much as I hate to say it, however, If you can deduct it and still hire the right people, then I guess you should do it. It won't, however, elevate the reputation of your company. And your competitors will be very willing to advise your clients or prospective clients of the practice.

    2) As far as I am aware, even in the foreign country of California, If the officer signs a consent form, and the deduction per pay period does not bring his/her pay below the state mandated minimum wage, you can deduct for uniforms!
    Richard Dickinson
    Dickinson Security Management Group, LLC
    DSMG Provides a Variety of Software Products and Consulting Services to the Contract Security Industry
    www.hrdickinson.com

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    • #17
      Originally posted by N. A. Corbier View Post
      Anyone know of a Tampa Bay agency that gives you a full duty rig with sidearm? Give as in, "You are not paying for this, nothing out of your check, etc."
      If you are talking about LE, then yes. I have a friend that was employed by Tampa Police Department. He was issued everything from rain gear, to rechargable flashlights, boots and the Agency approved Glock. Other than that instance, no.
      " We are determined that before the sun sets on this terrible struggle, our flag will be recognized throughout the world as a symbol of freedom on one hand and of overwhelming force on the other" - General George C. Marshall

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      • #18
        What do you pay out for uniform & equipment?

        NRM oz, you stated you paid out approx $1500 to fully equip your senior staff.

        I hope that included a gun, vest , full leather, and the uniform. If not stop shopping at Gucci, and Prada.

        Seriously, if what you paid out was just for uniforms and not the associated gear, it seems overly expensive to me. I wore pretty good quality gear on the police force, but the price was less than $1500. Next time get them nice, but not luxury. For heaven's sake, if you've got that much extra money laying around, please send some my way.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by bpdblue View Post
          NRM oz, you stated you paid out approx $1500 to fully equip your senior staff.

          I hope that included a gun, vest , full leather, and the uniform. If not stop shopping at Gucci, and Prada.

          Seriously, if what you paid out was just for uniforms and not the associated gear, it seems overly expensive to me. I wore pretty good quality gear on the police force, but the price was less than $1500. Next time get them nice, but not luxury. For heaven's sake, if you've got that much extra money laying around, please send some my way.
          Actually the senior uniforms all came from the USA with the 5 pleats (like LAPD) as they kept their shape in summer heat here. Biggest outlay for all of them were the leather jackets with the cut away area for cuffs and firearms. Due to the small market these items were about $500 US each and did look smart (but for only 4 of them plus me) were severly restricted but the other teams got the nylon jackets, same cut and style.

          Due to very strict firearm laws here staff are not permitted to bring their personal firearms on duty UNLESS they are a sub contracted company (ie. I run an armoured truck but I use a scout vehicle from ABC Ltd which is a 1 man show). I know some yahooms would carry 410's and 870's and consider them side-arms.
          "Keep your friends close and your enemies even closer" Sun Tzu

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          • #20
            One thing's for sure - I wouldn't let "free uniforms/gear" be the deciding factor for what company you work for, by a long shot.
            "Every betrayal begins with trust." - Brian Jacques

            "I can't predict the future, but I know that it'll be very weird." - Anonymous

            "There is nothing new under the sun." - Ecclesiastes 1:9

            "History, with all its volumes vast, hath but one page." - Lord Byron

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            • #21
              As posted before - it is illegal here for companies to NOT provide a compulsory work uniform but if for example trousers are non stand or company preferred (ie. black dress style) then the company MAY subsidise them to the employee. ! company I worked for handed me the key to the unform room and asked me to help myself to whatever gear I needed when I was promoted - the wet weather gear is something I was given to keep which I still use now if out in the rain for long periods.
              "Keep your friends close and your enemies even closer" Sun Tzu

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              • #22
                My company deducts a $200 deposit from the first several checks. This is for 4 pants, 4 shirts, blazer if needed, bomber-style jacket or windbreaker, shield, patches, name tag, and lapel pins. Belts and boots/shoes are bought by the officer.
                That's a direct quote. Not word for word, but the gist of it.

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                • #23
                  No, it shouldn't be "the" decididing factor, but its certainly going to be "a" factor. If you don't make up the cost of the uniform in my pay I'm going to have to very carefully consider if I can afford to work for you.

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                  • #24
                    As it is illegal for them not to provide it, I would have serious questions about what other laws they may be breaking, and if I could trust them to be honest and trustworthy.
                    "Gun control, the theory that 110lb. women have the "right" to fistfight with 210lb. rapists. " Author Unknown

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                    • #25
                      I used to lecture to new recruits for 1 hour when my friend's training group had a meeting with me. I would drop in for a cheque, a meeting and for a lunch would give a short lecture of "the real security world". I would say it as it was - spend $100.00 - good belt, black trousers if not provided, cheap hiking boots (black), plain black baseball cap and cheap pilot's jacket for now. It only takes 1 wet, cold misterable night before you soon learn about wearing the right gear (ie. boots vs shoes) and water dripping down your face in a storm (even with wet weather gear).

                      Yes added costs before you earn an income is considered a factor and whilst some companies will ask you to purchase your OWN trousers for example through them (as a casual), most will cuts costs as much as possible to save $$ for profit.
                      "Keep your friends close and your enemies even closer" Sun Tzu

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                      • #26
                        The bottom line

                        The bottom line on this subject is if the security company is so rinky-dink, or so bad with its' money that it cannot afford to supply at least two sets of basic uniforms to its' employees, it probably is borderline profitable, and you should bewary of working there.

                        The shoes, and a standard pants belt should be provided by the employee. Any leather gear and equipment, are again, the company's responsibility. (A moderate deposit seems like reasonable middle ground on this subject.)

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                        • #27
                          I use to make my staff pay a uniform deposit, as my staff would be issued with $1000AUD worth of uniforms each. To start with I didn't but I had a rule there was no final pay until unforms were returned. Unfortunately some former staff would wait until their pay went in to their bank accounts then resign with no notice and never return the uniforms.

                          I've since had a document drawn up by my solicitor which all staff sign before commencing employment, in which they agree to hand all uniforms back in if resigning or being dismissed and if they don't they agree they are stealing these items and that they will be prosecutted by Police.

                          I've only had two that I have terminated fail to return them. Both of them now do not have a security licence anymore as they were both charged by my local police for stealing.

                          P.S. Don't your staff freeze in winter in those leather jackets? I use to wear one and froze all winter long.


                          Originally posted by NRM_Oz View Post
                          In NSW it is illegal for an employer to charge an employee for a compulsory uniform. Most security companies for full time - 2 days + 2 nights is 4 shirts and 2 trousers + jacket, coat and other uniform items. I have worked for some companies who will ask you to work further days and give you only 3 shirts and you work 6 days straight (casual employment is rife).

                          I made all my staff pay a uniform deposit of $250 US as some of the items were big dollars and much wanted by other company staff (leather jackets with cut-aways for guns / cuffs were $450 US so were issued to managers and senior staff ONLY). Boots / belts were personal choice as we caps (we supplied generic black ones for the staff to keep and personal kit was at the discretion of the staff involved.

                          Apart from a few ties being lost, most staff got their $250 US deposit back when they moved on or were moved on by me.
                          A well trained dog is worth 10 men!

                          I can recall my dog, but I can never recall a fired bullet!

                          Would you prefer me to use the dog, the Glock, the baton or the O.C. spray? It's your health insurance so you decide. Alternatively there is always the handcuffs, followed by the Police with the court house preceeding rapidly after. Now which service would you like me to utilise

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                          • #28
                            In Sydney it is not that cold in winter - but personally my 4 season coat I mentioned in another post was designed for all seasons and I never used the full liner as it got too hot to wear usually.

                            $1k (bloody dollar is sitting well at 93 cents US) is alot to fork out for even 10 crew and most K9 handlers have their "working blues" so just need a shirt and jacket to cover their requirements. I had 1 company stiff me the $25.00 they charged me for dry cleaning when I had it done for $7.00 for a coat. I resigned through Ops Mgr stupidity and claimed the $25.00 from head office as I produced a receipt and these jackets were $200 US each hence the dry cleaning costs. I was asked to come back after they sacked the Ops Mgr for dishonesty (did tell them) but passed when I waited 2 months for my $25.00 based on principle. I chased down some staff for uniforms and had a police report on 2 of them for non-return which meant they were now on record.
                            "Keep your friends close and your enemies even closer" Sun Tzu

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                            • #29
                              Yes, I know this is an older thread.


                              As far as a company who issued everything, when I worked for Coastal International Security on the SCANA contract I was issued everything but my boots, socks and drawers. Shirts, pants, jackets, belt, cuffs, Glock, baton, etc. Plus they had their own training people so you didn't have to pay to be trained (unlike most of what I have seen in TX).

                              They didn't take any money for anything.

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                              • #30
                                We use a lot of state of the art equipment and whatnot, and I don't have staff members pay a dime for any of it. However, it is expected that we will recover whatever is not turned in after employment.

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