Employee Parking

[Mall Director]

Sounds like something in my area of expertise..LOL!

Ok.. Mall parking of merchants, tenants, and employees..

I agree that for the most part, regulating parking into one specific area is not advisable, at all.. As we all have stated.

But what to do about safety? Well, here are some ideas:

1) Lot Lights. If you merchants get out later than the closing of the mall, or after sunset, set your lot lights to a later time. Send a memo out to the merhcants of this nature. You dont have to leave all of the lights on, just in a specific area, this will give them direction for safety.

2) If manpower is available, place an officer in the area during peak time, or after closing. Then you wont have to worry about escorting every single employee out, one at a time.

3) NO LOITERING: Private property laws in almost all of the states have no loitering laws. Essentially after 15 minutes, if you are still "stale", then it is time to leave. Take a patrol through the area as the sun sets. In darkness, it is unsafe for people to mallinger in the parking lot. Example: When it gets dark, our patrol car makes a loop or two, then stops every single car that has an occupant in it, that is just sitting. Then explain "Good evening Sir/Ma'am, I am with the _____ Security Department. The reason I am makling contact with you is that the Mall's regulations do not allow for people to remain in the parking lot for extended periods of time with out conducting business. For your safety, and the safety of others, I am going to have to ask you to either go inside and conduct your shopping or business, or to leave the parking lot. We appreciate your cooperation."

I do not care what any one tells you, there are very very few reasons as to why someone should be sitting in a parking lot after dark. You will get the ones who "are just waiting for my girlfriend to get off work to pick her up". Thats nice. "You need to go inside and wait outside the store in a lit area, or park over here (a safer more public spot) while you wait."

Round em up if necessary, put them all in one spot. Then prioritise that spot with additional patrols.

ID all your contacts. If thye refuse to be ID'd, then they can leave now! Refuse to leave, then be subject to arrest for trespassing.

4) Additional Vehicle lighting: When I was assigned to the current mall I am at now, the patrol vehicle had nothing but an overhead flashing light bar. For $50 out of my pocket, I decked out the car. Takedowns, Alleys, dual Spot lights. The patrol car now not only lights everything up we want, but displays an image that darkness will not hide the assailant. Then light up everyone sitting in the lot. Dont pull onto someone who has just entered their vehicle. Just make note of every car that has a person in it, then on the next patrol, light em up. Others notice this action, word gets around. Not to mention, when you do put out the light onto another occupied car, you solve 2 new issues. Vision of whats inside, and psychological cooperativeness. Its uncomfortable to be the center of attention, and people are alot quicker to cooperate as they dont want this kind of attention.

5) Real of Fake cameras: Real ones we all know about. Fake ones, well get the ones that have a light that illuminates to "indicate active". Post them in a very highly visable area.

Side note: If you can get a handy cam, and mount it to the dash of your patrol vehicle, it serves as severeal purposes. One: You can record vehicles for later viewing and identifying, Two: People who see a patrol car with a cam are less likely to act stupid.

Need more tips?

[Bill Warnock]

I did look at the original poster's ( SD Security) public profile before writing what is obvious to long time security people, if it was as storied as Bill Warnock's and Mr. Security's, I would have just continued on. I believe both of you at least, on this board, have earned respect, but sometimes the obvious is not to all.

I also believe each of us though, with different backgrounds can help each other and the up and comers and the few who do not join the forum but read it towards the better good of all physical and other types of security. (insert national anthem here)

Everyday I wake up is a good day, sounds like a country song doesn't it...

Eric:
Thank you for the complement. Many of us do try. I tend to be on the serious side. That is bred into the beast. Those who have received my security guide have commented favorably. I use that throughout my whole security career. Some of you have noticed there are many items that have been lifted from the pages of this forum. If we don't help each other the bad guy is sure to win. Remember always, we have to be atop of our game everytime we engage, the bad guy only once.
Thanks again.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[Mr. Security]

I did look at the original poster's ( SD Security) public profile before writing what is obvious to long time security people, if it was as storied as Bill Warnock's and Mr. Security's, I would have just continued on. I believe both of you at least, on this board, have earned respect, but sometimes the obvious is not to all.

I also believe each of us though, with different backgrounds can help each other and the up and comers and the few who do not join the forum but read it towards the better good of all physical and other types of security. (insert national anthem here)

Everyday I wake up is a good day, sounds like a country song doesn't it...

I agree wholeheartedly. No one knows it all and a fresh perspective is just what is needed at times to spot deficiencies in SOP.

[Eric]

I did look at the original poster's ( SD Security) public profile before writing what is obvious to long time security people, if it was as storied as Bill Warnock's and Mr. Security's, I would have just continued on. I believe both of you at least, on this board, have earned respect, but sometimes the obvious is not to all.

I also believe each of us though, with different backgrounds can help each other and the up and comers and the few who do not join the forum but read it towards the better good of all physical and other types of security. (insert national anthem here)

Everyday I wake up is a good day, sounds like a country song doesn't it...

[Mr. Security]

Eric:
Most of us have been in the security business for at least a day understand that it is not prudent to highlight potential targets. We had a hard sell for general and flag officers, senior civilians, judges (federal, state and county), mall directors and sundry folks who wanted to be recognized. It is a prestige thing. The only Army General who never parked in the general officer's parking area while I was assigned to AMC was MG George S. Patton, son of the famous General Patton. He never parked twice in the same place.
Vehicle license plates or vanity plates is another thing we in this business should have our clients avoid like the plague.
All of us were glad to help you.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

Just to add to Bill's comments, varying your route and time to work is also a prudent idea, especially for bank branch managers. If you have more than one vehicle, don't drive the same one to work every day. Monitor vehicles that are behind you to see if one or two are following you. Leave enough room in front of your vehicle to pull around the car in front of you at a red light. The list goes on, but as they say, "an once of prevention is worth a pound of cure."

[Bill Warnock]

Is this workable?
Employees of the Mall and individual stores who start work at or after 1500, or finish after 1830, are asked to park close to the store, near good lighting, along well travelled paths and in close available spaces. Others are asked to keep the X number of spaces / rows away from building entry points.

Is there an area under camera watch they could park?

Store owners should come onboard, as employee cars that are not as easily assessible, are not as easy to "relocate" products.

Employees should be able to understand getting customers in easier and any late departing employees concerns are being addressed.


I do not like the idea of signs directing staff of malls where to park.

Eric:
Most of us have been in the security business for at least a day understand that it is not prudent to highlight potential targets. We had a hard sell for general and flag officers, senior civilians, judges (federal, state and county), mall directors and sundry folks who wanted to be recognized. It is a prestige thing. The only Army General who never parked in the general officer's parking area while I was assigned to AMC was MG George S. Patton, son of the famous General Patton. He never parked twice in the same place.
Vehicle license plates or vanity plates is another thing we in this business should have our clients avoid like the plague.
All of us were glad to help you.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[Eric]

Is this workable?
Employees of the Mall and individual stores who start work at or after 1500, or finish after 1830, are asked to park close to the store, near good lighting, along well travelled paths and in close available spaces. Others are asked to keep the X number of spaces / rows away from building entry points.

Is there an area under camera watch they could park?

Store owners should come onboard, as employee cars that are not as easily assessible, are not as easy to "relocate" products.

Employees should be able to understand getting customers in easier and any late departing employees concerns are being addressed.


I do not like the idea of signs directing staff of malls where to park.

[Bill Warnock]

I'm not in mall security. I just feel parking all the employees in one place makes it easier to target them, among other things. Unless Bill, your list of questions was just to get me thinking, then thanks.

Mike:
There is a little of both. All of us can benefit from another's knowledge and esperience.
Hopefully the PM is of some assistance.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[Bill Warnock]

I'm not in mall security. I just feel parking all the employees in one place makes it easier to target them, among other things. Unless Bill, your list of questions was just to get me thinking, then thanks.

Mike:
There will be a PM to you as soon as I gets my wits about me.
Bill

[mike booth]

I'm not in mall security. I just feel parking all the employees in one place makes it easier to target them, among other things. Unless Bill, your list of questions was just to get me thinking, then thanks.

[Bill Warnock]

Bill, I think you meant to direct your questions and your generous offer to help to SD Security. ;-)

Mike:
No, young man; just you. When I write email that is just it, you the sender and I the receiver. You have to play it that way otherwise no one will trust you.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[mike booth]

Bill, I think you meant to direct your questions and your generous offer to help to SD Security. ;-)

[Bill Warnock]

Bill, not to take away from your usual long list of questions nobody has ever thought of but they should, but I need to be evil and point this out.

Do not offer escort services if your contract is for the protection of "property" only, or if your post orders say, "security guards assigned to this post shall not become involved in any situation, nor shall they confront anyone."

When you offer escort services, you have created a contractual obligation to the client that you will specifically protect people. If your post orders say that you are there to protect property only, you have invalidated them and exposed your employer (who will most likely fire you for it) to excessive liablity from "playing cop" or "protecting people."

If you do offer escort services, and the guard does nothing but call 911 when the person escorted is confronted by a criminal or otherwise harmed, you (the guard) and the company (through respondant superior) are liable for "failure to maintain standard of care," "failure to protect persons," and most likely criminal negligence since you offered "people protection" and failed to protect.

If your company believes you are an observe and report only security guard, then that's what you are. Don't ever take on more than that without written permission from your company, because they'll hang you out to dry for raising the standard of care to the client.

Nathan:
You are 100% correct. I did not consider the contractual aspects of what duties are owed and by whom for whom to whom. Mike may be in a lose-lose situation. I was just looking at the physical security aspects of this problem.
I always preach the "whole-part-whole" aspects of security and I forget what I preached.
Around here you can't just put up signs that state "park and shop and your own risk." Courts have found if you have a mall setting you are in effect establishing an attractive nuisance and vicarious liability rears its ugly head.
Warm regards,
Bill

[N. A. Corbier]

Mike Booth:
What are the answers to the following - the right light? In the right place? Illuminating at the right time sufficient given the location and the credible threat?
Have you made a study of any parking areas which you could call vulnerable to either shoppers or employees?
What is the condition of your lighting in the mall parking lot or lots?
What type of luminaries are used high pressure, low pressure sodium, halogen, or fluorescent?
What are the condition of lights, reflectors, lenses and fixture?
Describe the reflectance of lighted surfaces as indicated below:
What are the foot canldle fc power minimums in parking areas? Does provide protective lighting of at least 0.80fc in all areas?
Pedestrian entrances provide protective lighting of at least 2.00fc?
Building entrances provide protective lighting of at least 5.0 to 10.0fc?
Lobbies & hallways provide protective lighting of at least 10.0 to 20.0?
How big is your security force?
Have the mall employees park at any location in the parking lot and mix them up. Then offer escort service for both employees and patrons.
For obvious security reasons, please email me at [email protected] if you are confortable answering these questions.
There are some more detailed questions I would like to have answered but only in an email form.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

Bill, not to take away from your usual long list of questions nobody has ever thought of but they should, but I need to be evil and point this out.

Do not offer escort services if your contract is for the protection of "property" only, or if your post orders say, "security guards assigned to this post shall not become involved in any situation, nor shall they confront anyone."

When you offer escort services, you have created a contractual obligation to the client that you will specifically protect people. If your post orders say that you are there to protect property only, you have invalidated them and exposed your employer (who will most likely fire you for it) to excessive liablity from "playing cop" or "protecting people."

If you do offer escort services, and the guard does nothing but call 911 when the person escorted is confronted by a criminal or otherwise harmed, you (the guard) and the company (through respondant superior) are liable for "failure to maintain standard of care," "failure to protect persons," and most likely criminal negligence since you offered "people protection" and failed to protect.

If your company believes you are an observe and report only security guard, then that's what you are. Don't ever take on more than that without written permission from your company, because they'll hang you out to dry for raising the standard of care to the client.

[Bill Warnock]

Employee parking in a mall setting is a bad idea, in my humble opinion, on a lot of levels. One, if you are going to have a domestic/stalker situation at a mall, odds are it will be with an employee. Why put all the employees in one place? It just makes it easier for the stalker. Two, shoppers want to get as close to their exit as they can, but.... they just assume any cars parked up in the choice spots are other shoppers. If you move employees out of the choice spots, you are doing the shoppers a favor they don't even appreciate. Putting the employees near the building and near the exits in an open site is a proven plus on a lot of levels. Sounds to me like management is spinning their wheels because business is down. What about after hours, closing time, staff leaving alone, cash bags?

Mike Booth:
What are the answers to the following - the right light? In the right place? Illuminating at the right time sufficient given the location and the credible threat?
Have you made a study of any parking areas which you could call vulnerable to either shoppers or employees?
What is the condition of your lighting in the mall parking lot or lots?
What type of luminaries are used high pressure, low pressure sodium, halogen, or fluorescent?
What are the condition of lights, reflectors, lenses and fixture?
Describe the reflectance of lighted surfaces as indicated below:
What are the foot canldle fc power minimums in parking areas? Does provide protective lighting of at least 0.80fc in all areas?
Pedestrian entrances provide protective lighting of at least 2.00fc?
Building entrances provide protective lighting of at least 5.0 to 10.0fc?
Lobbies & hallways provide protective lighting of at least 10.0 to 20.0?
How big is your security force?
Have the mall employees park at any location in the parking lot and mix them up. Then offer escort service for both employees and patrons.
For obvious security reasons, please email me at [email protected] if you are confortable answering these questions.
There are some more detailed questions I would like to have answered but only in an email form.
Enjoy the day,
Bill