Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Fire Department Knox Boxes

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Fire Department Knox Boxes

    I have become aware of several incidents recently where a fire department "Knox Box" has been compromised by a burglar. I just published a security tip on my web site that addresses this topic: Security Vulnerabilities Created by Fire Department Key Boxes

    I would suggest that all security professionals who have facilities where these boxes are in use take a close look at how well they are secured.
    Michael A. Silva
    Silva Consultants

  • #2
    Good advice Michael. In the 1990s I encountered the same problem with the retailer I was working for. It happened at three stores. Our fix was easy - we went to keeping our stores open 24/7-365. Of course that had been in the business plan for awhile and consequentially fixed the problem.
    Retail Security Consultant / Expert Witness
    Co-Author - Effective Security Management 6th Edition

    Contributor to Retail Crime, Security and Loss Prevention: An Encyclopedic Reference

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Curtis Baillie View Post
      Good advice Michael. In the 1990s I encountered the same problem with the retailer I was working for. It happened at three stores. Our fix was easy - we went to keeping our stores open 24/7-365. Of course that had been in the business plan for awhile and consequentially fixed the problem.
      Under our francising agreement we are not allowed to have locks on our front doors. We used to lock the front door at night & have guests use the side one closer to the front desk but we were stopped.
      The new doors don't have locks.
      The Ritz Carlton (which is presently closed to be downsized & turned partially into condos) had an intercom/buzzer system on their front door. Again, not allowed in our case.

      We have 6 emergency key cards that can unlock even double locked room doors for use by the fire department. They are keot in a sealed envelope at the fire alarm panel behind the front desk, which is manned 24/7, 365. It is part of Security's duties to verfy that the envelope is sealed once a shift.
      Last edited by HotelSecurity; 03-02-2011, 10:49 AM.
      I enforce rules and regulations, not laws.
      Security Officers. The 1st First Responders.

      Comment


      • #4
        I was talking about a grocery company and all of the chains closed at night until we decided to stay open. We've discussed your hotel chain before and I can assure you there are members of that hotel chain who do lock their front doors at night. I was in one who does just the other week. Gotta love them points.
        Retail Security Consultant / Expert Witness
        Co-Author - Effective Security Management 6th Edition

        Contributor to Retail Crime, Security and Loss Prevention: An Encyclopedic Reference

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Curtis Baillie View Post
          I was talking about a grocery company and all of the chains closed at night until we decided to stay open. We've discussed your hotel chain before and I can assure you there are members of that hotel chain who do lock their front doors at night. I was in one who does just the other week. Gotta love them points.
          We used to lock ours until we were "caught" during an inspection.
          I enforce rules and regulations, not laws.
          Security Officers. The 1st First Responders.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by HotelSecurity View Post
            Under our francising agreement we are not allowed to have locks on our front doors. We used to lock the front door at night & have guests use the side one closer to the front desk but we were stopped.
            The new doors don't have locks.The Ritz Carlton (which is presently closed to be downsized & turned partially into condos) had an intercom/buzzer system on their front door. Again, not allowed in our case.

            We have 6 emergency key cards that can unlock even double locked room doors for use by the fire department. They are keot in a sealed envelope at the fire alarm panel behind the front desk, which is manned 24/7, 365. It is part of Security's duties to verfy that the envelope is sealed once a shift.
            Do you keep chain/cable/bike locks on hand for emergencies?
            "A good deed’s like pissing yourself in dark pants. Warm feeling but no one notices." - Jacob Taylor

            Comment


            • #7
              Belden Village Mall in Canton, OH has a knox box inside the mall per store. They are mounted on the wall outside the entrance
              "I am not a hero. I am a silent guardian, a watchful protector"

              Comment


              • #8
                In a larger government facility I'm working with, the box is located at a height that requires a latter to access and is recessed in concrete. In addition, notifications are sent through the security system to key security personnel when the box is opened for any reason.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by HotelSecurity View Post
                  We used to lock ours until we were "caught" during an inspection.
                  Most places I've stayed the doors are locked but your room key allows you in the front doors. Just got back from NYC and the Hyatt I stayed at does it. Luckily I wasn't too drunk and avoided walking into the doors. Took me a few seconds to figure out I had to use my card.

                  We have a similar problem when our emergency doors break and we can't chain them closed. We have to call for repair and call in extra staff to man the door until repairs are done.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by CanadaMall View Post
                    Most places I've stayed the doors are locked but your room key allows you in the front doors.
                    How does a person checking in at night who hasn't gotten a key yet, get in?
                    I enforce rules and regulations, not laws.
                    Security Officers. The 1st First Responders.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by HotelSecurity View Post
                      How does a person checking in at night who hasn't gotten a key yet, get in?
                      call the fire department?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by HotelSecurity View Post
                        How does a person checking in at night who hasn't gotten a key yet, get in?
                        I've stayed places where late arrivals (with reservations) buzzed the front desk over an intercom and identified themselves before being allowed in via an electric door lock. I imagine night-crawlers who didn't have reservations were probably out of luck - I never asked.

                        I'm a little puzzled about your city's fire regs, HS. There's a million ways to outfit entry doors so that they can be locked while still allowing egress in the event of a fire. Of course, if such a door had been improperly configured or whatever so as to prevent egress when you got inspected, then yes - the FD would smack you around. But the idea that hotels have to be sitting ducks with their doors unlocked at all times (for ENTRY) just doesn't make sense to me.

                        Must be a wonderful city for robbers. I'll see if we can ship you some of ours with a Google StreetView map to your hotel so they can earn a living plying their trade - even if mooching off the government is the national sport up there. (No, you're wrong. Hockey is number 2.)
                        Last edited by SecTrainer; 05-27-2011, 12:18 PM.
                        "Every betrayal begins with trust." - Brian Jacques

                        "I can't predict the future, but I know that it'll be very weird." - Anonymous

                        "There is nothing new under the sun." - Ecclesiastes 1:9

                        "History, with all its volumes vast, hath but one page." - Lord Byron

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by SecTrainer View Post
                          I've stayed places where late arrivals (with reservations) buzzed the front desk over an intercom and identified themselves before being allowed in via an electric door lock. I imagine night-crawlers who didn't have reservations were probably out of luck - I never asked.

                          I'm a little puzzled about your city's fire regs, HS. There's a million ways to outfit entry doors so that they can be locked while still allowing egress in the event of a fire. Of course, if such a door had been improperly configured or whatever so as to prevent egress when you got inspected, then yes - the FD would smack you around. But the idea that hotels have to be sitting ducks with their doors unlocked at all times (for ENTRY) just doesn't make sense to me.

                          Must be a wonderful city for robbers. I'll see if we can ship you some of ours with a Google StreetView map to your hotel so they can earn a living plying their trade - even if mooching off the government is the national sport up there. (No, you're wrong. Hockey is number 2.)
                          The Ritz Carlton (which is closed for downsizing - condos/hotel & the Marriott Courtyard (beside my hotel but closed & being turned into university housing) had the buzzer system you mention. It is not the Fire Department that prevents us from having locked doors. It's the chain we belong to that does not allow it. Remember hotels still have this pretend "we're friendly, crime doesn't exist" attitude. Another example is a lot of hotels don't want their Security staff dressing in "Police Type" uniforms. This & locks on the doors make the guests think the hotel is unsafe

                          ST - The Conservatives won a majority in last months election. The socalists are the opposition party so they can not stop any law the conservatives want to enact. So for the next 5 years there will be less government programs to "mooch" off of. Granted our conservatives are are pretty pink compared to yours but I think some of you guys think Attila the Hun was too liberal.
                          I enforce rules and regulations, not laws.
                          Security Officers. The 1st First Responders.

                          Comment

                          Leaderboard

                          Collapse
                          Working...
                          X