Dial-up over VOIP

[alarmme]

What experiences are alarm dealers having using standard dial-up digital communicators over digital phone services such Time Warner Cable, and inexpensive VOIP services such as Vontage and Magic Jack?

I was testing a Honeywell Vista-20P panel last week on a digital phone line that would not communicate with the central station receiver using Contact ID or the SIA format. It worked fine using the old Ademco 4 plus 2 slow format. I tried a GE Simon 3 panel , and it would not communicate with the central station receiver because the only options with the GE panel were Contact ID and SIA formats.

I realize with VOIP that there are may variables why dial-up panels may or may not communicate with a central station. I am looking for some feedback as to the kind of success that you are having using dial-up over VOIP in the
geographic areas where you install alarm systems.

IP communicators, GSM, and the Sparrow sytems are solutions to this problem, but all add additional installation and monthly costs to each installed system.

With 20 million additional phone customers projected by the VOIP industry to switch to VOIP in 2009, I feel that the alarm manufacturers should be more pro-active in providing a more compatable format for dial-up communicators, even if it is necessary to slow down transmission rate of the signal, such as the Ademco 4 plus 2 format.

[integrator97]

The cable companies typically, but not always, provide what is known as facilities based telephone service. This provides a more reliable service in relation to standards, than does a none facilities based service. Vonage, etc are typically non facilities based.

Usually facilities based service works fine with alarm systems, though there is no guarantee. We have Cox cable here, and they provide internet telephone which is facilities based, and we haven't had any problems.

A detailed explanation can be found here. http://security.honeywell.com/hsc/do..._VOIGHLT_D.pdf

Possibly over time they will provide built in communications for internet monitoring. Maybe have a module, so you can have a dialer or an internet communicator. But there will have to be a large enough market for both the manufacturers and the central stations to do their part.

[SecTrainer]

Integrator, do you happen to know if Vonage provides some sort of logic- or protocol-based alternative to facilities-based connections? This would probably be expressed as a "guaranteed grade of service" or some such thing that's implemented by prioritizing and guaranteeing delivery (retransmittal) of specific packets (by protocol flags, by source IP or some combination) on the network.

[integrator97]

Integrator, do you happen to know if Vonage provides some sort of logic- or protocol-based alternative to facilities-based connections? This would probably be expressed as a "guaranteed grade of service" or some such thing that's implemented by prioritizing and guaranteeing delivery (retransmittal) of specific packets (by protocol flags, by source IP or some combination) on the network.

Not that I'm aware of. I don't think it's something they care about.

A company call Vontronix offers a module for alarms to communicate over internet lines. It transmits to Vontronix, who retransmits to the central station. The module is available through distributors such as ADI, and then you have to have the service, which is sold through the dealer. Vontronix also offer VOIP like Vonage, for less.

We have customers who want to switch to VOIP to save money, and then we end up being the bad guys because they have to buy something and up their monthly monitoring. But what can you do?

[SecTrainer]

Thanks. Of course, I always advise clients who are enamored with the idea of "losing the phone bill" and going to VOIP for voice calls that they should keep at least one land line anyway, both for business continuity purposes (redundancy) and emergencies because land lines usually work even when the main power fails. I also advise them that they should set up a free or cheap dial-up ISP account and a computer (preferably a laptop) with a modem that can connect via 56K dial-up for access in case the high-speed ISP has a failure. 56K is usually enough bandwidth that you can continue to do simple website management chores (assuming your website is hosted or mirrored offsite), payment processing chores, email, etc. until high-speed access is restored.

Dial-up is also great when you have a local high-speed router failure, etc. or can't access the Net via high-speed for any other reason. More than once I've been very happy to have a land line and 56K modem for backup.

Oh, and another thing: I've been involved in situations involving extremely sensitive data operations where the only connection I would trust was a direct-dial computer-to-computer land line connection, which is still the most secure remote connection you can have.

In a couple of instances in the last year or so, I've added another layer of redundancy for clients via wireless cell phone data access, although the value is probably somewhat less than land line redundancy because cell towers go down in emergencies, get preempted, etc. - especially voice channels (data somewhat less so). Communications security involves (among other things) as many layers of redundancy as a particular client's risk profile dictates and can be accomplished quite cheaply. Given the need for such redundancy, I would think it possible to redirect many clients away from whatever small benefits they might think they gain from alarm-via-VOIP and all of those attendant problems. After all, the prime characteristic of an alarm/sensing system is reliability and cost must be secondary. If a client doesn't understand this fundamental principle, there's a different job that needs to be done or you have a sure setup for a client who will be angry and frustrated down the road.

[integrator97]

One more thing, make sure the VOIP modem is on a UPS, otherwise phones are down for sure. Just cause the power goes out, doesn't mean the internet does. It's usually just because of onsite equipment not having power.

[SecTrainer]

One more thing, make sure the VOIP modem is on a UPS, otherwise phones are down for sure. Just cause the power goes out, doesn't mean the internet does. It's usually just because of onsite equipment not having power.

Thanks for mentioning that, Integrator. Better yet, it should have access to the emergency generator circuit.

[integrator97]

Thanks for mentioning that, Integrator. Better yet, it should have access to the emergency generator circuit.

You're thinking in bigger terms than I was. Most of my VOIP customers are residential and small to medium businesses, which rarely have generators. And if the businesses do, it's usually for computer equipment, in my customers cases.

[SecTrainer]

You're thinking in bigger terms than I was. Most of my VOIP customers are residential and small to medium businesses, which rarely have generators. And if the businesses do, it's usually for computer equipment, in my customers cases.

I understand! I'm trying to get smaller operations and even residential owners to think in terms of generators, as well. There's very little doubt that we have a major, potentially catastrophic earthquake coming here in western Washington, and it's going to be almost criminally stupid for even small businesses and home owners not to be prepared for it since we have all known about this for a very long time. Not only that, but power outages from "normal" storms etc. are quite common anyway, so it's not like generators wouldn't serve a useful purpose other than just in the event of the earthquake. So in this area, at least, I think that no one in security and/or emergency management consulting has done his job unless he has addressed the generator issue (among others like emergency supplies).

[jimm1909]

You're thinking in bigger terms than I was. Most of my Voip customers are residential and small to medium businesses, which rarely have generators. And if the businesses do, it's usually for computer equipment, in my customers cases.

I am in the exact same boat. Glad I found this thread as it was very helpful and informational.

thanks guys

-jim