Interest in Armed Guard Service, article by Joel Griffin, 8/24

[D.A.D.]

I have a question for anyone out there that cares to provide me with their input. We have had a recent incident within our company that prompted executive management to place an armed guard in two of our facilities that are open to the public for a period of two weeks during normal business hours. All company employees were informed that security was being added and the name of the individual that prompted the steps to be taken, but (as a facility manager) I have received lots of questions in private conversations from our employees questioning their actual vulnerability and whether or not the placement of armed security at two building entrances was overkill or far less than sufficient.

In other words, even though employees were informed to some degree, some still felt vulnerable and doubtful as to the proper degree of security.

As this article discusses, there has been an uptick in interest in armed security, but not a lot of actual boots placed on the ground and some of the issues as to why.

My question is this - Has anyone had any experience with or have knowledge of any businesses making use of existing employees who are licensed to carry concealed weapons? Most companies that I am aware of have been very defensive when it comes to this issue and they have company policies that are (or were) put into place forbidding employees with Concealed Handgun Permits (CHP) from carrying handguns on company premises.

I am looking for any information or experience that anyone may on this topic because recent news stories have reported that there is a shift in employee training to that of encouraging (and even training) employees to fight back against an agressor if that is the best option they have available. These articles talk about throwing objects (books, office supplies, chairs, etc.) at an assailant with the intent of creating enough distraction to either allow them to escape or sudue the individual(s).

Those with the most time and resources to prepare for an active shooter event are those who normally occupy the facility. Aggressors who plan to wreak havoc at a workplace may plan for a few days, weeks, or months, but the workplace can plan and practice for such events like they would a fire drill, hazardous weather drill, or any other emergency procedures. So, it would seem, rather than having a sense of vulnerability, employees could maintain a sense of awareness and training to act appropriately in such a scenario.

Liability? As states move to improve their concealed carry laws, mutual exclusion from liability is becoming more prominent so neither the company nor the employee can hold the other liable for their actions. A concern within our company executive management in the event we just experienced was the liability involved if they did not place armed security at the building entrances. They were concerned that they might be held more liable if they did nothing, so they did something. Whether or not it was sufficient we will never know, neither will we know if it did indeed decrease liability.

I am not recommending employees with CHP's to be the primary source in events where armed security professionals are needed, but they can be/should be part of a corporate active shooter response plan. I think it is more beneficial to have employees on-site with up-to-date firearms credentials than an unprepared employee base armed with notebooks and staplers. Is there any data out there to back me up on this?

http://forums.securityinfowatch.com/report.php?p=136528

[jtwestern]

No company legal or insurance team would allow it.

[Squid]

No data for you, but I'm wondering if in areas where CCW is pretty easy to get(anywhere but most of CA, Chicago and NYC) I wonder if employees can't be CCW at work, with or without employers knowledge/permission.

I don't remember reading "thou shalt not carry weapons at work" in any non-security employment hire-packs I've signed. Maybe an oversight?

Obviously, it would depend on how much direct contact 'management' has with the employee in question.

Like other guy said, hard to imagine Ins. sighing off.

But what about stuff like jewelery stores?

[Pop pop]

No data for you, but I'm wondering if in areas where CCW is pretty easy to get(anywhere but most of CA, Chicago and NYC) I wonder if employees can't be CCW at work, with or without employers knowledge/permission.

I don't remember reading "thou shalt not carry weapons at work" in any non-security employment hire-packs I've signed. Maybe an oversight?

Obviously, it would depend on how much direct contact 'management' has with the employee in question.

Like other guy said, hard to imagine Ins. sighing off.

But what about stuff like jewelery stores?

States that allow and have CCW have requirements, not allowed on school grounds and or any business that has a sign posted "no CCW weapons" citizens just don't shop at any of those business, if they don't like it, as far as work goes?

I'll ask for you and find out from am old Master Sergeant buddy who lives in WI where they have such laws..

[Pop pop]

Ok, the states that allow CCW permits, it depends on company policy, if it's stated in the company hand book no weapons allowed then employees can not, if it's not? you can. A customer walking into any business that does not have a sign posted...

in a public place can as well. Check w/state, I am not a lawyer but offering friendly advice.

Pop pop

[abjohnson]

I actually have come across this situation before and it ended in a disaster. It seems krazy to hire in house personnel. We had a situation where a disgruntled employee was fired and made some threats. The company then just told their office manager, who was a male and had a firearms license to bring his gun to work. The employee came back to pick up his check and when he did the office manager had made a threat, while carrying the gun. He had no expiernece or reason to carry the gun. It was crazy. They got into a lawsuit and had to pay alot of money to get things right again.

we have alot of examples like this and they seem crazy, but they are true.






We are are always looking for a few good security franchisees, so if you are interested please let us know.

[sec-guy]

I have heard of cases in Florida where an officer could work undercover for a LIMITED time.
Normally working as a armed Security Officer in UNIFORM you can NOT use a CCW ..he would need a gun license ("G").
A security guard unarmed Class D licensee may only be out of his uniform for a short duration, which DOACS has ruled is about 3 days in length.
I would expect that officer would have work similar to an armed Private Investigator.

[Squid]

Now I'm remembering at my old graveyard gas station job at least one guy had a gun he keep under his jacket.

I'm pretty sure he didn't have any permits but that was decades ago and may have even been legal on "private property" for all I know.

But in general....what about other jobs were you don't have "corporate" on site? Or "Outside Sales", etc.