Security Professionals operating in fear (overcoming the lies of the industry)

[Anderson1976]

I was not quck to read your post quick to read your post, so as I have so far, shown oceans of respect to you
FYI: I would fear and worry about Baby Face Nelson, Prettty Boy Floyd robbing a bank if I were working as a bank guard in Topeka, Kansas. Respect? Zero respect.

i worked as a Convience Store clerk in Houston, Texas in the 1970's. I feared being robbed. Againg no resepect for
those who could have robbed me, and yes shot me, even if I had given all the money they have asked for

I would not walk into a Hell's Angels club for fear of having the crap kicked out of me. I have zero respect for them


Glad they don't give me a gun? How well do you really know me? You do not! I have a Large Capacity Fire Arm
Permit to carry. They don't give those out in Liberal Massachusetts like candy. I had training in the Navy as well
I am in a local gun club.

Your right I have never worked Armed Securiyt. And I have been asked to do so Want to know why?
I have zero trust for the Allied Bartons, and Guardsmark of the world. I had to do justified shooting
in the Bank of America of Phoenix on Central Avenue, and the robber was wounded, how do I know
the above will be on my side in a court of law? I do not

My farher served in the South Pacific in the Navy in World Was Two. He and a zillion other sailors feared about
going into the battle of battles and invade Japan. August 6, 1945 kind of ended all that And my dear departed Dad was honored with lot of metas of bravery in World War Two

I feared losing my job for Northrop Corporation when I was an Electronics Tester in the mid 1990's
Feared becaus of paying my mortgage, and three kids to feed. Guess what? They did close the plant
I feared and worried how i was going to care for my family. I was lucky enough I was working part time
for Pinkerton on weekends and went to full time


Scarecrow approcah to Security? I ask you again from a previous postinng. 0300 hours your sitting in the
gatehouse and a blue Chevy Malibu knocks over the traffic cones, flies by the gatehouse, and down to the garage
What would you do? Lock the door to the Gatehouse, and call the police. or run over to your car and zip down to the garage and inquire what he is doing. Fear? Yes I fear at this time of the morning I am not dealnng with some who can think with common sense

We have 160 acres of wood to patrol. Protected woods. Name the animal we probably have met him or her
There is a black racing snake probably 3 feet long. He does bite! He has come zipping across the railroad
tracks un annouced. Coyotes!! Gallons of them. So bad we have had to end patrols out in the woods
in day time. I was going on patrol Saturday morning at 0300 hours. Could hear them yelping
For fear of being their breakfast I did not do patrols, and yes the client knows this

Competene? My site and account has been through three transfers to different Contract Security Companies in 8 years. I have letters from Branch Managers of past have offered me jobs from Account Managers to Field Service Managers to come on back

Andeson I have from your first posting been respectful of you. i stood and said bravo to someone who has put all this intn one neat package I asked nothing more and nothing less. On this board we may all not agree with each other . Hotel Security and I get into peeing contests, but I show HS much respect

Finale> Anderson I and probably lots on this board want to hear from you. It would appear you have lots to offer
And as a site supervisor some of the comments I have heard from some of my fellow board members I have
used in Post Orders. Thank You

And check out the Off Topics. My subject on Best Family cars of 2012. We do laugh and joke with each other
I like Chevys and Curtis iikes Fords. I fear Fords because the damn cars break down all the time.

No hard feelings Cope, I pride myself on being respectful to people and dually respectful to my fellow officers as well, once i learn some of the styles in here maybe i wont' take things the wrong way. I think i was a little frustrated because i felt like you put me in this gung-ho shoot'em up category and that's not at all what i was saying. Anyways, it's all in good intentions but i still disagree about fear and Fords, i have a Grand Marquis and love the Fords, but i also have a Cutlass Supreme and it's a good runner too .

You do raise a good point on the gun issue as far as would you trust the higher court to have your back? I think about that alot myself. No matter what the circumstances are, if there is a shooting your gun is getting taken, you are going to the police station, and your life is not going to be comfortable for quite a while. Probably would hear a detective say "let's just say this, don't leave town for a while". Maybe i'm spoiled because i work for a more pro-active security company for the first time. At all my other jobs (not to beat the fear thing into the ground) the whole thing was that they were scared to death about everything. One time at an LP/physical security site at a previous company, i observed a lady pushing a shopping cart and she had her purse in it and walked away. When she did i saw a young couple come up to take the purse and i approached them and asked them if that was thier purse, and they said "no, i wasn't going to take it", and i asked them what they were doing then with thier hands on it, and the guy got really mad and left. Later he called the store i worked at and complained about me and when i brought this situation up to the store manager she said "yeah i know he called me and complained" and then went into this politically correct babble and how i really shouldn't say anything about it. This was very early in my security career and i remember how discouraged i was trying to do the right thing. I wasn't trying to arrest the guy for goodness sakes, i was only trying to do the right thing. The guy that hired me didn't know much about security, he was an office manager of this security company and sold spa's for a living before this job. Never wore a uniform or worked a post in his life, but one thing he said to me made alot of sense to this day....."If you go above and beyond the call of duty around here, it will probably just get you in trouble".

[copelandamuffy]

Thank You Anderson I go back to the old saying
"Outlaw guns, and only outlaws will have guns"


Anderson: You worked or were going to work in a bologna factory?

It might surprise some what goes on in food factories.
I worked with a Security Guard who worked in a processing plant for milk and chocolate milk
She will never drink chocolate milk again.
Please don't tell me what goes on in a bologna factory, or OMG sausauge factory

[Security_K9_Guy]

When you all have a chance give "The Gift of Fear" http://www.amazon.com/The-Gift-Fear-...s=gift+of+fear a read.

[Anderson1976]

Thank You Anderson I go back to the old saying
"Outlaw guns, and only outlaws will have guns"


Anderson: You worked or were going to work in a bologna factory?

It might surprise some what goes on in food factories.
I worked with a Security Guard who worked in a processing plant for milk and chocolate milk
She will never drink chocolate milk again.
Please don't tell me what goes on in a bologna factory, or OMG sausauge factory

No, the bologna factory post was an example of what happened when i took my first security job years ago at Securitas..that's where they tried to stick me. Read that post it's an interesting/funny in a warped way one. I think it's on the 'Security and it's stereotypes thread'. I work at various sites special detail including a bad apartment complex, special events, and the occasional firewatch (and i'm a private investigator on the side). I like the special detail jobs because they are much higher paying and the schedule flexibility is nice. I'm a second shift kind of guy, hate midnights and don't like to get up early. As you noticed first shift is the most desired by the general public and probably the least likely shift that you will work security at because of admin being present at sites where security is needed. Not saying they don't have first shift officers but the other shifts are needed much more. A couple other advantages/disadvantages about special detail... the good: an oppurtunity to work with off-duty police and get more knowledge at alot of the sites and you aren't stuck in one place. The bad: no set shedule, you get a frantic phone call "ok i need someone over at this place can you do it??" and being that you aren't stuck at one place you can't get a routine set which i like to do.

[copelandamuffy]

Anderson, but a small example of where I have worked

1. Bank non-armed Security Officer
2. Car dealerships
3. Laundromat on Cape Cod.
4. Construction Sites
5. FOX television
6. ABC’s Extreme Make Over TV show. 12 hour days, seven days
7. Foundry in Houston Texas
8. Manufacturing plant in Houston
9. Gulf Oil in Houston
10. Women clothing store. LP
11. Children’s Clothing Store. LP
12. Oil Tank Farm
13. Circuit City
14. Power Plants
15. Gated Community
16. Classical Music Concert on Cape Cod
17. Electrical Tape Factory
18. Ceramic Factory
19. Chocolate Factory
20. Factory that made fruit cocktail drinks
21. Women’s Health Clinic. Escort
22. Grocery Store LP
23. Trucking dock
24. General Motors Warehouse
25. Many construction sites
26. Foreclosed Bank owned homes
27. Colleges
28. Research facilities for medicine
29. Downtown office building in Boston
30. Insurance Office. My wife’s sister worked there, and would bring me coffee
31. Transport Visiting Nurse to some ruff tuff areas of Boston
and closed down factory
The worse?

1. Gated Communities. The Important people who believe they do not need a decal on their car to drive in and out past the gates, but everyone must have one. And God for bid if you do not make sure their car is snug and safe at night

2. Classical Music Concerts. “What part of no, you cannot park in this lot for the firework display?” “ Oh how nice you know the Mayor and you are going to speak to him about not allowing you to park here”

3. Insurance Office and downtown Office buildings. My sister-in-law was my Angel of Savings Grace. The rest where some real a** holes, except for the CFO and CEO, they took the time to say “Hello”

4. Foreclosed Bank Homes. “How the hell do I know why the bank foreclosed?”

The Best?

1. Women’s Health Clinics. The woman appreciated we were there as escorts

2. Laundromat. “Why am I here parked in front of a Laundromat at 0300 hours, closed for the night?” I guess they were worried about the Tide soap going lost

3. Car dealerships. Not in my time did a Toyota, Chrysler, or Volkswagen ever be rude or discourteous to me

4. Power Plants. You ran for 8 hours non-stop but I liked the work

5. 99% of factories are okay to work at

6. Construction sites are okay, But hour after hour of sitting in your car watching a building at 0300 hours. Thank God for Talk Radio to keep me awake

[Condo Guard]

The problems are twofold. The first is the gray area we work in; unarmed security tends to have no greater "powers" than a citizen, yet we are expected to deal with problems as the representative of the property owner.

I have had many situations where I've tried to calmly deal with the situation, the escalation ramps up, and I've had to make a decision quickly - keep going or make a tactical retreat and go home uninjured? As I've pointed out in other threads, over the years I've come to realize often times the "red cape" waving in front of the bull making him madder is just the presence of a uniform (me) - give 'em a little space and they'll do what you want and it all gets resolved.

I'm not talking about life and death stuff here - I protect life to the best of my ability without losing mine - because if I did, then you have another victim and I'm no help to anyone anymore - forever.

Finally, I have to give a thumbs up to the comment about the hypocrisy of clients. Just yesterday I got into it with a former resident who was breaking multiple rules (and is now going to sue me, get me fired, etc.), only to catch a board member an hour later breaking one of the big ones constantly discussed in the newsletter.

You can't win at this game - you just gotta use your head and not wind up in a hospital bed...

[psycosteve]

I think that a lot of the fear involved in security is the lack of what is truly expected out of you on a site. What the client wants and how the company wants you to do your job are sometimes complete polar opposites . We all face situations that stretch our training and bounds of what falls into common sense . I can remember one time where I was afraid of loosing my job when faced with a possible situation. The hotel /bar I worked at had a passed out female in one of the hallways at about 2am after the bar shut down . My fear was not for her safety but getting some kind of sexual assault charge . I basically got a witness before I even got close to her . With calling the overnight lady to over see every action I attempted to wake the female and ended up calling the EMS to take her to the hospital . For these actions I was praised by the security company by protecting myself and the company from liability . But what really happened was I chose my job over the life of a human being. Looking back at everything do I think I was a coward , not really but not knowing what to do except to cover my six which is all I was ever trained to do . The motto is if we ( the security company) do not train then we are not liable for anything they do . That right there is the reason for the fear right there a lack of available options to security other then to just wing it .

[Anderson1976]

I think that a lot of the fear involved in security is the lack of what is truly expected out of you on a site. What the client wants and how the company wants you to do your job are sometimes complete polar opposites . We all face situations that stretch our training and bounds of what falls into common sense . I can remember one time where I was afraid of loosing my job when faced with a possible situation. The hotel /bar I worked at had a passed out female in one of the hallways at about 2am after the bar shut down . My fear was not for her safety but getting some kind of sexual assault charge . I basically got a witness before I even got close to her . With calling the overnight lady to over see every action I attempted to wake the female and ended up calling the EMS to take her to the hospital . For these actions I was praised by the security company by protecting myself and the company from liability . But what really happened was I chose my job over the life of a human being. Looking back at everything do I think I was a coward , not really but not knowing what to do except to cover my six which is all I was ever trained to do . The motto is if we ( the security company) do not train then we are not liable for anything they do . That right there is the reason for the fear right there a lack of available options to security other then to just wing it .

I can see what you mean Steve. In security you have alot of people that expect different things from you as you said...the client, the security company, and sometimes law enforcement and general public. I started out working security in 2005 at Taco Bell as a side job on the weeknds for 8 hrs/wknd and i made 20 bucks an hour. Because at the time i was a juvenile corrections officer i looked down on security and thought "ah, anyone can do it, it's just security". I honestly didn't know a thing about security. Being that i was considered "sub-contracted" i could have had my butt sued and handed to me but by God's grace that didn't happen. I actually worked 4 years at this job total (before i even worked for a real security company in 09) and for 3 of the years i didn't have much of a clue but thoght i did. The fourth and final year i began to get serious and started doing research and learning the field, laws, etc. I'm still learning today because the industry is always changing. That was good common sense that you exercised. I hate to say it, but i've been punished more than once severely for doing the right thing, for doing something that 20 years ago would have been commended. So covering your butt is just the say to go in this politically correct, sue-happy liberal world we live in.

[TOII]

There are certainly security positions that are public safety in nature, shopping centers, and entertainment venues to name two. In fact, they are more about public safety than they are about security of property. Some jobs should be observe and report only, such as Copes, others can not be that way. There have been a number of lawsuits in this regard.

[Curtis Baillie]

There are certainly security positions that are public safety in nature, shopping centers, and entertainment venues to name two. In fact, they are more about public safety than they are about security of property. Some jobs should be observe and report only, such as Copes, others can not be that way. There have been a number of lawsuits in this regard.

Yes there have been, but they are difficult to win.