Fired from Hospital

[SecTrainer]

My last performace review was the best anyone in my department got in a staff of 30 officers. I was the golden boy of the department, the charge officer of a shift, led the department in overtime, and admired by my supervisor, manager, and director. The one who fired me was the COO of the entire hospital. He refused to listen to my immediate chain of command. The last write up I had was two years ago for something stupid. They couldn't hold that against me, because if you improve your conduct within a year, it should be thrown out.

As far as procedure, the guy was in the sally port and while I was questioning if he was a patient or visitor, the other employee swiped her card. there was nothing I could do EXCEPT grab the guy as he exited and using physical force is frowned upon. I guess the employer thought I should have told the other staff member not to swipe out because the patient was trying to escape. Fact is, I asked the patient if he was a patient and saw no wristband. Moreover he was wearing a security type shirt which threw me off.

Despite what happened, I feel I should have been SUSPENDED for this incident, not fired. The patient was returned without harm or incident by the police. The hospital thought worst case scenario and disciplined me based on the worst that could have happened as opposed to what really happened. That is unfair.

My first thought on reading the original post - and now especially on reading this further information - is that you apparently had sufficient reason to question the individual who was attempting to leave (even if it was just a suspicion), and that this should also have been sufficient reason to ask the other employee to stand by for a moment until you could get the situation in hand.

The "security shirt" thing puzzles me a bit. Presumably, you know what shirts your security folks wear, and you also know who they are, so I can't think why this person's shirt would add confusion to the situation.

I should relate to you a situation that I experienced: I had just started a consulting gig for a small psychiatric hospital on a Monday, and the very next day three teenagers escaped from their locked unit - which was the problem they had been experiencing. The kids ran across the back of the hospital grounds and jumped the chain-link fence where an interstate highway ran right behind the hospital. You can probably finish the story: When they tried to cross the highway, one of the kids was struck and killed.

This is probably why I have some understanding about why the hospital is taking this incident so seriously. The fact that the patient was recovered without a serious adverse consequence is really merely a matter of good fortune, and as such that happy outcome doesn't enter into the picture.

All that being said, I still can't say whether the termination was righteous or not. I'd have to hear what the other employee had to say, review the procedures for entering/leaving the unit, the hospital's written policies and procedures regarding disciplinary actions, etc. I'd also be interested to know what other staff members on the unit were doing at the time this happened, and even something about this patient's psychiatric history, previous behavior on the unit, etc. If he was a known flight risk, were proper supervision measures being taken? When people escape from locked units, there's rarely just one factor or just one individual who is responsible for this happening, and in fact every member of the unit staff has a responsibility in this regard.

It might be that after a thorough review of all the facts, I'd agree with you that a less-drastic disciplinary action should have been taken.

NOTE: "At-will" employment laws are widely misunderstood.

First, "at-will" does NOT mean that employers can do whatever they wish to do when it comes to terminations. Employers must still follow their own established policies and procedures when it comes to what are known as "employment actions".

Second, just because you're in an at-will state does not mean that every termination is an "at-will" termination. Even in at-will states, there are still terminations "for cause", which means that the employer has justified the termination on the basis of a claim of employee misconduct or poor performance. Your termination was not an at-will termination, but a termination "for cause".

People who are terminated "for cause", and who feel that they have been mistreated, can file a civil action for wrongful termination. It might not hurt for you to spend 15-30 minutes with an attorney who specializes in such cases to get an opinion on your legal position in this matter.

NOTE: Wrongful terminations mainly occur when (a) an employee is terminated "for cause", and (b) an employer fails to follow their own disciplinary policies and procedures, or when the employer has treated other similar situations less harshly in the past.

I would be interested to know, for instance, whether a psychiatric nurse would have been terminated under the same circumstances (let's say she's just coming on duty and this is a new patient with whom she isn't familiar, so she has similar doubts to your own).

I say this because psych nurses are hard to come by, and it wouldn't surprise me if that would factor into the hospital's actions as compared with their actions toward a security guard, who they might believe isn't nearly as hard to replace. My suspicion is that the nurse would not be terminated. A good attorney would be able to uncover such evidence of disparate treatment.

Incidentally, you don't mention whether this other employee works on the unit, whether they should have known this was a patient, whether they should have realized that you were dealing with this situation, or whether they too were terminated (since it was actually their card-swipe that permitted the patient to flee).

[sgtnewby]

the whole incident was caught on camera. It shows the patient waiting at the door and when I enter, he pushes past me to enter the sally port. When I speak to him, another employee follows him into the sally port and exits. He follows her. They said I should have prevented him from leaving, but it is the other employees' fault for actually letting him leave and why would the inpatient staff allow him to stand by an exit door and not monitor him? Again, I am a scapegoat. They said they fired me because the patient COULD have gotten hurt. Fact was he DID NOT and was returned to the unit by the police 30 minutes later.

I am SPFPA Union and inhouse security to the hospital. The hospital opened in August 2011, so I am relatively knew to their setup. In the old hospital I used to be at, the nurse's desk was right near the exit.

From your side of it it seems to be an inappropriate termination. I'm not sure that you should have even been suspended (perhaps that other employee should have been). Talk to the union, they should be able to help you out here.

I agree with TOII 100%. If everything you say is true, your union should be throwing an absolute $!-!t fit over this. Appeal, greivance, whatever, but I would get your union involved immediately.

[TOII]

Should have had a shop steward with you when you met with the COO if you had a meeting. Any time discipline may result you have a right to have a union rep present. If you get your job back, get involved in any meetings or courses on employment rights that you can. And KNOW your contract.

[johnrain38]

I had my unemployment hearing before an Administrative Law Judge and he ruled in my favor. For some reason, the Employer "no showed" my hearing which slanted the case in my favor. Now the employer is mad and wants the case re-opened.

[Nauticus]

One question I have is, what did you do once the patron got through the mantrap? Did you follow the person and/or talk with them to determine that they are allowed out, or did you simply continue your patrol as per usual?

[Curtis Baillie]

What state did this happen in? Your ex-employer may get another crack at an unemployment hearing.

[PlateStacker]

When a patient tries to escape, we cannot put our hands on him to detain, only try and talk him into returning. If he elopes, we call the police to bring him back.
rm.

Wow.. really? So what exactly separates you from the rest of the staff then? So the crazy patients are free to do whatever they like to all the staff and other patients until police finally arrive?

If part of your job is to either not let people leave or keep them from entering. THAT is what you need to be doing. This should of been a no brainier, simple and done in less than 2 minutes.

If it were me I would of:

1. Secure him and/or blocked the doorway.
2. Escorted him to get a wrist band or whatever ID is needed to be a patient at Hospital.
3. Escorted him to wherever he needed to be, or was allowed to be.
3. End of story.

[johnrain38]

What state did this happen in? Your ex-employer may get another crack at an unemployment hearing.

The employer wanted another hearing, but the day of the reopening, they said they were no longer contesting my right to unemployment benefits. Therefore, they admitted what I did was not "misconduct". Therefore, what I did was a mistake and to me, did not deserve termination. Now my issue is with my union because it's been three months and I've yet to hear if they intend to take this to arbitration.

[HotelSecurity]

In another thread today you posted that you texted to your sister that you felt lie committing suicide. Your parents called the police & you were taken to hospital for an evaluation.

Did your employer (a hospital) find out? Is this the actual reason you were let go?

[johnrain38]

In another thread today you posted that you texted to your sister that you felt lie committing suicide. Your parents called the police & you were taken to hospital for an evaluation.

Did your employer (a hospital) find out? Is this the actual reason you were let go?

No. I was unfairly fired from that very hospital April 12th. The employer is the reason I felt suicidal because they took away my livelihood in this terrible economy. On top of that, NYS Dept of Labor had denied me UI benefits.