Is more warranty on equipment better for end users?

[MetzLyov]

This is a topic that can go in so many different directions and discussions and is dependent on who the audiences are... I do not see any discussions about this topic in this forum, so I though it will be good idea to initiate a thread.

Here is the dilemma:

1. One side claims that more than one year warranty costs too much, therefore prefers lowest cost possible for a given hardware. One justification is based on an assumption that if such equipment lasts at least one year, it should last longer and why pay more for something that you can get them cheaper. Another states that the savings available will more than qualify a purchase of newer hardware every year or every other year. Yet another assumption states that lets reduce present exposure of costs at their minimal and take advantage of the saving in the future to change hardware to the latest technologies available at that time... and the list just goes on and on...

2. The other side of the spectrum differs on thinking process regarding warranty. One of their assumption is that lets invest now and reduce overall costs in the future. It will entail higher costs at the beginning, but in the long run they are way ahead of the game. Another opinion involves with commitments with a specific technologies that work well to their specific requirements, therefore it makes sense to stay with such hardware for a long haul. Yet another one states that it will be easier to budget for a hardware for period of three or five years, thus makes the numbers look great on the papers.

Both sides have legitimate concerns and reasoning of course. Both sides can justify their respective positions pertinent to their own assumptions or needs. One side justifies lower cost for less warranty and the other considers higher costs for products and longer term warrany.

There is no “ultimate” solution or any broadly accepted approach. Since every business requirements are different, there will never be “one fits all” solution. However...

I am a very strong proponent for 1st Tier manufacturers products for many reasons and of course, the warranty being one of them. Another major reason is the fact that most such manufacturers carry parts and support products up to (7) seven years from the introduction period of such hardware (some carry more and other less, but averages to seven years). Even though such manufacturers do not initiate bleeding edge technologies, which normally starts with much smaller and brighter companies, however they offer solid solutions at a reasonable prices. Sheer existence of such companies is based on price they can charge and reasonable profits they can sustain, thus such companies are there tomorrow to assist customers (at least this is the theory of corporate world).

Many offshore companies proved to be “fly by night” operators. We have seen too many of such companies making a quick splash, make some money and then they disappear leaving all their customers stranded. Some actually come back with different names and again make another splash and disappear as quickly as they enter into the market. Such companies are very easy to find and isolate if you are in the security industry, however their main targets are ordinary users who do not have basic knowledge on their purchases. They offer from one to five years warranties that look great on their marketing scheme, but at the end, consumers lose and get totally disoriented and stop trusting the security market.

Warranties available from major manufacturers are legitimate and could be used for basis of any purchase. Such companies have been around for a long time, thus their existence itself can qualify for a consideration. Yes, they charge much more than “fly by night” operators, but at least they are in position to resolve problems and provide essential services in respect to their products during and even after their respective warranty periods.

Most major security equipment manufacturers offer three years warranty on their products. What is very interesting also is how such companies comply with their warranties, as each have their own policies handling warranty based repairs. Some will cover costs of product and shipping costs both ways and others will cover the cost of the repairs only and leave the burden of shipping costs on the customers. There are few companies that actually offer (5) five years warranty and able to cover all the costs of product and transportation both ways. With so many major manufacturers and so many warranty policies, how can someone determine which option is the best for the price?

So, is the warranty option a legitimate approach in consideration of purchases of security hardware? Which is a better option - less warranty or more warranty? I am very curious what the members of this forum think.

[integrator97]

I look at the warranties, and other things being equal; performance, features, reputable company; I'm going with the 3 year warranty for my customers.

As a matter of fact, a customer of mine with 90+ locations, asked last week if we wanted to do video for them. They have Honeywell Rapideye LT7 40ips DVR's at several locations. I knew they had no PTZ's or integration, so I recommended he consider the Speco DVR's. I pointed out that for the same money or less, they have a 3 year warranty over 1 with Honeywell, and more features and higher frame rate. Speco's been around about 30 years. They also don't require software, though it's available. But you can use a browser.

He didn't want to have 2 systems, so elected to stay with the Honeywell, hich e will be selling them. But I think he's making an economic mistake, considering what they are using them for. I don't think they have much over a dozen units right now.

[Silva Consultants]

From a consultant's perspective, a longer warranty would be a consideration, but not a major one. I am much more concerned about a manufacturer's reputation and track record for after-the-sale support than I am just the length of the warranty. I would be very unlikely to specify an unknown/unproven product over an established product just because it had a longer warranty. Talk is cheap; a five-year or even a lifetime warranty means nothing if the manufacturer is no longer around to back it up.

Another consideration is how the manufacturer handles returns. Do they offer advance replacements, or must the customer send the product back to the factory and wait for it to be repaired? How long is the typical turnaround time for repairs?

Another major factor for me is the distribution channel. Very few of my clients buy their products direct - they almost always contract with a local systems integrator who sells them the product and installs it. While we always hope for a long-term relationship with the original systems integrator, I want my clients to have the option to switch integrators if this becomes necessary. To achieve this goal, I generally specify products that are distributed by three or more different systems integrators in any given market. This generally means using the products of the better known and more widely distributed manufacturers. I specifically avoid products that are exclusively distributed by only one integrator and products that are proprietary or private-labeled for the integrator.

The client also needs to understand that, in most cases, any warranty that may exist is on the equipment only and usually does not cover the integrator's time in identifying the problem and removing and reinstalling the defective part. For example, having a lifetime warranty on a $15 magnetic contact switch means very little in the overall scheme of things when the integrator may charge $150 or more to replace it.

With a few exceptions, most of today's security equipment becomes obsolete long before it ever wears out, so if it makes it through the first year, chances are good it is going to last for a long time. I have one client who is still using a 25 year old access control system that is still going strong.

[CameraMan]

It depends on the rep of the company (the kinds of components they use as well as the quality of the customer service- how likely is it to break and how much of a pain is it going to be to get that RMA), as well as what the terms of the warranty is.

I offer an add-on warranty, which

1) Is international (I get a lot of foreign business)
2) Covers accidental damage (if your zillion dollar DVR gets zorched or fries when the sprinkler system accidentally discharges, you're covered, and no manufacturer is gonna do that), and
3) Covers shipping.

I don't recommend it for cheaper product- come on, that camera is gonna be obsolete in two years anyway- and I don't recommend it for products that already come with a good warranty- that Axis camera you just bought doesn't need the service plan- but I do recommend it for most DVRs, as hard drive failures and other various electrical imps, devils, and gremlins are all covered.

[Bill Warnock]

As with all warranties for electronic equipment, electrical problems are not included in the warranty. It is for that reason I recommend to a client before any such equipment in contemplated or installed, an electrical survey need to be conducted.
Do not be led astray by the notion isolated grounded outlet is a panacea. In my experience, they are just as noisy and as cluttered than standard outlets; sometimes more so.
Think of a modern transformer based power conditioner.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[MetzLyov]

Great answers...

My take always has been more warranty years from known manufacturer, it is better. Warranty aside, what also is very important is how such manufacturer tackles warranty repairs - do they force customers to pay for shipping or absorb such costs as well...

All the majors warranty basically is the same except how they handle it... As an example, Bosch covers (3) years warranty and pays shipping costs both ways by shipping advanced replacement overnight - thus far the best warranty procedure in the market. In case of Mitsubishi, they offer (5) years warranty and suppose to cover shipping costs both way, but it is a hit and miss.. Some claim that their warranty does cover shipping costs, but in an actual practice, they back peddle. All the rest give you RMA and wait until you send the defective equipment back and then they repair or replace such equipment, unless such failure occurs during first 30 days... and even then, it is a serious problem. Notion that such companies stand behind their products is a great marketing ploy, but not everyone explain how they do it until you fall in their trap...

I see a trend recently that produces even better customer service than what manufacturer offers (besides Bosch at least). Some integrators started to offer the warranties directly bypassing manufacturer warranties, thus improving the rotation and the repairs necessary for warranty equipment. This is not an easy task by any means, as it requires indepth knowledge of such hardware, resources to substantiate such repairs and necessary parts. This also is possible if such manufacturers are willing to discount their systems to substantiate such a venture (most do not).

Considering the facts that most DVRs have the basic computer parts - hard drives, power supplies, etc., it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out how to repair most DVRs in the market. Besides proprietary capture cards, software, some special motherboards, most of the other components are common computer parts.

Here are items that I you should steer away at any cost...

1.Any proprietary software that requires software key each time you have to change the motherboard. Some of the manufactures believe that each time you change the motherboard that is out of warranty should entitle them a new software key, which will cost a lot. I guess they believe that they can pull Microsoft scheme.
2.Proprietary capture card that is manufactured only by one company. Most majors have their own capture cards, but some actually use prepackaged version of existing common capture cards with different firmware.
3.Run away from special cases that take only one type of motherboard not available in the market. Such cases have motherboard outputs that are available through machined metal cage.
4.Special motherboards that have unique output connectors that are only available from such manufacturers. This way they do limit where you can buy replacements. Such motherboards even come with special monitor connectors limiting someone's upgrade possibilities.
5.Not much anyone can do with embedded systems. Unless they are cheap enough to trash upon failure and replace with new.
6.Newer manufacturers with no recognizable brand names. These are the companies that give our industry the black eye – they come in and sell the products dirt cheap, make some money and leave the industry.
7.Watch the accuracy of the specs – not everything they state in spec sheets are accurate. Ordinary user will not know the difference, however it is our job to educate the end users. This is a very difficult task, as end user do not have time or willingness in most cases to understand facts.
8.Ask questions and participate in forums to observe what others say or think of a product before purchase. Price only should not be the determining factor on such decision. What you find in Costco at a cheap price should not constitute a purchase, just because you are buying it from Costco.
9.Research everything and if necessary, talk to the manufacturer. Compare their biased statements with what other state in the Internet. Find users of the same products and ask direct questions and you can ask users names from manufacturers for a point of reference.
10.Experience does count – it is better to spend more money to have a local support from a local dealer or integrator rather than take the manufacturers words. This way you can visit or talk to such dealer or integrator who hopefully can provide this essential service.

In the nutshell, more warranty is better only from reputable companies. What is even better option is to find a company that prolongs such warranties to preserve your investment in such hardware. The best ideas are always the simple ones – make sure that your system is not a closed loop solution, rather it is an open ended, so that you can upgrade your existing setup with less money in the future.