SEARs?

[CanISeeYourReciept]

I was a TPS for target, and hated it. I wanted to do undercover LP, and I was hired by SEARs a few days ago.

Now Ive heard that SEARs is a terrible LP company to work for, and there policies handicap LPs extremely, but my boss makes it sound like we can do whatever we feel like (ie chase people in parking lot, tackle in the store) as long as it is written up correctly in the report.

So what do you guys think? What is SEARS like to work for in real world terms?

[N. A. Corbier]

I was a TPS for target, and hated it. I wanted to do undercover LP, and I was hired by SEARs a few days ago.

Now Ive heard that SEARs is a terrible LP company to work for, and there policies handicap LPs extremely, but my boss makes it sound like we can do whatever we feel like (ie chase people in parking lot, tackle in the store) as long as it is written up correctly in the report.

So what do you guys think? What is SEARS like to work for in real world terms?

First off, your store's loss prevention policies do not override the law of the state you work in. Which state do you work in?

Second, define "written up correctly in the report?" Is this "creative report writing," per chance? Creative report writing is falsifying documents, and may actually be a crime in your state. Most of the time, though, it is not since you are not a police officer and are not making a sworn statement on your report.

[histfan71]

[QUOTE=CanISeeYourReciept]I was a TPS for target, and hated it.QUOTE]

Why didn't you like Target?

[N. A. Corbier]

[QUOTE=CanISeeYourReciept]I was a TPS for target, and hated it.QUOTE]

Why didn't you like Target?

I could see why someone could dislike being a Target TPS (Target Protection Specialist). Its the uniformed position at the door that is pure deterrance. They don't /move/ without the APS' permission.

[Sierra 1]

CanISeeYourReceipt-

Sears has a very restrictive policy. This is due to lawsuits and injuries sustained by LPs in the past. The policy is one of the most restrictive within the industry. If you have not already been advised by your LPM, I will PM you the policy/6 steps.

[Mr. Security]

.....
Second, define "written up correctly in the report?" Is this "creative report writing," per chance? Creative report writing is falsifying documents, and may actually be a crime in your state. Most of the time, though, it is not since you are not a police officer and are not making a sworn statement on your report.

NA makes a valid point. Even though you may not be making a sworn statement, you will be if the case goes to court and you are a witness. Perjury is a serious felony. If you tell the truth and the arrest is ruled unlawful, criminal and/or civil action may follow.

[CanISeeYourReciept]

I hated having to stand in one spot for 8 hours at a time. Plus my target was exremely restrictive. And yea i would like to hear the "six" steps. I was only aware of 5.

[histfan71]

I hated having to stand in one spot for 8 hours at a time. Plus my target was exremely restrictive. And yea i would like to hear the "six" steps. I was only aware of 5.

OK, I see your point. Standing in one stop would drive me crazy too. Why couldn't you upgrade to a Loss Prevention slot?

[N. A. Corbier]

I hated having to stand in one spot for 8 hours at a time. Plus my target was exremely restrictive. And yea i would like to hear the "six" steps. I was only aware of 5.

I've heard 5, 6, and even SEVEN steps.

It depends on your school of thought and prevailing law.

[BoxerGuard]

So what do you guys think? What is SEARS like to work for in real world terms?

A big joke. I have been in LP for almost a year. I punch someone in the face at the very least once a week. I kick butt and get stuff done. Down the street LP can't even touch shoplifters, take down a description of the suspects/vehicle and direction of travel. :rolleyes:

My safety comes above all company policy. If I feel that I need to hit or slam some punk then I do. I have never been disciplined for this, and my boss is well aware of what I do. Call it extreme, call it wrong that is your opinion...but it works.

[jimmyhat]

A big joke. I have been in LP for almost a year. I punch someone in the face at the very least once a week. I kick butt and get stuff done. Down the street LP can't even touch shoplifters, take down a description of the suspects/vehicle and direction of travel. :rolleyes:

My safety comes above all company policy. If I feel that I need to hit or slam some punk then I do. I have never been disciplined for this, and my boss is well aware of what I do. Call it extreme, call it wrong that is your opinion...but it works.
Punching and slamming people seems to be a common theme in your posts, Boxer. What area are you from? I'd LOVE to come shopping at your store, I need a new front porch on my house. For that matter, I could use a new house!

No wonder we struggle to get people to take our profession seriously. Boxer, keep in mind you may wanna grow-up and be a real protection professional someday, and written comments like those could creep their way into your personnel file. Think, man, think!!!

[davis002]

A big joke. I have been in LP for almost a year. I punch someone in the face at the very least once a week. I kick butt and get stuff done. Down the street LP can't even touch shoplifters, take down a description of the suspects/vehicle and direction of travel. :rolleyes:

My safety comes above all company policy. If I feel that I need to hit or slam some punk then I do. I have never been disciplined for this, and my boss is well aware of what I do. Call it extreme, call it wrong that is your opinion...but it works.

Punching someone in the face? That's Assault no matter what state you live in... not my opinion, but fact.

[The_Mayor]

I have been in LP for almost a year. I punch someone in the face at the very least once a week. I kick butt and get stuff done.
My safety comes above all company policy. If I feel that I need to hit or slam some punk then I do. I have never been disciplined for this, and my boss is well aware of what I do. Call it extreme, call it wrong that is your opinion...but it works.

I am not going to jump to conclusions. I would need to be there first hand to witness you, hear your side of the story, shoplifter's side :rolleyes: , any witnesse's side(s).

Therefore, I trust your discretion and I am sure that you do a fine job. :)

[Bill Warnock]

A big joke. I have been in LP for almost a year. I punch someone in the face at the very least once a week. I kick butt and get stuff done. Down the street LP can't even touch shoplifters, take down a description of the suspects/vehicle and direction of travel. :rolleyes:

My safety comes above all company policy. If I feel that I need to hit or slam some punk then I do. I have never been disciplined for this, and my boss is well aware of what I do. Call it extreme, call it wrong that is your opinion...but it works.
BoxerGuard, it is not whether or not your measures are extreme rather are they good for the security industry. Just in public policing, muscle bound misfits were weeded out of police work.
You have two effective muscles, your brain and your tongue. It goes much further to create reasonableness, fairness and a good public image.
You are extremely fortunate not to have been cited for assault and battery.
A boorish security person tarnishes the image most of us have worked many years to improve and be called professionals.
I might add, security thugs are worse than common street thugs. The street thug does not seek legitimacy, the security thug does.
You sir, give a curmudgeon a bad name.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[histfan71]

A big joke. I have been in LP for almost a year. I punch someone in the face at the very least once a week. I kick butt and get stuff done. Down the street LP can't even touch shoplifters, take down a description of the suspects/vehicle and direction of travel. :rolleyes:

My safety comes above all company policy. If I feel that I need to hit or slam some punk then I do. I have never been disciplined for this, and my boss is well aware of what I do. Call it extreme, call it wrong that is your opinion...but it works.

BoxerGuard's attitude and behavior is typical of most security guards in the US today. You wonder why no one takes the security industry (I just cannot bring myself to call the security industry a profession) or security guards seriously?

[N. A. Corbier]

I'd have to say that the assumed mentality that folks believe BoxerGuard (I'm in politically correct mode, fear.) has is a minority in the field, as a whole.

Most of the guards are too afraid to defend themselves due to having "YOU WILL GO TO JAIL, LOSE YOUR HOME, AND WE WILL FIRE YOU" drummed into their head from 1970s video tapes, instructors, managers, and supervisors.

[Mr. Security]

A big joke. I have been in LP for almost a year. I punch someone in the face at the very least once a week. I kick butt and...

How long have you been doing this? Even LE can't just punch someone in the face before using other compliance tactics on individuals resisting arrest.

[N. A. Corbier]

How long have you been doing this? Even LE can't just punch someone in the face before using other compliance tactics on individuals resisting arrest.

Depends on the state. A closed fist strike to the body would be reasonable in some circumstances. I know, because the Kenosha Police Department "gets away" with closed fist control strikes all the time. Verbal, Taser, Punches, Baton, Gun.

[Bill Warnock]

"Most"

That word is driving me crazy. We, as protection professionals, cannot accept the logic that "most" of us are F'd up. Most of us are not (F'd up.) "Most" of us are hard working, eager to learn, and ready to pop-smoke/move-out/and draw-fire when fit-hits-the-shan, so that the good people we protect can seek shelter against the storm under our umbrella.

A damn fine leader of mine used to always say, "we can't make the world great, until we become great ourselves." That's a cryptic piece of logic, on a global scale, that I will never fully understand. But, as I get older, those words become clearer pieces of a huge puzzle that I'm starting to recognize as part of the big picture.

Most of us not bad. Most of us are struggling through a long day with sh*t pay for a sh*t boss that doesn't give a sh*t about us. That doesn't make us bad, it makes us resilient. Some folks become bitter, and take their frustrations out on the public, like Boxer. But, he's probably young and naieve, not accustomed do the real world yet.

Boxing. The toughest sport known to man. Entering a ring not only facing your own fears, but staring into the eyes of another who has given up any sort of normal life in order to train every minute of every day, using every bit of concentration and discipline he/she can muster to win at all costs. Don't confuse that admirable killer-instinct with the supposed "beat-down" talents of our colleague, Mr BoxerGuard. Real fighters never openly discuss their tactics.
On behalf of all of us, thank you.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[Mr. Security]

Depends on the state. A closed fist strike to the body would be reasonable in some circumstances. I know, because the Kenosha Police Department "gets away" with closed fist control strikes all the time. Verbal, Taser, Punches, Baton, Gun.

I said FACE, not body.

[Mr. Security]

Jimmyhat: Are you sure you weren't in the NAVY?

[N. A. Corbier]

I said FACE, not body.
Face is on the body.

BTW, the face is not an effective striking point, in most cases, unless your looking to distract.

Two words. Boxer's Fractures.

[histfan71]

"Most"

That word is driving me crazy. We, as protection professionals, cannot accept the logic that "most" of us are F'd up. Most of us are not (F'd up.) "Most" of us are hard working, eager to learn, and ready to pop-smoke/move-out/and draw-fire when fit-hits-the-shan, so that the good people we protect can seek shelter against the storm under our umbrella.

Jimmyhat,

I concede that there are a few INDIVIDUALS in the security industry who are just as you described above. And I thank my lucky stars every day that such individuals exist because it is those few, those happy few, those band of brothers (OK, enough Shakespeare) that are going to lift the security industry out of the depths it is currently in. However, I stand by my statement that most security guards are F'd up. My judgement comes from a total of 18 years in the security industry. The industry as a whole is F'd up, even with us few true professionals within the industry.

[histfan71]

Depends on the state. A closed fist strike to the body would be reasonable in some circumstances. I know, because the Kenosha Police Department "gets away" with closed fist control strikes all the time. Verbal, Taser, Punches, Baton, Gun.

In California strikes with Personal Body Weapons (hands, fists, knees, elbows, etc.) are allowed. They fall under the "Injuring Force" category on the Use of Force Continuum.

As an Arrest and Control Tactics instructor, I only teach my students to do distraction strikes with their hands. I tell them that using your hands to strike with full force is not a good idea because of the potential damage they can do to their hands and/or fingers which could interfere with drawing and firing their handgun if the struggle escalates to a deadly force situation.

[The_Mayor]

BoxerGuard,
It seems that many officers here are having a hard time understanding you. For all I know the people you hit have threatened you, combatively resisted, could be armed...etc..theres just a myrid of reasons why your practices may be justified. AND I HAVE NOT HEARD THESE REASONS, so I will not judge you as so many here have. It irks me that without having this knowledge (your reasons) some officers here have posted some insulting onslaghts aimed at you- calling you "ignorant" .

That strikes me as ignorant and unfair.
If your still out there, please come back and tell us why you feel that your safety is so compromised that you need to strike the offenders.

Thank you, for sharing your experience with us. :)

[Mr. Security]

Face is on the body.

BTW, the face is not an effective striking point, in most cases, unless your looking to distract.

Two words. Boxer's Fractures.

Then why did you say "depends" regarding my point which only referred to the face?

[N. A. Corbier]

Then why did you say "depends" regarding my point which only referred to the face?

Because some states are insane.

[Mr. Security]

Because some states are insane.

OK, sure. :rolleyes:

[ozsecuritychic]

does anyone here know about the david hookes case.for those that dont know david was a cricket personality who was at a melbourne pub and for some reason the security wanted him out and at some point he was punched in the face causing him to fall backwards and hit his head on the ground .he was prounounced brain dead and life support was turned off.that guard that hit him almost went to jail over that.my point is it might be a simple punch to the head but what happens after that is why i learnt different ways to defend myself other than boxing.but each to their own i suppose

[1stWatch]

Boxing is a great way to train, but after seeing what happens out there, you should abandon that idea altogether. You may be legally in the right in some circumstances for using such tactics; however, it will only take one encounter with someone who can beat the living hell out of you to make a believer in other tactics. Those people are usually not who you think they are. It is also rather disturbing to find out the person you just handcuffed has advanced AIDS. I have encountered both of those scenarios before.