Armed, or unarmed?

[3rd_shift]

I do both.
Unarmed during the week and armed on some weekends just to help get some overtime, err, ahem.... to help out. :D

[N. A. Corbier]

I do both.
Unarmed during the week and armed on some weekends just to help get some overtime, err, ahem.... to help out. :D

I have done armed with a pistol, and armed with everything BUT a pistol. I have never, and I will never, work without tools, as it generally means the company is too afraid of the liablity that you create by doing anything but running away, and not afraid enough of vicarious liablity of NOT doing something.

[Contact]

Armed 100% of the time.

[Watchdog]

I just took the test for being an armed officer and am waiting it to be processed. I should be put on armed duty soon after that.

Most people ask, "What is the purpose of an UNarmed security officer?"

While we as security officers know that we are merley just deterrents from people thinking of stealing or damaging the property we are watching, I have to agree that if a person really wants to steal soemthing and do damage and is armed and all I can do is run and hide call the police then I'm not much of security, am I?

[Echos13]

The job demands being armed, with good reason. I just got my semi-auto certification and can now carry ether revolver or semi-auto. Since Florida now allows you to have no more than two firearms on your person I carry my 9mm for a primary and my revolver on my ankle.

Persoanlly I find my revolver more of an edge than the 9mm. But then thier are some pretty decent ammo out there for nines now. I have shotgun traning as well but most of our clients at the moment feels that's "over kill" in high or low profile details.

There have been a few firefights in Florida people do not hear about concerning armed security. Though most of them have been cleared by the state as justified the police tend to keep these things press free and down play a lot of them to the public.

Whats that old saying. Better to be judged a living testimate to defending your self than a dead stastitic to politics and passifists.

[N. A. Corbier]

The job demands being armed, with good reason. I just got my semi-auto certification and can now carry ether revolver or semi-auto. Since Florida now allows you to have no more than two firearms on your person I carry my 9mm for a primary and my revolver on my ankle.

Persoanlly I find my revolver more of an edge than the 9mm. But then thier are some pretty decent ammo out there for nines now. I have shotgun traning as well but most of our clients at the moment feels that's "over kill" in high or low profile details.

There have been a few firefights in Florida people do not hear about concerning armed security. Though most of them have been cleared by the state as justified the police tend to keep these things press free and down play a lot of them to the public.

Whats that old saying. Better to be judged a living testimate to defending your self than a dead stastitic to politics and passifists.


I'm going to warn you right now, if you are ever inspected by Division of Licensing, your G will be immediately revoked, and you will be arrested for carrying a concealed weapon. Wearing a backup gun is illegal in your state. Remember, your concealment is only authorized by management for specific temporary duty, not in excess of three days.

The authorizing of two guns is to provide allows a security officer to carry their pistol, and their shotgun or other rifle. Only LEOs and PIs are authorized to carry a concealled weapon during the regular course of their duties.

If you are ever involved in a shoot, and they find your backup weapon, you may be charged for the conealled carry, and it will hurt your civil and criminal cases - the "killer mindset" attack comes into play.

You may contact the Department of Ag. and Consumer Services - Division of Licensing - Enforcement Division for clarification. Ed would be happy to rip someone's head off and scream Florida Administrative Code down their neck till they die.

[N. A. Corbier]

I just took the test for being an armed officer and am waiting it to be processed. I should be put on armed duty soon after that.

Most people ask, "What is the purpose of an UNarmed security officer?"

While we as security officers know that we are merley just deterrents from people thinking of stealing or damaging the property we are watching, I have to agree that if a person really wants to steal soemthing and do damage and is armed and all I can do is run and hide call the police then I'm not much of security, am I?

The state of Florida, and state of California specifically state the purpose of all security officers: To protect the property of the client they are assigned to, to observe and report criminal activity to their employer, and to summon police if practical.

California provides that if you are on a post, without a phone, you are not required to summon law enforcement, or take any action against a law violator, as your purpose is to document the law violation and allow law enforcement to investigate it. If your client provides, you may make an arrest, as well.

Florida does not have a statutory authorization to arrest, and relies on common law detention of felony activity, or the various statutes allowing shopkeepers, retail establishment, and hotel agents to detain.

Our CLIENTS expect us there to enforce their rules and protect their property and lives from criminal interference. The STATE expects us to observe and report criminal activity to law enforcement - with Florida specifically stating that only the Police are to engage in crime prevention - security guards are to protect the physical/real property of their clients.

Which I never understood, since you can never use deadly force to protect property, so why are they handing out open carry permits? :)

[Echos13]

I'm going to warn you right now, if you are ever inspected by Division of Licensing, your G will be immediately revoked, and you will be arrested for carrying a concealed weapon. Wearing a backup gun is illegal in your state. Remember, your concealment is only authorized by management for specific temporary duty, not in excess of three days.

The authorizing of two guns is to provide allows a security officer to carry their pistol, and their shotgun or other rifle. Only LEOs and PIs are authorized to carry a concealled weapon during the regular course of their duties.

If you are ever involved in a shoot, and they find your backup weapon, you may be charged for the conealled carry, and it will hurt your civil and criminal cases - the "killer mindset" attack comes into play.

You may contact the Department of Ag. and Consumer Services - Division of Licensing - Enforcement Division for clarification. Ed would be happy to rip someone's head off and scream Florida Administrative Code down their neck till they die.

I pretty much recognize all that you have said for truth and with respect. But you know that perhaps some of the armed guards (even unarmed) out there do the same thing and would rather worry about being able to face consequences rather than be a statistic. You probably know the assaults on guards in Florida have tripled in the last few years. Many with the use of a weapon of some kind and the guard being the statistic at best. But your concern for legal repercussions is founded. But it seems that many across the country use one form of security blanket or another. I know, the status quo in this matter should not be the standard. But it's happening out there not with malice or with the over kill mentality.

We all at my company are most of the time concealed due to the clients request (low profile). Most details last four days -yes, pushing it but a man's got to eat- at best sometimes seperated by a day or so of laxed activity. We all have long gun certification. But so far the job only states in exteme situations are we allowed to have shotguns in ready view (or availible to access) upon demand. So there are some of us who carry a little something extra. Yes, it's a no, no in the eyes of the state and so on. But most of us being former street enforcers have a hard time breaking old habits that have saved out asses many times.

One thing does bother me at best. We are limited to what we can utilize as the working man, or women. But in the civil sector the citizen with a Florida concealed weapon/firearm permit can pretty much carry what ever they want with very little training.

[N. A. Corbier]

I pretty much recognize all that you have said for truth and with respect. But you know that perhaps some of the armed guards (even unarmed) out there do the same thing and would rather worry about being able to face consequences rather than be a statistic. You probably know the assaults on guards in Florida have tripled in the last few years. Many with the use of a weapon of some kind and the guard being the statistic at best. But your concern for legal repercussions is founded. But it seems that many across the country use one form of security blanket or another. I know, the status quo in this matter should not be the standard. But it's happening out there not with malice or with the over kill mentality.

We all at my company are most of the time concealed due to the clients request (low profile). Most details last four days -yes, pushing it but a man's got to eat- at best sometimes seperated by a day or so of laxed activity. We all have long gun certification. But so far the job only states in exteme situations are we allowed to have shotguns in ready view (or availible to access) upon demand. So there are some of us who carry a little something extra. Yes, it's a no, no in the eyes of the state and so on. But most of us being former street enforcers have a hard time breaking old habits that have saved out asses many times.

One thing does bother me at best. We are limited to what we can utilize as the working man, or women. But in the civil sector the citizen with a Florida concealed weapon/firearm permit can pretty much carry what ever they want with very little training.


Your working with an agency (The State) that uses the same standards that Florida Sheriffs used in the 1950s. You can only carry 2 weapons. You can't conceal a weapon on your person (Guards don't need back up guns, since they only protect property, blah blah blah).

The "three day rule" can be extended, as its a "reasonable expectation" of the state that a temporary assignment can be only three days long.

Remember when you could only carry .38s? I was running around with a .357 Magnum Heavy Barrel with Federal HydraShok +P+ ammo, so that if I shot someone, I KNEW there would be a kenetic kill effect with the ammo, and not just go through them with no tissue damage. A quote from, oh, what was his name, the Director of Enforcement. I want to say Valdemort or whatever, but I think that's a Harry Potter character. "The 9mm pistol is a thinking man's gun. Guards should have revolvers, they can't screw them up." This was to hundreds in the industry at the Orlando Security, Investigative, and Recovery Confrence in 2004.

Also notice that PIs have been able to carry 9mm while on duty as security, and a PI does not require to have a dedicated manager. The owner, who must be a PI, can simply designate ANY PI in the office as an M-B licensee.

As far as the backup gun, the way I have felt about these things is simple: So long as you understand the legal and moral ramifications of what your doing, and your supervisor and company can disavow any knowledge of it, its between you and the state, JUST DON'T LET ME SEE IT. :)

Good luck, stay safe.

[Arff312]

Currently Unarmed hopefully next year i will be armed. But i would have to change companys first.

[N. A. Corbier]

That's the job OF unarmed security. Walk around and be a deterrant. Your job isn't to detain, question arrest or otherwise "enforce" anything.

Actually, depending on prevailing law, contractual agreement, and local ordinances, your job can well BE to enforce specific statue or ordinance, investigate violations, and detain for law enforcement suspected violators.

This is the basis of retail theft prevention / security.

The deterrant function of an unarmed security officer is limited, at best. Most criminals fear that the security officer will intervene in their activity as well as the possibility of backup.

Granted, I am not familiar with security operations in states that only allow law enforcement officers any sort of weapon or defensive ability. However, in most states, there is a contractual obligation for unarmed security officers to protect lives and property, and/or enforce certain ordinances or laws through statutory detention powers afforded by the state.

Not all laws are the same in the industry, in every state. After all, striking a Texas Commissioned Security Officer is a felony, and armed or unarmed, that officer will arrest you. In Florida, obstructing a security officer with violence is a felony, as the statute reads, as they have a legal duty to protect the property or people on it, and obstruction of a person with a legal duty is an element of that crime. Usually applied to utility workers, it has successfully be applied to security officers, as well.

[N. A. Corbier]

Your two statements here contradict themselves.

Not really. Criminals fear that the security officer will intervene, not just "call the popo" and flee.

For a security officer to be a trained observer, and NOT intervene, in most states, is a liability issue and a good way to get someone suing your company for failing to perform their legal duty.

Prevailing case law is that security officers, unless the contract is worded very specifically to mitigate this, are there to protect the property (and/or persons), and are to physical measures to protect that property, such as removing the person by force if needed to protect the client's property.

If the issue is related to life or health of a client, then the officer better do more than call 911 while running the other direction, or they are personally liable for failing to perform their legal duty. Prevailing case law has shown that officers can be criminally and civilly liable for failing to protect clients from physical harm, and the company liable vicariously for their employee's failing to act.

[N. A. Corbier]

Can't sue someone for not performing their legal duty if they did perform their legal duty. Well you can, but you'll never win.

Actually, there is prevailing case law in several states. Generally worded contracts, ancillary duties such as 'escorts,' and such langauge as "protect the facility and its employees from interference or criminal attack," which is in alot of federal contracts, all create a legal duty to protect life.

Generally worded contracts which do not specificially state "Security Company will be responsible for the protection of property only, providing one uniformed employee to observe the property and report to appropriate agencies any adverse condition on the client property....

Client acknowledges that the Security Company is retained specifically for the purposes of the protection of property through observation and reporting of adverse conditions, and is not responsible for the protection of the client's life, liberty, or safety, nor any of the client's employees, tenants, or visitors." can be construded to include a legal duty to protect the safety of _______, if it is a custom in that area for security companies to provide such services.

Ancillary duties that the client ropes the company into can create legal duties from generating standards of care above the contract level. Once you create a standard of care - either corporately or at the employee level - you must continue to maintain that standard of care until you get it in writing from the client that you no longer have to. Performing "escort" duties, such as walking people to their cars at night, creates a standard of care against personal attack for the employees and visitors. Cases have been successfully won on this premesis. If it is the employee doing this without corporate permission, the corporation is still vicariously liable if the employee fails to care for all persons he routinely performs the duty for.

And, federal contracts with wording like that will kill a company if they're not prepared to render force protection. Example: An armed intruder entered a federal building at night. The contract specified that the armed security officers were there to protect federal property and employees from interference or criminal attack. One employee was shot, and BOOM, the company was sued by the US Government for failing to protect the property and its employees from criminal attack.

It doesn't take law enforcement training to teach someone how to protect others from criminal attack. Remember, law enforcement training focuses on detecting and apprehending criminal enterprise. Private Security and Law Enforcement share the same training curriclicum in most states on personal protection. The reason that private security is provided a permit to openly carry, even in states where it is illegal for a private citizen to openly or concealed carry, is because it is acknowledged by the legislature that society needs members of it who will protect the lives and property of others, independent of the enforcement of the laws of the government.

Police protect the public and society as a whole. You can't sue the police for being raped because they didn't find you. Private Security protect the public (on a client's property) and the client, speficially. You CAN sue (and win, its happened many times) a security company for being raped because they didn't find you. Its the job of the police to investigate the rape. Its the job of private security to prevent it from happening.

[bigdog]

[QUOTE=N. A. Corbier]
Florida does not have a statutory authorization to arrest, and relies on common law detention of felony activity, or the various statutes allowing shopkeepers, retail establishment, and hotel agents to detain.

im a fl security officer true we have no authority to arrest i have placed a few people in handcuffs for my safetyand they were commiting midemeanors involving violence. i have not in any instancrprosecuted for false arrest.

[N. A. Corbier]

[QUOTE=N. A. Corbier]
Florida does not have a statutory authorization to arrest, and relies on common law detention of felony activity, or the various statutes allowing shopkeepers, retail establishment, and hotel agents to detain.

im a fl security officer true we have no authority to arrest i have placed a few people in handcuffs for my safetyand they were commiting midemeanors involving violence. i have not in any instancrprosecuted for false arrest.

There's a difference, especially in Florida, between arrest, detention, and handcuffing for "all person's safety." A person dosen't need to be detained or arrested (but they are, if you do) to be handcuffed. You aren't handcuffing them to arrest them, or to detain them, your handcuffing them to terminate their attack against you, or another person. As you said, "involving violence."

So long as you can articulate that to the police officer who will investigate your detention, they will find it lawful.

[Mr. Security]

Whats that old saying. Better to be judged a living testimate to defending your self than a dead stastitic to politics and passifists.

Here's another: "Better a live dog than a dead lion." (Bible) :)
I work unarmed. [No surprise...right? ;)]

[N. A. Corbier]

"I'd rather be judged by twelve of my peers than carried by six."

[Bill Warnock]

N.A. Corbier has said it well. When I was a student at the Sheriff's Academy there were three sayings that were on the board every day. "I'd rather be tried by six than carried by twelve." "Never (****) with a broad with a gun."
"What are you going to say at the hospital, funeral home, cemetary and to the wife or children."
The instructors at the Air Police/Security Police Academy said those things earlier, but for the sake of not offending anyone, did not write them on the blackboard." These aphorisms are key to survival along with keeping the Ten Commandments of Security and Law Enforcement also known as "Ten Deadly Sins."
Again, N.A., nice touch!
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[N. A. Corbier]

N.A. Corbier has said it well. When I was a student at the Sheriff's Academy there were three sayings that were on the board every day. "I'd rather be tried by six than carried by twelve." "Never (****) with a broad with a gun."
"What are you going to say at the hospital, funeral home, cemetary and to the wife or children."
The instructors at the Air Police/Security Police Academy said those things earlier, but for the sake of not offending anyone, did not write them on the blackboard." These aphorisms are key to survival along with keeping the Ten Commandments of Security and Law Enforcement also known as "Ten Deadly Sins."
Again, N.A., nice touch!
Enjoy the day,
Bill

I've heard it before, and seen it posted in sigs of many people on many forums related to law enforcement and security.

Always a good thing to wonder what your going to say. Even in security, we have the ability to take and give life, to those who attempt to harm, and those who are being harmed.

[Mr. Security]

"I'd rather be judged by twelve of my peers than carried by six."

A disadvantage of being armed with a gun is that if the bad guy also has a firearm and you have an encounter, both of you will have little choice other than to engage each other in a firefight. If I encounter a bad guy with a gun, I am not a threat to him because I am unarmed. Since many criminals are there for property crime and not to take life, odds are in my favor that I will survive the encounter. Also, I cannot be overpowered by an unarmed subject who could use a guard's own gun against him. Sadly, this happens even with police officers. As an example, if armed security is the best choice, then why do the majority of banks choose not to have it and encourage their employees not to resist? Again, because armed security would likely escalate the situation. :)

[Bill Warnock]

Mr. Security, if one is unarmed and perpatrator is armed, the predator's instincts may take over and you are prey too good to pass by.
You will find banks fear liability more than they do robbery. The di was cast when a robber threatened to shoot a customer unless he got money. The teller dropped behind the counter and the customer was murdered and the robber escaped, never to be captured. The husband's suit was his wife's life was more important than the banks money afterall it was insured. That case is cited when there is a robbery, monies are insured.
Police and armed security officers must make a decision within 7/10's of a second as to discharging their weapon. If there is hesitation, he can be shot, by the other person, his weapon taken from him and shot or beaten badly by one or more persons. Training, training and still more training!
Some security companies are just interested in: Does the applicant see lightning and hear thunder. Or, warm to the touch.
Normally on all traffic stops, especially at night the weapon is out and placed against the leg, finger against the frame. Even though you have notified dispatch of the car's make, model, liscense and number of seen occupants, there is always that chance. When the weapon must be displayed, raised or depressed pistol will let the occupants know it all business and whether or not they will be shot or otherwise harmed depends upon their good behavior.
That is the major complaint I have when jurisdictions want to replace seasoned sworn officers on dispatch duty with civilians who have had little or no experience. It saves money, but at what cost.
Off my soap box.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[N. A. Corbier]

Even worse, most Bad Guys see one thing: UNiform. The average person does not look at the gun belt, they do not look to see if you are armed, unarmed, or what. They only see uniform and badge. You may have a hold out gun. You may not. Why chance it, cap em.

I've had people miss my .357 Magnum sitting in a 1.5 inch Wild West drop Safariland Triple Retention holster. I've had people think I'm armed just because I look good in a uniform. People do not look at the hands, do not look at the belt, they look at the face.

[Bill Warnock]

You are absolutely correct. In certain places under the right circumstances, even Donald Duck wearing a uniform would be subject to attack. You never take your eyes off a subject?s hands and read facial expressions. Anything to keep you safe from harm, or worse, and those people and their things you?ve pledged to protect or as a LEO, those people and their things you sworn to protect.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[Mr. Security]

You will find banks fear liability more than they do robbery.

Exactly my point. What kind of liability is the bank concerned about? Not that an armed gunman will point a gun at a customer and threaten to kill them if the teller does not cooperate. The liability is gunplay between the armed robber(s) and armed security with customers caught in the middle. Therefore your example, while true, is not the liability that compels many banks to choose unarmed security over armed security.

[Mr. Security]

Even worse, most Bad Guys see one thing: UNiform. The average person does not look at the gun belt, they do not look to see if you are armed, unarmed, or what. They only see uniform and badge. You may have a hold out gun. You may not. Why chance it, cap em.

My point is that an unarmed guard cannot go for a gun that he does not have. This means that the guard has no choice but to offer no resistance and cooperate with the gunman's directions. An armed guard has the option and may very well decide to exercise it. If he does, then the gunman must meet deadly force with deadly force if he intends to achieve his objective. If the gunman does not have to use his weapon, not only does he get the property/money he is after, but also avoids making the crime an attempted murder/murder investigation which is definitely going to put him at the top of every LEO's 'to do' list. I know that bad guys can be dumb, but they can tell the difference between someone with his hands up and someone going for a gun. :D

[N. A. Corbier]

My point is that an unarmed guard cannot go for a gun that he does not have. This means that the guard has no choice but to offer no resistance and cooperate with the gunman's directions. An armed guard has the option and may very well decide to exercise it. If he does, then the gunman must meet deadly force with deadly force if he intends to achieve his objective. If the gunman does not have to use his weapon, not only does he get the property/money he is after, but also avoids making the crime an attempted murder/murder investigation which is definitely going to put him at the top of every LEO's 'to do' list. I know that bad guys can be dumb, but they can tell the difference between someone with his hands up and someone going for a gun. :D

Alot of times, they don't care. You may have a gun. Terminate the threat before it even thinks of drawing. Don't forget, the security officer who is unarmed may have a hidden gun. Better to just move in quick, kill the guards, kill anyone who resists, secure the money, and scoot.

Remember North Hollywood. Bank Robbers are becoming highly motivated indviduals with high firepower. Being unarmed is not a safety device. In that case, Level IV Rifle Armor is, and that's about it.

[Mr. Security]

Remember North Hollywood. Bank Robbers are becoming highly motivated indviduals with high firepower. Being unarmed is not a safety device. In that case, Level IV Rifle Armor is, and that's about it.

In the example you used, how do you think you would have fared if you were working at that bank, armed like you normally would be, when that robbery went down? Remember, no one in the bank was killed, because they didn't resist.

[Bill Warnock]

We in this business must face the fact liability issues run the train. We must also face the fact some members of our society are maladjusted, environment and upbringing may contribute all or in part to these people. When I was stationed on Guam in 1965, we had a phychology professor, Dr. Claire Walker, who stated society was faced with a generation of youth with no parental involvement. Not hate, not love, just apathy. There is no interest in their education. If we fail to provide a child with a quality education we as a society must be prepared to provide the now adult with a prison cell. There appears so much hate of authority, far worse, animosity for their fellow human being. The people in LE and Private Security are caught in the middle of this escalation of violence within the workplace, walking the street, driving to and from work. Unprovoked violence calls for a response. In many instances, that response must be measured not only by the circumstance but issues of liability. As a graduate of a Sheriff's Academy, I and my fellow graduates were informed we were armed social workers whose function was to mitigate society's ills, while managing to stay alive. First week on the job, customer flagged down another deputy stating something was wrong at the bank. Backup, four employees were herded into a back office and murdered, shot execution style. Year, 1970.
The bad guy will always know what he intends to do, we must play catch-up, all the while, in the back of our minds, unseen and for the most part unheard, "How much is too much." For years in the quiet of law offices and courtrooms, that split second decision will be debated.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[EMTGuard]

Unarmed. I work as an EMT and get paid more than the Unarmed and Armed Security Officers in my Company.

[N. A. Corbier]

Unarmed. I work as an EMT and get paid more than the Unarmed and Armed Security Officers in my Company.

EMS services usually get paid more, and have state protections such as "statutory redef of battery," making it a felony to oppose or hit a state certified EMT/P.

[Special Investigator]

Armed all the time! I wouldn't do it unless I'm armed....especialy in the Milwaukee 'shooting gallery'.

Glock, don't leave home without it.

[james2go30]

All I got is my cell phone, a small ass mag flashlight and protrac wand...it ain't but like 6-7 inches in length...and most of my work will be dealing with drunken teenagers and and other aged drunks on various floors, we have 23 floors, so I am unarmed and screwed royally.

[Chucky]

Class A large High Capacity Concealed when not in uniform and holstered otherwise. Carry a Glock 23 40 Cal or Glock 22 40 Cal. Perfer the 23. Always a vest on the job and seldom leave home without a Glock. I do security for a major drug firm.
Unlike most security the bad guys we encounter leave options for a happy way out off the table.

[CorpSec]

Just spray, no cuffs. We used to carry both, but liability concerns drove the decision to get rid of the cuffs.

I worked for years with cuffs, OC, and an ASP but have never worked armed. Around here, most places that have armed security are real cess pools and they don't pay that well. If they wanted to pay me considerably more than I am making now, I would definitely consider it, but that just isn't going to happen.

[Arff312]

Well i have now changed my security job. I work armed with OC, Asp, Glock 19 and the rest. Starting the end of the month i will be workign at a different company that issues tasers to the officers too.

[Chucky]

I think tasers are the best answer for most security positions. You will in most cases not kill the perp yet again in most cases he will do as told or you can send another 50K down the wire. And your court appearance if sued for shocking me cause all I wanted to do was steal from your employer and maybe hurt you badly in the process won't hold that much water with the judge. Whereas turning the bad guy into Swiss Cheese could ruin your summer vacation plans.

http://bestsmileys.com/hitting/24.gif

[Marchetti, David, M]

Unarmed for 22 years, never needed a weapon, never had the desire to shoot anyone, my brain, experience, and dedication is my weapon. I guess by some people's standards on the boards I have done some crazy **** over the years :O) and I have only had to use actual physical force on maybe 4 occasions to effect an arrest, twice to stop someone from assaulting another person, and once defending myself. Less legal liability and problems I think but that's a matter of choice I guess. If I were to carry with a blue card it would be a .45 or a .380... special ammo low powder hollow point or black talon round. In a car Mossberg Pump 12 GA, shortie barrel, attached mag light with 00 buck as ammo.

I would not object to carry a tasor, however the state legislation has not even addressed the issue for security officers.

[Rooney]

My position does not require me to be armed. But, I do spend allot of time on the U.S. mexico border in my work. Then I carry concealed (licensed) Sig p220 45. I have not had to use it but did have to draw once. A person came across the border with drugs on his back (big blocks wrapped in plastic wrap) and a rifle slung to his shoulder. The person retreated back across the border after coming up on me and seeing my weapon. Border patrol apprehended him about 1/2 mile down the border trying to cross again.

[N. A. Corbier]

Glad you weren't picked off by a sniper before the mule crossed. Be careful out there, you're dealing with more than just the runners, you got the damn Mexican Army to worry about too.

[Rooney]

Glad you weren't picked off by a sniper before the mule crossed. Be careful out there, you're dealing with more than just the runners, you got the damn Mexican Army to worry about too.

I've seen them come across a couple times as well. When I'm down there I like to keep my head low and on a swivel. I was staying low when that person came upon me. (I seen him coming across) Thats why I think he retreated. He didn't see me until he was about 10 yards away. Not enough time for him to bring his rifle up without me emptying my first clip. I now have agents with me or special security (x-military friend with VERY special training).

[N. A. Corbier]

With the Mexican Army engaging CBP agents in stand-offs, I would consider where you are going a deployment, and have appropriate force protection assets at all times.

I'm glad you do too. :)

[Special Investigator]

I think tasers are the best answer for most security positions.

I most states it is illegal for private security to carry or possess a TASER or electric weapon. Police only.

[Chucky]

I most states it is illegal for private security to carry or possess a TASER or electric weapon. Police only.

That is a legal oxymoron. My state won't allow a non lethal taser yet I carry 10 rounds of hollow point 40 cal in the mag. I swear the funeral directors union is behind this law.

As for Dave Ms comment that he has never desired to carry. Comon Dave you know that you would just love to empty a mag or two into some low life scum that buttered your toast on the wrong side. The smell of gun powder and the smoke just seems to make a day seem sooo much better. Maybe even the next person that tells you to have a nice day. Smoke em.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y50/Dkeo/kitscar.gif

[HotelSecurity]

30+ year experience & I like Dave M have never really had a desire to be armed. Probably because in Canada I can not be so it doesn't make scense dreaming about it if it isn't going to happen.

And I don't like the comments that unarmed Officers are useless. I do a lot of work! Again, I see security different than a lot of you. I was always told that the old punch clock patrols were for fire watch. Fire prevention, accident prevention, first aid & enforcing hotel rules do not require firearms.

I see something these days that I do think is useless security. During the past few years the guards working in banks have had there weapons taken away. An unarmed bank guard seems useless to me.

[Rooney]

30+ year experience & I like Dave M have never really had a desire to be armed. Probably because in Canada I can not be so it doesn't make scense dreaming about it if it isn't going to happen.

And I don't like the comments that unarmed Officers are useless. I do a lot of work! Again, I see security different than a lot of you. I was always told that the old punch clock patrols were for fire watch. Fire prevention, accident prevention, first aid & enforcing hotel rules do not require firearms.

I see something these days that I do think is useless security. During the past few years the guards working in banks have had there weapons taken away. An unarmed bank guard seems useless to me.

I have noticed that as well here. I think the reason they are taking the guns away from the bank security is for liability reasons. Some of the bank guards here are retired people just working part time. I would not want someone that is 70 years old shaking trying to shoot a robber in a crowded bank. :eek:

[Chucky]

IMO the best scenario is for a bank guard to be armed and in business attire.
Have a desk and totally blend in with the other employees. The element of surprise would belong to the guard.

A Securitis guard relayed a story when he was guarding a bank and his post was outside the front door unarmed.
One day the bank was robbed and the perp walked right past him and got away. I see no sense in this unless the bank got some sort of insurance break by having a guard present.

[N. A. Corbier]

I most states it is illegal for private security to carry or possess a TASER or electric weapon. Police only.
Um, that is blatantly false, and wrong.

States where all stun devices including TASER are illegal:
# Hawaii
# Illinois
# Massachusetts
# Michigan
# New Jersey
# New York
# Rhode Island
# Wisconsin


Cities where all stun devices including TASER are illegal:
# Annapolis, MD
# Baltimore, MD
# Baltimore County, MD
# Dennison / Crawford County, IA (*According to Sheriff Tom Hogan*)
# District Of Columbia
# Philadelphia, PA

As you can see, they are only illegal for citizen carry in 8 states, and a few cities in America. As far as "I said security, not private citizens," security officers are private citizens with no more or no less authority than other private citizens, unless they are sworn officers, who then could carry a peace officers in states where TASER is illegal.

The statement "I most states it is illegal for private security to carry or possess a TASER or electric weapon. Police only." is blatantly false. Taser just came out with the C2 personal defense weapon and showed it CES, not some tacticool expo, but the same place they showed the latest toasters.

No law-enforcement only weapon comes in electric pink.

[N. A. Corbier]

IMO the best scenario is for a bank guard to be armed and in business attire.
Have a desk and totally blend in with the other employees. The element of surprise would belong to the guard.

A Securitis guard relayed a story when he was guarding a bank and his post was outside the front door unarmed.
One day the bank was robbed and the perp walked right past him and got away. I see no sense in this unless the bank got some sort of insurance break by having a guard present.

There you go. Most of your clients get an insurance reduction by having the guard present, AND, if it can be argued that it was the guard's fault, the guard company's insurance company picks up the tab, whatever the liability-incurring event was.