Illegal Weapons

[NRM_Oz]

FYI as I am a licenced security officer, technically I am breaking the law by carrying a combination Swiss Army Knife and a Leatherman Supertool (15 years and still going strong) as these are classified as offensive weapons but have never had any issues with the police as I am not using these items to inflict any harm against another person and they are tools of trade.

In NSW a knife blade cannot be any longer than 1.5 inches long before it is considered a prohibited item (used to be 2.5 inches to cover pen knifes, etc) but if for example you worked at say Costco and had a box cutter then you had a valid reason but you cannot carry a Rambo knife to cut your steak with.

Just curious as to what items beyond tasers, Barret .50 cals and RPG's are considered illegal for S/O's to carry whilst on duty ?

[CAPTAIN KOOLAID]

Illegal weapons for state Louisiana.
Spring Loaded Baton
Slap Jacks
Brass Knuckles

[JB diligence]

How about "flick knives" or "spring assist" not (referring to switchblades)? I have seen allot around, the vendor states they are legal under the Criminal Code of Canada but many LEO's say different and others say there OK so there's a bit of a grey area, I used to be a fan of these due to there practicality. I'm not willing to chance it myself anymore.

Do your research before purchasing and carrying such questionable tools, saying that just about anything can be used as a weapon in the long run. Remember the kid back in grade school that used to hit the others with his lunchbox or Super Granny who puts the beats on some dumb thug with her purse whose trying to mug her?

The various potential weapons around us all the tame are endless which is why good observation of your surroundings is important...

[Maelstrom]

Illegal weapons for state Louisiana.
Spring Loaded Baton
Slap Jacks
Brass Knuckles

I've heard of these but have yet to see one...

[N. A. Corbier]

Honestly, there's only about 10 states where the Taser is illegal, and that's because its illegal for everyone. (Not security.)

As far as the Barrett rifle, in .50 BMG its illegal for citizen possession in several US states, but there are other (.416 Barrett anyone?) chamberings available.

What one has to remember is that few states outlaw things specifically for security. Many times, security is authorized to possess prohibited items that the regular public is not. These can be tear gas canisters, batons or billy clubs, tasers, firearms, etc.

[HospitalPatrol]

I am in South Carolina and I can purchase and use on duty anything that a LEO can purchase and use on duty. Of course the security company or client can place restrictions on what we use (as is the case anywhere). However, some of my former coworkers also worked for another security company which serviced nightclub clients. This company at the request of the clients authorized its officers to carry whatever they want. These guys had those huge MK9 fire extinguisher like pepper spray foggers strapped to their legs and they even used the stuff to clear out parking lot fights lol. They even had LE tazers and I think the only condition was they had to go through a little training class for that.

I know that using my SLED card I can get those fancy opening knives, hicap magazines, hollow point rounds, tazers, the good pepper spray, etc etc etc.

[N. A. Corbier]

You listed a lot of things in this post, HospitalPatrol, that I didn't know were actually illegal in South Carolina. Hollowpoint rounds are illegal for citizen possession? Pepper spray is illegal? Tasers?

Also, while South Carolina may authorize a SLED card holder to purchase an automatic knife, one should check federal law. I believe its illegal to purchase an automatic opener under federal law unless you are military, law enforcement (Federal Law uses its own definition of law enforcement officer, and licensed security guards would not meet the standard, as you are not considered a Law Enforcement Officer under South Carolina law, only a "person authorized to make arrests"), Firefighters, and EMS.

[SecTrainer]

Well, I'm just glad no one's said that corkscrews are illegal. I refuse to drink cheap wine that comes in screw-top bottles, especially while I'm on the job where image is so important.

[OccamsRazor]

Well, I'm just glad no one's said that corkscrews are illegal. I refuse to drink cheap wine that comes in screw-top bottles, especially while I'm on the job where image is so important.

I know I, for one, haven't had a good box of wine in a long time.

[Maelstrom]

Victorian law prohibits the carriage of knives other than for occupation/recreational (ie. fishing knife in tackle box) requirements, however in a push for religious tolerance (Political Correctness) a Victorian Education and Training Committee has given it's approval for Sikh males to wear the 9cm bladed 'religious' ornament... interestingly enough a counter proposal by the Education Department to wear a pendant or replica 'Kirpan' was refuted by the The Sikh Interfaith Council of Victoria.

Sikh students allowed to carry knives (http://www.theage.com.au/news/National/Sikh-students-allowed-to-carry-knives/2007/12/06/1196812855186.html)

Knives at school okay for religious reasons – report (http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22879059-661,00.html)



Sikhs often protest the characterisation of the Kirpan as a weapon. Traditionally, a Sikh should never use the Kirpan in anger or for a malicious attack. However, a Sikh may use it in self-defence or to protect a person in need. Some Sikhs choose to learn the art of Gatka. This is a martial art devised by the Sikh Gurus that uses circular movements to effectively swing a kirpan.

[NRM_Oz]

I've heard of these but have yet to see one...

A few places in Chinatown sold them as did a few surplus stores in the late 90's before they were outlawed. Speaking of being outlawed - you know those Swiss Cards which have a credit card size plastic cut out of a knife, scissors, file and even a toothpick - they were banned as was my Mossad Pen which had a small blade inside of it (about 2 inches long).

[NRM_Oz]

Maelstrom will know of Wellington Surplus from the Samurai and Airsoft replicas from People and Pix magazines from the 1980's. I could buy a balisong (butterfly knife) there and have alot of fun but not bring it into my state. In another state (Maelstrom check this out) I could have bought a 92FS replica for $230 AUD at Dreamworld (theme park) and for cash no1 would have known I had it when I crossed the border in 1993. I can not own a paintball gun but I can apply to own a firearm with the right permits).

[Unit6]

In Ma, the only thing not alowed as of now is the Taser and the Automatic knife, all other weapons/Tools are alowed. again some things are site alowed.

[tacscuba]

In Ma, the only thing not alowed as of now is the Taser and the Automatic knife, all other weapons/Tools are alowed. again some things are site alowed.

I thought batons weren't allowed for so's?

[HospitalPatrol]

You listed a lot of things in this post, HospitalPatrol, that I didn't know were actually illegal in South Carolina. Hollowpoint rounds are illegal for citizen possession? Pepper spray is illegal? Tasers?

I had to go back and make sure that I didn't say that those items were illegal, rather I could legally obtain any item which sale is usually restricted to LE by using my SLED card.

I can't find any information that would support the idea that these things cannot be possessed by a civilian but the purchasing of these items are often restricted to LE. For example, there is a cop store around here called lawmens (http://www.lawmens.com). When you click on the defensive sprays it says: "This product is available to Law Enforcement Personnel only and can only be shipped to a verified LE Departmental address. Please check the box to the left to affirm you are law enforcement personnel."

Also there is a distinction between the LE style and civilian tasers. They will only sell you the LE one if you are LE or you have the SLED card. However, there is no law against carrying tasers so maybe if a non LEO could get his hands on a LE taser he could carry it around.

I spent too long googling for answers on the hollow point thing and at this time I will concede that anyone in South Carolina can purchase and use hollow point rounds. I was confused on this point due to statements that other people have made to me.

As far as the knives go, I know for certain several retailers that will sell it to me because I have been considering making a big purchase. I see your point about the federal law and that it would be very difficult for me to defend my possession of an automatic knife being a civilian just because I got away with a technicality on the state level.

[craig333]

It is very confusing since many outfits will sell you almost anything they have and leave it up to you whether its legal to carry or not.

You're way off base if you think a cork delineates a good bottle of wine anymore. Many fine wines now have a screw cap, and while it is uncommon, some very fine wines are available in a box.

[NRM_Oz]

Hmmmmmm I don't drink wine much but us Aussies invented the Cask. Yes as you yanks know it - the Wine Box or Boxed Wine (1 gallon of delicious drain cleaner for $6.98 plus tax). We also invented the flaggon or `blaggon` for our indigenous population which is a glass gallon size bottle of drain cleaner wine.

Some of our online stores have the same thing Craig - where the onus is on YOU the purchaser to ensure you comply with local and state laws with your purchase. Batons and handcuffs are restricted items and you must show your security licence to purchase them but I can go to China town and get ballistic knives (spring loaded that fire off the blade) and butterfly knives as well as PR 24's for a cash deal without any need for paperwork.

[Maelstrom]

I can go to China town and get ballistic knives (spring loaded that fire off the blade) and butterfly knives as well as PR 24's for a cash deal without any need for paperwork.

I remember a sweet pair of butterfly knives I owned leading up to the 90's, seems unfair that regular citizens are prohibited collecting such items when 'street vermin' have no difficulty locating it (like in little China town), additionally I once heard about a Melbourne venue that passed out those spring loaded batons to their CC's at the commencement of their shift... must be one hella'va rough joint! :D

[NRM_Oz]

I recall a very well-behaved pub on Xmas Eve 1 year which a company I worked supplied additional security staff for. We were split into teams of 9 and I had 1 team working perimeters. After 4 middle-eastern males were turned away we had them come back with 30 mates as the police were called and k9 and riot squad police turned up to send them home. Quietly a dozen ASP batons were handed out (still new in their packs) to all supervisors and about 50 minutes later these were all banded back to the Ops Mgr to go back into their packets. 2 other fools bring out stainless steel spring loaded batons (like a small riding crop) and I hit the roof as they carried these on duty with the police still onsite only 30 feet away getting witness details.

[hkbladelawhk]

In terms of state laws, in AZ, any factory made, unmodified weapon is legal...of course machine guns and silencers require a class 3 license....but nevertheless, legal...

[officerchick]

Just curious as to what items beyond tasers, Barret .50 cals and RPG's are considered illegal for S/O's to carry whilst on duty ?

For me, everything. I work for an unarmed company. As it was explained to me, that not only includes firearms but pocketknives and pepper spray. So I can buy some for my wife to carry in her purse, but I can't carry it at work.:confused:

[jbaerbock]

Personally I carry my personal Winchester Knife on me which is below the 3 inch law in Minnesota. I actually showed it to my commanding officer and he complemented me on it :).

[Plugger]

I wonder if there are laws against carrying a screwdriver for self-defense.

I'm talking about a regular screwdriver that hasn't been sharpened in any way.

[craig333]

I would imagine it would be much the same as how that screwdriver would a tool for a construction worker and a burglary implement for a thief.

[Maelstrom]

I wonder if there are laws against carrying a screwdriver for self-defense.

I'm talking about a regular screwdriver that hasn't been sharpened in any way.

Craig's correct... it's all about intent of purpose ;)

[SecTrainer]

Craig's correct... it's all about intent of purpose ;)

...or, for those who are armed, one might carry a screwdriver as a throw-down. "He was coming at me with a screwdriver..." Screwdrivers being cheap, it wouldn't cost much to clear out all the scumbags in town. :D

[craig333]

I can't believe you'd suggest that. Hmmm, not a bad idea though :)

[Jedi]

In California, the laws allow the SO to carry a baton, provided that they have the proper endorsement to their "guard card" and/or an exposed firearm, again provided that they have the proper endorsement to their "guard card". The S/O can also carry a concealed firearm if they have a permit to do so AND have the firearm endorsement to their "gaurd card".

As far as other things, anything else that is restricted for a civilian is also restricted for a S/O: (from PC12020-abridged)
ballistic knife
nunchaku
short-barreled shotgun
short-barreled rifle
metal knuckles
belt buckle knife
leaded cane
zip gun
shuriken
unconventional pistol
lipstick case knife
cane sword
shobi-zue
air gauge knife
writing pen knife
metal military practice handgrenade
metal replica handgrenade
instrument or weapon of the kind commonly known as a blackjack, slungshot, billy, sandclub, sap, or sandbag

The list of what citizens can posses is much shorter...

[Maelstrom]

Hmmmm... I've always wanted a 'cane sword' ever since I saw one in Blind Fury (http://www.beyondhollywood.com/blind-fury-1989-movie-review/) with Rutger Hauer back in the late '80s LOL :D

[NRM_Oz]

As a kid at high school I used to dream of all these things from a place on the west coast of Australia. I could have a BB gun there and a paintball gun but on the other side of the country, I could have a gun (just need to go through the BS) but not a bb gun or paintball gun.

Now here is something interesting ....... do you all know of something called a SWISS TOOL ? It is a credit card sized device with tweezers, bottle opener and a tiny 1.5" blade designed for executives to have a bottle opener as well. About $20.00 US. They WERE banned in my state as they were considered a concealed weapon !!! Yes that is true.

[bpdblue]

The great state of California, in all its' wisdumb (spelling error intended) allows security guards to get a permit to carry tear gas / OC.

Great, right. :confused:

Well, average Joe citizen in our fair state can buy, possess, and use (under proper circumstances, of course) tear gas / OC without any permit, or training. :eek:

Oh well, I guess we are lucky to have it available at all. :rolleyes:

[gonzo1510]

The great state of California, in all its' wisdumb (spelling error intended) allows security guards to get a permit to carry tear gas / OC.

Great, right. :confused:

Well, average Joe citizen in our fair state can buy, possess, and use (under proper circumstances, of course) tear gas / OC without any permit, or training. :eek:

Oh well, I guess we are lucky to have it available at all. :rolleyes:

I never did understand that one.....


Hey did you read the memo from BSIS regarding baton permits ?