To CPP or not to CPP

[Eric]

Are there very many CPO's or CPP's on this site?

I have been able to get both, a college diploma, and still not drink tea with a raised pinky. :D


Always watch which toes you step on during the walk up, just in case they are still there during any unexpected falls.....

[histfan71]

I would like to get a CPP eventually. I have already read 3 of the books on the reading list, but I just started a Master's Degree program this month so I am going to finish up my degree first then start working on the CPP.

[burley]

This is not going to be a popular opinion but I have to say, has anyone ever questioned the huge marketing and money-making cash cow that ASIS has implemented under the guise of a professional "security designation"? Yes you have to read about 11 books and pass a 200+ question test but c'mon, I can see adding a degree designation beside my name but a Security organization's concocted designation? Those with a "real" degree would see this designation as laughable. Sorry to those who have undertaken to obtain the ASIS designation. I too will be expected to read the books and take the test in 2007, as my company wants me to evaluate the program. I expect to see a barrage of criticism to this comment...I have big shoulders.

[Big Bulldog]

I have my CPP and am also working on my Master's degree. I am seeing more companies here in Canada looking for personnel with this designation so it depends upon the value placed on it by your company or potential employer.

[Eric]

I for one would expect to hear pro and con. The designation is not for everyone, just like college and university may not be the best fit in someones mental ability, time constraints or money situation etc.
The program is not the money maker you think it is, but is intended for mid career folks.
Talk with someone looking for work, are they not trying to have a bit more than the next guy to land that job? Designations are included more and more on company job boards.
This designation and CISSP for example demand time in the role as well as a test. (passing mark above 70%)




This is not going to be a popular opinion but I have to say, has anyone ever questioned the huge marketing and money-making cash cow that ASIS has implemented under the guise of a professional "security designation"? Yes you have to read about 11 books and pass a 200+ question test but c'mon, I can see adding a degree designation beside my name but a Security organization's concocted designation? Those with a "real" degree would see this designation as laughable. Sorry to those who have undertaken to obtain the ASIS designation. I too will be expected to read the books and take the test in 2007, as my company wants me to evaluate the program. I expect to see a barrage of criticism to this comment...I have big shoulders.

[HotelSecurity]

I have never heard a company asking for it in Quebec.

Along with Police Technology, Emergency Medical Technician programs in colleges I've been trained in firefighting, emergency communications & rescue with Civil Protection. In the late 80's I wrote the challenge exam from the Education Institute of the American Hotel & Motel Association in Hotel/Motel Security Management. I passed "With Honors" without taking the classes :D

I'd like to take the new Certified Hotel Security Director's exam from the now named American Hotel & Lodging Association. I'd be able to put the letters CHSD after my name. Not that it would help me career wise since I'm too old to be changing jobs! But it too is expensive.

[mdb]

Excellent thread...here is my two cents. I obtained my CPP designation in May of this year. A certification that I worked on for nearly two years. I have a bachelor's degree to compliment my certification with plans to obtain my MBA or master's in Security Management. I work in the Corporate Security Department of Fortune 500 company; so every bit of education I have and additional training and expertise I garner through various sources helps keep me competitive.

I understand the controversy surrounding the CPP program, but it's not just about passing a test and hanging your certificate on the wall. ASIS requires you recertify every three years (unlike many certification programs) which is a combination of Membership, Education Programs and Courses, Instruction, Speeches, and Presentations, Publications, Public Service, and continuous self study, education, program and volunteer service. In other words, you must continue to grow professionally and stay involved becoming the most effective security practitioner you can and remain current with trends in the industry.

This is not to say that those without it are not doing what I just outlined in their security careers. There should be a standard and if I were looking for someone to hire to work in my Corporate Security Department, they would have a degree and would have a CPP, CFE, or in the process of seeking the designation.

If we as an industry expect to move security forward as a respected career field that pays its practitioners well and rewards them for their expertise, we must insist on minimum standards that are stringent enough to exclude those who are marginal performers. All of us know how technical the career field has become and there are many skills that a security professional brings to the table that are outlined in the areas a CPP is tested on; such as Security Principles, Business Principles, Personnel Security, Physical Security, Information Security, Emergency Practices, Investigations, and Legal Aspects. I can assure you that the CPP exam is much more difficult than most of you realize and if you do not know the material and how to apply it in scenario based situations you are not going to pass the test.

[Eric]

Yes, I believe the path to professionalism should include base levels of knowledge across the board. We are getting there slowly, but with an increase in college classes etc. it is getting better. A problem still exists with clients and maybe sales trying to get clients, offering low bids.

The CPP exam was easier than the stories I heard over the years. But all I had to do was be in a study group for 3 months, prepare and present one book/subject and remember what the others were presenting as well.

[mike booth]

I didn't renew my ASIS membership last year. I'm not recertifying my PSP this year. ASIS hasn't done anything for me. My clientele has never heard of ASIS, the CPP, PSP or the other new certification. I tried promoting ASIS locally. It's easier to promote my business. I tried to work with ASIS to promote them locally. I was not impressed with their poor communication and lack of organization. Their are industry segements and employers where ASIS membership is valuable and where the certification helps. It isn't for everyone.

[Szorcsik001]

The security industry is fragmented and rightfully stereotyped by poorly trained individuals. (Not across the board of course, there are a few of us that have taken the effort to truly learn the job, but industrywide most aren't)

Even receiving tons of training from a company doesn't mean much as many companies offer tons of worthless training. The CPP designation is an industry standard. Everyone in the industry knows what it means and what knowledge it demonstrates.

If you are looking for another run of the mill entry type job, the CPP designation may help a bit, but is nothing earthshattering if you don't have it. However, when you start applying for Corporate Security Manager positions, or other high level spots, the other applicants will have the CPP designation next to their name. And the BS, maybe a MS, and maybe even an XFBI. Those are a lot of letters to compete with.

Whether it is fair or not, whether it is ASIS's way of making money or not, at some point you need to play their game if you want the top jobs.

[mike booth]

Good points but, only in the industries that ASIS caters to and they do not have a lock on all the industries. They act like they have no regard for any industry that doesn't recognise ASIS as the gold standard. There are some big industries out there that have no idea who ASIS is. ASIS doesn't seem to be doing anything to crack those industries. On the contrary, their attitude suggest they feel the ASIS members who are in those industries should be educating their industries as to the benefits of ASIS. This while selling membership as the industry standard.

In particular, my specialty, Cultural Property Protction and Executive Protection are very poorly served by ASIS. None of my clients have ever heard of ASIS. I find my self spending as much time promoting ASIS as I spend promoting my business

Why should I spend several hundred dollars a year to earn certification with an organization my clients don't recognize? Why should I spend more money to promote that organization? And why should I promote an organization that sandbags my promotional efforts when I have a successful track record?

[mdb]

What is Cultural Property Protection?

[Mr. Security]

The security industry is fragmented and rightfully stereotyped by poorly trained individuals. (Not across the board of course, there are a few of us that have taken the effort to truly learn the job, but industrywide most aren't)

Even receiving tons of training from a company doesn't mean much as many companies offer tons of worthless training. The CPP designation is an industry standard. Everyone in the industry knows what it means and what knowledge it demonstrates.

If you are looking for another run of the mill entry type job, the CPP designation may help a bit, but is nothing earthshattering if you don't have it. However, when you start applying for Corporate Security Manager positions, or other high level spots, the other applicants will have the CPP designation next to their name. And the BS, maybe a MS, and maybe even an XFBI. Those are a lot of letters to compete with.

Whether it is fair or not, whether it is ASIS's way of making money or not, at some point you need to play their game if you want the top jobs.

CPP for an entry-level position is probably going to mark you as overqualified and/or lacking self-confidence. However, I agree with your post when it comes to management positions and the like.

[Szorcsik001]

In particular, my specialty, Cultural Property Protction and Executive Protection are very poorly served by ASIS. None of my clients have ever heard of ASIS. I find my self spending as much time promoting ASIS as I spend promoting my business

Why should I spend several hundred dollars a year to earn certification with an organization my clients don't recognize? Why should I spend more money to promote that organization? And why should I promote an organization that sandbags my promotional efforts when I have a successful track record?

ASIS is not a universal protection services organization. There are holes. Just be aware of who your potential clients are, and whether or not it may be useful. Executive Protection for celebrities, CPP means nothing. If you are looking at Corporate EP, they have been well trained by ASIS that CPP is important. (Truth or not, perception is reality)

The question here is not whether or not the CPP designation means you are better qualified, because in all honesty, you are the same person after taking the test as you were before. (Unless studying for it taught you a lot) The question is whether you will be perceived to be more qualified. In corporate circles, the answer is a resounding yes. Outside the corporate world...it's hit and miss.

[SIW Editor]

What is Cultural Property Protection?

That generally refers to protection of artwork, museums, historical documents, etc. Cultural Property Protection is not CPP, which is the Certified Protection Professional designation from ASIS Int'l. Just so things are clear on that point.

[Eric]

I do not think one is better qualified because of passing a test, Certifications can show you are serious about the field and may be the one extra to land a role over someone else though.

ASIS certifications expalined - http://www.asisonline.org/certification/index.xml

The IFCPP offers the ONLY professional certification for persons working in, or responsible for, cultural property protection- http://www.ifcpp.org/cert.htm

International Foundation of Protection Officers courses - http://www.ifpo.org/products/index.html

[SgtUSMC8541]

I earned my CPO in 98. At the time, I was a brand new Operations Manager. Found it to be a great tool and I still use the book to help train my security officers.

I plan on getting my CPP this year and the PSP early next year.

[copelandamuffy]

I am going to CPP review classes on Saturday morning the 7th in the
Boston area.
I am in the process of studying the 12th edition of CPP exam review
book.


The ASIS library has the Protection Assets Manual.
I think every major city has a branch ASIS chapter.

I believe it never hurts to learn a tad more.


I have been told by many....study...study...study..till your brain explodes
The latest CPP exam has a lot on IT security
Plan to study for two years.

I also have another point of view
In two years I take the CPP exam.
Pass the exam.
Shortly thereafter whom I work for as an Account Manager
is awarded a new contract. Two people apply for the
position within my my company. I am one of them.
I am CPP certified, the other person is not
Perhaps I am the chosen, because I am CPP certfied.

[dexyuen]

I have just joined ASIS as a member and preparing for the CPP exam in May 2007.

Here's my opinion ...

1 x 20 years experience or 20 x 1 year experience ?

Many people says that experience is more important than paper qualifications. Some people claims to have 20 years of experience in the Security Industry and they are better than someone with only 10 years of experience.

A question to ponder ... does a person has 20 x 1 year experience or does he has 1 x 20 years of experience ?

I would think that experience is not measure by the number of years, but rather the type of work undertaken by him.


A leader is a lifelong Learner.

You can definitely benefit from CPP in many ways. Even though one may not get an immediate pay rise, but I'm sure he will learnt a lot of new knowledge and skills to provide immediate benefits and enhancement to his work environment.

More importantly, A leader is a lifelong Learner. By staying abreast with the latest Security information, trends etc you are definitely "leading" the industry ...

My conclusion ... Go for CPP



Dex Yuen
http://securityprofessional.wordpress.com

[firenut]

I'm getting tired of this! Some noteworthy know it all swoops down and creates a degree or certification for a position. I'm a 13 year seasoned volunteer firfighter and I have seen the lines drawn in the sand there due to this. Some young know it all with little expirience but FF1 heh doesn't take much to get FF2 starts getting all upity because he is certifide. Well congrats to you mr certifide guy. the world is full of people with fistfulls of paper not worth thier salt in the real world.

I'm ex police, and an active Vol FF, as well as a seasoned security officer. I just deleated 5 paragraphs of rambling comments about this. Thats how much this subject burns me up. :mad:

Someone turns it into a money making scheme. Thats the root of my anger.

[N. A. Corbier]

I'm getting tired of this! Some noteworthy know it all swoops down and creates a degree or certification for a position. I'm a 13 year seasoned volunteer firfighter and I have seen the lines drawn in the sand there due to this. Some young know it all with little expirience but FF1 heh doesn't take much to get FF2 starts getting all upity because he is certifide. Well congrats to you mr certifide guy. the world is full of people with fistfulls of paper not worth thier salt in the real world.

I'm ex police, and an active Vol FF, as well as a seasoned security officer. I just deleated 5 paragraphs of rambling comments about this. Thats how much this subject burns me up. :mad:

Someone turns it into a money making scheme. Thats the root of my anger.

You realize this certification is relatively ancient, and that ASIS membership is restricted to managers and owners of security companies, right? :)

[Curtis Baillie]

Direct from the ASIS website - there are two classes of membership:

Classes of Membership

Member: Professional in an executive, managerial, supervisory, or responsible charge position who is primarily responsible for the security function of their organization.

Associate: Individual with professional interest in security, seeking the educational benefits provided by membership in ASIS.

[firenut]

Ok, maybe I got lost in this thread. I was under the impression that this was to be a certification of some sort that you would have to take a class as well as a test. My mistake. Then this is no differant than me belonging to the NFPA or FOP. Mostly useless on an application.

[N. A. Corbier]

It depends on what you're applying to. I know of positions that will only hire IFPO Certified Protection Officer "graudates" (CPOs), and other positions that require CPP designation.

[Bill Warnock]

Ok, maybe I got lost in this thread. I was under the impression that this was to be a certification of some sort that you would have to take a class as well as a test. My mistake. Then this is no differant than me belonging to the NFPA or FOP. Mostly useless on an application.
Firenut:
Contact a member of ASIS in your area and that person will get you started.
Several community colleges have prep classes for people who want to take the CPP. One thing to remember, I think, you do not have to be an ASIS member to take the CPP.
Since I've retired and left ASIS, things probably have changed. If you have the education and background, all you need do is put forth an effort.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[firenut]

If you have the education and background, all you need do is put forth an effort.

Bill,

This is exactly what angers me. Having to pay for a certification in the obvious. Worse yet, someone holding this certification who is worthless yet has the ability to get an interview over a person such as myself because of a certification. Sorry, but I'm a traditional east coast guy. West coast firms seem to try to reduce hiring down to certifications and test results. I'm more into actually going over the application calling former employers and references and bringing in folks for extensive interviews. Too many folks outright lie now days on applications. I know HR departments do it all the time. List any and all available certifications and skills and ask for superman to step forward.

Why would you work for a firm who lets HR recruit and hire your security director. Security Director should be a hands on hire by upper level managment. Yes, they no doubt also want to see a bunch of pretty initials after your name also. <sigh>

Sorry, tossed in a little more than 2 cents that time.

William

[Bill Warnock]

William:
You have to pay for any education you get. Sometimes it may not be in actual dollars but in time, sweat and toil. It is a selection tool. Is it improperly used, sure it is, so are other selection criteria. It means you have been exposed to many learning experiences, thinking on your feet.
Sometimes a highly touted person fall on their face when crunch time comes, they look good on paper. The modern idiom sums it up best, "He can talk the talk but can't walk the walk."
Don't be bitter as bitterness holds you back. Put forth the effort, if you want a particular job and the criterion is specific then attain that requirement and will you have improved yourself.
No one ever said life was fair. Be true to yourself; envy is like a cancer, if left unchecked it will destroy the body as well as the soul.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[Curtis Baillie]

Firenut:
Contact a member of ASIS in your area and that person will get you started.
Several community colleges have prep classes for people who want to take the CPP. One thing to remember, I think, you do not have to be an ASIS member to take the CPP.
Since I've retired and left ASIS, things probably have changed. If you have the education and background, all you need do is put forth an effort.
Enjoy the day,
BillMr. Warnock - You're correct. You do not need to be a member of ASIS to take the exam or hold the CCP designation. Although they will "push" you to become a member.

[Bill Warnock]

Mr. Warnock - You're correct. You do not need to be a member of ASIS to take the exam or hold the CCP designation. Although they will "push" you to become a member.
Thanks Security Consultant.
CPP and other designations are winnowing tools, some objectively and some subjectively. That is life and we have to deal with it.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[Eric]

As noted, you need to stand out from the crowd a bit when applying for new jobs. Today with online applications becoming the norm, HR will "search" the database using "keywords" to fit the open job.

I will start a new thread asking you management types for possible keywords we should use in a resume.

[SecTrainer]

My main beef with ASIS is that they seem to show very little interest in the welfare of the line-level security officer. Even their recently published "training guideline" for security officers only calls for 32 hours of training, if I remember correctly. (Anyone can download this and their other guidelines from their website.) Also, like some here, I found when I was a member that I was constantly being bombarded by junk mail from them, forever trying to sell me something like a seminar (expensive ones), a book, etc.

By contrast, my beefs with the IFPO are: (1) their CPO training text is rambling, is very poor in production values such as color and other graphics, and it is very poorly organized (probably because it is just a compilation of writings by many different authors instead of a single expert or a team), and (2) the material presented is not comprehensive enough by about half for anything but "observe and report" positions.

All of that being said, I must admit that the "credentials-as-selection tools" argument does have merit - whether CPP, CPO, CFE, CISSP, an industry-specific certification as in healthcare or hotel/lodging...or a relevant degree program. Which one "means the most" for career advancement depends greatly on the industry and the company you work for. It's just a fact, for good or bad, that someone sitting on a hiring or promotions board needs a reason to select you over someone else who might otherwise have comparable qualifications such as experience...and certs/degrees are often the basis for making the cut between two candidates.

Also, you might get a lot more value out of the networking you can do at local chapter meetings of ASIS than you do from the main organization itself.

Incidentally, the best qualifications for middle management are the security-related credentials, but the best qualification for top management is an education in business, and for that training you might wish to check out the courses and certifications offered by the American Management Association if a degree is not feasible.

[copelandamuffy]

SecTrainer:
By far this is the best response as to whether CPP, CPO or not.
I asked my Operation's Manager about this.
Since I work for a contract Security Guard firm, any new contract that
is in need of a Account Manager is usually interviewed by the prospective
client. My Ops. Manager said in some cases it doesn't matter how
many certificates one has, it boils down to whether that client likes you
and whether the client wants you
She was not discouraging me, it is just her opinion. She did say continue to
plug away at my CPP and CPO.

[Bill Warnock]

SecTrainer:
By far this is the best response as to whether CPP, CPO or not.
I asked my Operation's Manager about this.
Since I work for a contract Security Guard firm, any new contract that
is in need of a Account Manager is usually interviewed by the prospective
client. My Ops. Manager said in some cases it doesn't matter how
many certificates one has, it boils down to whether that client likes you
as to whether the client wants you
She was not discouraging me, it is just her opinion. She did say continue to
plug away at my CPP and CPO.
Excellent advice. You are never too old to learn something nor secure in the knowledge you have and fail to yearn for more.
You can lose your home and possessions and until you lose your life, your education will remain.
Always have that lean and hungry look and never afraid to think of ways to better yourself and society.
Enjoy the day,
Bill

[SecTrainer]

I'm not sure that I completely agree with the assessment that a client interview for an account manager is all about "how much they like you" unless the person interviewing you is extremely shallow and/or inexperienced in working with security vendors.

Yes, they are certainly interested in how well they think they can get along with you on a day-to-day basis, but any interviewer who has experience in administering the "client side" of the security contract should also be interested in how competent you appear to be, what training you've received (company-sponsored and other), your ability to communicate, your years of experience, and will at least take note of any relevant certifications and/or degrees that you hold...and it can be difficult or impossible to tell which of these characteristics carried the most weight with them when accepting :) (or rejecting :( ) you for the position.

[N. A. Corbier]

I think it really depends on why the client has security in the first place. To me, an "Account Manager" is a glorified First Shift guard who wears Captain's bars. If you only have guard service because your insurance company demands it, do you really care what knowledge the guard manager brings, so long as he's cheap?

[SecTrainer]

Sounds like you're working with "low-bidder" clients, which reminds me of an article I read in a business class some years ago called "The Client from Hell". Seems to me it was in the Harvard Business Journal or one of those. The author's point was that you don't want every client...there are some that are so cheap (or so demanding, or so impossible to satisfy - whatever) that they ruin your business. Every resource you expend on them is a resource you cannot expend on getting or keeping better business. His advice was to identify such clients and let them go - as hard as that might be - hopefully to your worst competitor so they can ruin his business, and then go after better business yourself. (And there IS better business to be found in the security industry.)

We all know that clients have "criteria" for acceptable security vendors. Question is, do we have our own criteria for what makes an acceptable security client, or will we take anyone who wants to hire us? If you look at a lot of other service businesses - the big accounting firms, law firms, etc., they do have such criteria (not just the credit rating), and there are clients they simply won't touch.

Sounds like just common sense, but the fact is that most of us don't realize that not all business is good business. Some business positively stinks. If we did, we'd cut our losses (or never bid in the first place) on the crappy clients that keep us from making the proper rate of profit for the risk capital we invest, so we wind up making less on that investment than if we'd never gone into business and put the money in government bonds instead.

[N. A. Corbier]

Thankfully, I don't have to deal with clients like that. The concept of keeping a client while watching your employees abandon ship is horrifying, because the client's not going to replace the lost man-hours and training wages you paid out for those perfectly good employees.

[RJ Martin]

Well, this is somewhat of a controversial issue, with opinions varying from one extreme to the other. However, in my opinion, as a CPP, it is certainly a worthwhile pursuit if in fact your intention is to remain in the security industry.

There are few credentials that identify you as a security professional, so it is best to take advantage of the most recognizable that are available - and the CPP is undoubtedly the most widely known. I know from personal experience that the CPP designation has measurably helped me and my business.

[SecTrainer]

I know from personal experience that the CPP designation has measurably helped me and my business.

Thank you for that perspective, Mr. Martin. Perhaps you wouldn't mind commenting more specifically on how you feel the CPP has been beneficial to you (or your business)?

[mdb]

Let's face it! Having a formal education in today's society is a necessary evil. I work in the Global Security Department of a Fortune 500 company and you MUST have a Bachelor's degree to even qualify for a job here. I know personally atleast 6 of the 10 within our group that have graduate degrees and 5 of us that have our CPP's.

Obtaining you CPP is not merely taking a test. The person holding the CPP must recertify every three years through a combination of membership in professional organizations, education, instruction, publications, program service, public service, accomplishments, and volunteerism. Maintaining your CPP is an on-going process that takes a concerted effort on the part of the CPP holder to stay engaged in the security field. Not merely take a test, pay an annual fee, and show up for work every day.

How many other security certifications out there require a recertification process? I invite those of you to visit the ASIS web site and research the certification.

If you ever wish to move into a corparate level job or become an account manager, you are going to have to get your degree and if you don't, you better look into the CPP program to augment your training and education.

There is to much competition out there to sit on your tail and not get more educated. Like a previous post stated: they cannot take your education away from you and it cannot do anything but help!

I encourage all of you who do not have your degree to get out there and get it. Good luck!

[RJ Martin]

Thank you for that perspective, Mr. Martin. Perhaps you wouldn't mind commenting more specifically on how you feel the CPP has been beneficial to you (or your business)?

Without belaboring my opinion, I can add that when clients are looking for help to resolve a myriad of security related problems, the CPP designation has been a deciding factor in them calling my firm (direct quote from the clients) as opposed to calling any other firm who did not have the credentials.

Additionally, when writing and getting published, the CPP designation lends significant credibility in the eye of the public (the non-initiated in security) and the press.

I reiterate my original point, "that if you intend to stay within the securiyt field long-term" the CPP is a wise choice - at a minimum - it will not hurt your career!

[SecTrainer]

Additionally, when writing and getting published, the CPP designation lends significant credibility in the eye of the public (the non-initiated in security) and the press.

Very good point!

[CAR54]

Very informative topic.

The company I'm with recently introduced a "pay for skills" based on the IFPO program. Honestly I'd never heard of the IFPO until it was recently unveiled at my work place. The company will be basing an officers pay on how many levels they've completed, and been tested on, in the program. And the company will be paying for each module and all the materials. So if an officer is motivated and good at taking tests they can advance fairly quickly.

Unfortunately many of the officers have been with this company for some time and are making well over what the pay for skills program starts at, and also don't like taking tests, so they've been notified unless they can quickly reach the correct level in the pay for skills program their pay will be cut (ouch).

Since I just started and I'm making the minimum amount at this company I think it's a great idea, course I'm in the minority.

[james2go30]

Thankfully, I don't have to deal with clients like that. The concept of keeping a client while watching your employees abandon ship is horrifying, because the client's not going to replace the lost man-hours and training wages you paid out for those perfectly good employees.
My company would rather keep the client while the employees abandon ship...my company has a hight turn-over rate...and some of the officers I have seen leave this company are pretty bright and experienced...some them I didn't want to see go cause I wanted to learn from them...but they did and I can't blame them having thoughts of it myself...but not too many security companies in panama city to choose from...thinking about mall security. Oh yea while the good ones leave we keeping the brain dead ones. Whenever we get a new officer I don't know If I should advise them about my company or let them find out the hard way like I did...stuck on this one.

[Eric]

Whenever we get a new officer I don't know If I should advise them about my company or let them find out the hard way like I did...stuck on this one.

Train / advise them on the correct and safe way to do things, leave the rest out. ;)

[stevesurf]

As stated before, a very informative thread; I'll try to make my first post here a decent one!


Why should I spend several hundred dollars a year to earn certification with an organization my clients don't recognize?I get asked this a good deal at ASIS Workshops; even though I am currently working toward my Board Certification, it may not be an appropriate one for an individual. Is it possible there may be influencers in the OP's business circle that have a positive opinion of the certification and are not expressing it? If this is the case, the education value of the certification process alone need be considered. The process of getting a CPP or even PSP can involve some very positive interaction where you'll learn alongside diverse industry professionals.

About six years ago, when I first began conducting workshops for ASIS, I was very technology driven. Today, I am far more focused on the needs of the end users and consultants that attend these sessions than ever before. The ASIS Education Programs almost always involve collaboration, whether it is on a Chapter, Council, Committee, Industry Group or even via the web site itself. The programs have really changed my focus for the positive.


You realize this certification is relatively ancient, and that ASIS membership is restricted to managers and owners of security companies, right? :)Actually, there are many successful Security Consultants that are board certified. Many end users require this as a prerequisite to hiring a Physical Security Consultant. Membership is not limited to just managers and owners...

[mike booth]

I'm letting my PSP lapse. I did not renew my ASIS membership. I'm very dissapointed in the organization after trying very hard to participate and contribute. I would not reccomend membership or certification to anyone unless they are in a market where membership and certification is common. ASIS is not relevant to every segment of the security market, they just think they are.

[Eric]

I'm letting my PSP lapse. I did not renew my ASIS membership. .

For the 12 (?) credits needed over 3 years to maintain your PSP, it may be easy to keep. Membership is not required anyway.

Your choice of course.

[BailBondInvestigator]

This is not going to be a popular opinion but I have to say, has anyone ever questioned the huge marketing and money-making cash cow that ASIS has implemented under the guise of a professional "security designation"? Yes you have to read about 11 books and pass a 200+ question test but c'mon, I can see adding a degree designation beside my name but a Security organization's concocted designation? Those with a "real" degree would see this designation as laughable. Sorry to those who have undertaken to obtain the ASIS designation. I too will be expected to read the books and take the test in 2007, as my company wants me to evaluate the program. I expect to see a barrage of criticism to this comment...I have big shoulders.

No criticism here at all!! The only value in the CPP/PSP/CPI designations are the fact that they have already taken off and are considered worthy by the Executive rentacop old boy network which carries MAJOR influence. You can argue validity but not reality.

[burley]

Since my last rant about the CPP designation I thought I should post an update. I attended a CPP study group from January - April 2008 and then wrote the exam in May 2008 and passed (thank goodness). Since then I've noticed that some major job postings in Canada have required a CPP designation in addition to university degrees.

While I still believe that ASIS has developed this brilliant marketing stategy, I've found the Protection of Assets Manuals are a very good research medium for industrial security issues. And, my mgmt. seems to pay attention to my comments when I cite ASIS' standards. Soooo, I proved myself somewhat wrong.

[integrator97]

Since my last rant about the CPP designation I thought I should post an update. I attended a CPP study group from January - April 2008 and then wrote the exam in May 2008 and passed (thank goodness). Since then I've noticed that some major job postings in Canada have required a CPP designation in addition to university degrees.

While I still believe that ASIS has developed this brilliant marketing stategy, I've found the Protection of Assets Manuals are a very good research medium for industrial security issues. And, my mgmt. seems to pay attention to my comments when I cite ASIS' standards. Soooo, I proved myself somewhat wrong.

Thank you for the update and the honesty. Obviously "you will not take know for an answer" does not apply to you. :D

[cmndr]

Since my last rant about the CPP designation I thought I should post an update. I attended a CPP study group from January - April 2008 and then wrote the exam in May 2008 and passed (thank goodness). Since then I've noticed that some major job postings in Canada have required a CPP designation in addition to university degrees.

While I still believe that ASIS has developed this brilliant marketing stategy, I've found the Protection of Assets Manuals are a very good research medium for industrial security issues. And, my mgmt. seems to pay attention to my comments when I cite ASIS' standards. Soooo, I proved myself somewhat wrong.

I believe you and I were in the same group. This was held at TSM, yes? Like you, I have also noted an increase in the number of positions that require the CPP. I wrote and passed in July 2008, then I wrote and passed the PCI in November 2008 and I am going to write the PSP in April this year. While I was skeptical at first about the value of these designations, I have found that my career has taken off like a rocket since last July. We are getting more business opportunities as more and more exisiting and prospective clients are mandating that their contractors have management and field staff that hold certifications.

In fact the City of Toronto has just made CPO (IFPO) mandatory for all contracted and in-house corporate security staff, supervisory staff have to have at least the SSMP/CSSM and the Manager of Corporate Security has mandated that his management staff must also obtain one of the designations from ASIS. It is really beginning to catch on around here.

[ThrilloftheVO]

There's no question that the CPP has gained greater and greater acceptance and may eventually become a prerequisite for some jobs.

I just finished the CPP review course a couple of weeks ago and submitted my application to take the test a couple of days later. I'm still waiting to hear back from ASIS for my test date.

Wish me luck!

[FireControlman]

Well, after revisiting this thread several times, I aquired a large file of study material this afternoon as part of my first step in attaining the CPP certification. A close associate and I will more than likely set the end of this year as our deadline for this credential.

We'll see...

[SecTrainer]

On at least one of the job boards that I monitor, the number of current openings requiring any of the ASIS certs has actually dropped, but of course that could just be a momentary thing. However, I do notice that the required years of experience seems to have increased somewhat.